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Confederate Flag still an issue?
eastcarolinian ^ | October 14, 2004 | Peter Kalajian

Posted on 10/19/2004 5:14:54 PM PDT by stainlessbanner

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To: bushpilot

Pass, thanks.


341 posted on 10/22/2004 2:38:40 PM PDT by Non-Sequitur (Jefferson Davis - the first 'selected, not elected' president.)
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To: 100%FEDUP
Guess what X, slavery was on the way out by the time the war started.

In retrospect perhaps, but you would be very hard pressed to find any of the southern leaders who believed that in 1861.

342 posted on 10/22/2004 2:42:11 PM PDT by Non-Sequitur (Jefferson Davis - the first 'selected, not elected' president.)
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To: stand watie
Follow the link, Watie. Look at the original transcript. Did I correctly transcribe it?

Of course, if you want to make the case that all the slave narratives are bogus, you should talk to nolu chan, since he's the one who started citing them first. Or is this yet another example of the "anything bad about yankees is true, anything bad about the south is false" habit of yours.

But hey, since I've got your attention, here's a nice little bit of genteel southern behavior:

THE MACABRE FATE OF SULLIVAN BALLOU

The disrespect paid to Major Sullivan Ballou after his death was doubtless at least partially brought on by early-war propaganda that had each side believing the other was less than human.Rhode Island Governor William Sprague stared into the empty grave with a mixture of shock and horror. Where was the body? The governor and his accompanying party had departed Washington City that March 19, 1862, morning for the old Bull Run battlefield, with the intent of retrieving the bodies of several 2nd Rhode Island officers left behind the previous summer after the Civil War's first major fight.

When they arrived, however, the remains of Major Sullivan Ballou of the 2nd Rhode Island Volunteer Infantry were nowhere to be found. Upon further investigation, Sprague discovered that Ballou's remains had been exhumed and desecrated by Confederate soldiers that winter. The morbid incident launched a congressional investigation and remains a controversy shrouded in mystery.

Sullivan Ballou has become famous in Civil War lore for the poignant letter he reportedly wrote to his wife, Sarah, a few days before he was mortally wounded. The missive was celebrated in Ken Burns' watershed PBS Civil War series and is the focal point of dozens of Web sites, though what happened to his body after he died is seldom mentioned.

Ballou was the product of a distinguished Huguenot family from Smithfield, R.I. He was born on March 28, 1829, the son of Hiram and Emeline (Bowen) Ballou. He received his formal education at the Phillips Academy of Andover, Mass., and Brown University in Providence. After graduating from Brown, Ballou taught elocution at the National Law School in Ballston, N.Y.

While there, he also studied law and was admitted to the bar of his native state in 1853. He served as clerk of the Rhode Island House of Representatives for three years and in 1857 became a member of the House and was unanimously chosen speaker.

Ballou, like many Northerners disaffected with the Whig and Democratic parties, joined the new Republican Party when it was formed in the late 1850s. Through that affiliation, he soon became closely acquainted with Governor Sprague, a wealthy mill owner who became Rhode Island's governor in 1860 at the tender age of 29, the youngest state executive in the United States.

After Civil War hostilities opened with the April 1861 bombardment of Fort Sumter, Rhode Island began to raise regiments for Federal service. On June 5, the 2nd Rhode Island was mustered into service in Providence and John Slocum was appointed its colonel, formerly having served as the major of the 1st Rhode Island. Due to his close ties to Governor Sprague, Ballou received a commission as major of the regiment.

The unit was soon sent to Washington, arriving in the capital on June 22. The 2nd was incorporated into Colonel Ambrose Burnside's brigade, and by late July it was one of the dozens of green regiments moving out of the capital as part of Maj. Gen. Irvin McDowell's army, headed for the Confederate lines along Bull Run.

McDowell's plan of attack was for a portion of his army to demonstrate in the Rebel front, while the main Union attack column swung far to the right, using narrow paths through woods and fields, crossed Bull Run and Catharpin Run at Sudley Ford and then moved around behind the Southern left flank. Burnside's brigade was combined with that of Colonel Andrew Porter to create a small division led by Colonel David Hunter that was selected to be in the van of the flanking movement. On June 21, Burnside's soldiers led the way, with the 2nd first in line followed by the 1st Rhode Island. In a reflection of early war naiveté, Governor Sprague accompanied the regiments, riding on a white horse beside Burnside and determined not to miss their moment of glory.

The march was onerous for the Yankees. The Confederates had felled trees to block the road, which in many places was just a simple woods path that became chock-full of tired, sweating bluecoats. "What a toilsome march it was through the wood!" recalled the 2nd's chaplain, Augustus Woodbury.

Finally, around 9 a.m., well behind schedule, Burnside's regiments splashed across both streams and headed south on the Manassas–Sudley Road -- but not before the men took up even more time as they slaked their thirst in the muddy waters of the fords. Five companies of the 2nd heralded the advance, spread out as skirmishers on both sides of the road. To the left of the thoroughfare the land rose to form high ground, locally called Matthews Hill, as the Matthews house stood on its slopes. While the skirmishers cautiously moved toward the summit, they received their first hostile shots in the form of a volley delivered by elements of Brig. Gen. Nathan Evans' South Carolina brigade.

