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To: Antoninus

It was just prior to the time it broke down the the Iroquoian policy of "You are with us or against us" came about - it was a power play designed to get the French Allies to join the Iroquois against the French, who the Iroquois disliked with a passion.

The destruction of the Neutrals was the result of that policy... The bottom line is, the Neutrals brought it all on themselves - When the (French allies) Huron were being destroyed by their Iroquois bretheren, the supposed "Neutrals" allowed the surviving Hurons to move into their villages. Stupid mistake, and even more stupid was when the Iroquois basically said "Turn them over, or else" the Neutrals chose the "or else" part... They found out exactly what "or else" meant. Sorta like the Taliban did ;0)


55 posted on 10/12/2004 11:09:12 AM PDT by Chad Fairbanks (How do you ask a hamster to be the last hamster to die for a mistake?)
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To: Chad Fairbanks
It was just prior to the time it broke down the the Iroquoian policy of "You are with us or against us" came about - it was a power play designed to get the French Allies to join the Iroquois against the French, who the Iroquois disliked with a passion.

That's not correct. The Iroquois--the Mohawks or Agnierrhonons in particular--attempted to make a separate peace with the French on several occasions, to the exclusion of the Indian allies of the French. The point was to make the French into allies of the Mohawks (like they had done with the Dutch in the Hudson valley) and then take advantage of this situation to annihilate their ancient Indian enemies in the St. Lawrence Valley. The Iroquois did not hate the French--indeed they coveted the trade which the Hurons and Algonquins had developed with the French.

Interestingly, the French governor at the time, Charles de Montmagny, didn't go for this offer of peace from the Iroquois when it was presented to him in 1642. He would not abandon his Montagnais, Huron, and Algonquin allies who were in the process of accepting the Catholic faith.

See here: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/1233755/posts

The destruction of the Neutrals was the result of that policy... The bottom line is, the Neutrals brought it all on themselves - When the (French allies) Huron were being destroyed by their Iroquois bretheren, the supposed "Neutrals" allowed the surviving Hurons to move into their villages. Stupid mistake, and even more stupid was when the Iroquois basically said "Turn them over, or else" the Neutrals chose the "or else" part... They found out exactly what "or else" meant.

Actually, the Iroquois took many of the surviving refugee Hurons into their villages too. It was not a mistake for the Neutrals to do so. And this was not the cause of the wars between the Iroquois and the Neutrals in any case. The Seneca and the Neutrals had been at dagger's points several times prior to the wholescale Iroquois attacks that eventually destroyed the Neutrals in 1652-4.

If you map the history of wars around the homeland of the Iroquios confederacy in the early to mid 1600's, the pattern is unmistakable: The Iroquois eventually fought with EVERYBODY. When they acquired a steady supply of Dutch firearms (which were not available to any of their Native enemies except the Susquehannocks, they had an insurmountable upper hand--and they used it to incredible effect. The only one of their neighbors which wasn't either destroyed or subject to the Iroquois by 1660 was the Susquehannocks--and even they were eventually beaten into submission by the combined pressure of the Iroquis and the European colonists by 1680.

If you're interested in a chronology of the Iroquois wars to 1650, here's one I made last year:

Timeline of the Iroquois Wars (1533-1650)

Enjoy!
62 posted on 10/12/2004 11:42:36 AM PDT by Antoninus (Abortion; Euthanasia; Fetal Stem Cell Research; Human Cloning; Homo Marriage - NON-NEGOTIABLE ISSUES)
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