Burnside quickly shifted his men to the left of the road to meet the threat, forming the balance of the 2nd in a battle line and ordering them up the hill behind the skirmishers. Sprague's soldiers shucked off their packs and blankets and ran forward, rushing "wildly and impetuously" and getting "rather mixed up," admitted Private Eben Gordon.

The disorganized but enthusiastic Rhode Islanders reached the crest of the hill recently abandoned by Evans' outnumbered skirmish line. The Carolinians, however, had not given up the field; they had only fallen back down the southern slope of the hill, and they greeted the Rhode Islanders with a blast of hot lead. One private in the 2nd remembered it as a "perfect hail storm of bullets...scattering death and confusion everywhere."

With his advance stalled, Burnside ordered up Captain William Reynolds' artillery battery -- also composed of Rhode Islanders and attached to the 2nd. The gunners moved to the summit of Matthews Hill and began blasting away while Burnside went in search of more help.

Colonel Slocum had been very active during the attack, and what he lacked in experience he made up for with courage and conspicuous leadership. He climbed atop the rail fence that ran across Matthews Hill and began waving his sword to encourage his men, but he was quickly felled with a grievous wound to the head. Privates Elisha Hunt Rhodes and Thomas Parker carried him off the field to the Matthews house, and then the colonel was evacuated by ambulance to the field hospital at Sudley Church, which was located near Sudley Ford.

Command of the regiment devolved upon Lt. Col. Frank Wheaton, and he helped Ballou to shift their line while Burnside worked to get the balance of his brigade -- the 1st Rhode Island, 71st New York and 2nd New Hampshire -- to come up. In order to better direct his men, Ballou rode his horse "Jennie" in front of his regiment and turned his back to the Confederates. At that point, a 6-pounder solid shot, probably fired by a gun of the Lynchburg Artillery, tore off his right leg, killing his horse. The stricken major was then also carried to Sudley Church, where he joined the unconscious Slocum.

The 1st Rhode Island was the initial regiment to reach the line, arriving after the 2nd and Reynolds' Battery had held off the Rebels for a half hour. Eventually, the rest of the brigade came up, and Burnside led it in a push that cleared the Rebels from the area north of the Warrenton Turnpike by about noon. The morning's fight had gone to the Federals. That afternoon, however, the battle resumed with a markedly different complexion. A Confederate counterattack put the Union troops to flight back to Washington, and the fight ended as a Southern victory.

The 2nd Rhode Island took little part in the afternoon battle, remaining in reserve and licking its wounds with Burnside's brigade. The regiment had suffered heavily: 93 of its men were killed, wounded and missing. Sprague survived the fight unharmed, though his horse was killed.

Ballou and Slocum, too badly wounded to move during the Federal retreat, were left behind in the care of army surgeons who amputated Ballou's shattered leg. Both men died, Slocum on July 23 and Ballou on the 28th. They were buried side by side just yards from Sudley Church.

In early March 1862, word reached Washington that the Confederates were abandoning their lines around Manassas to move to protect Richmond from the Army of the Potomac's advance up the peninsula. Union troops soon occupied the area, permitting Sprague and a band of 70 others to embark upon their body-recovery mission.

Privates Josiah W. Richardson, John Clark and Tristam Burgess of the 2nd assisted in the effort; they had also stayed behind at Sudley Church after the battle and had witnessed the burial of Major Ballou and Colonel Slocum. Troopers from the 1st Rhode Island Cavalry escorted the mission, and a surgeon, chaplain and two wagons filled with forage, rations and empty coffins rounded out the column.

The entourage made slow progress due to muddy roads and ever-present driving rains, and arrived at Cub Run on the eastern edge of the Bull Run battlefield on the afternoon of March 20. At that location, Captain Samuel James Smith of the 2nd Rhode Island had been killed during the retreat. As the evening grew dark, the party searched in vain along both sides of the creek without finding any sign of Smith's grave.

Disappointed at the failure to find Smith's resting place, the party pressed on to begin the search for other graves. Riding along the Warrenton Turnpike during stormy weather on the morning of March 21, the column arrived at Bull Run to discover that the stone bridge had been blown up by the withdrawing Confederates. Near its ruins the group examined a skeleton leaning against a tree, before they rode north and forded Bull Run and Catharpin Run.

They continued on to Sudley Church. Now abandoned and polluted with the remnants of war, the church stood with its door ajar, and several of the troopers stopped to investigate the structure. A few even rode their horses inside and up to the pulpit. Sprague instructed Private Richardson to lead the band of grave hunters to the spot near the churchyard where the Rhode Islanders were buried.

Richardson did so, pointing out two mounds that he claimed were where Colonel Slocum and Major Ballou had been buried. Soldiers began to dig amid the thickets of huckleberry bushes, the still graveyard echoing with the sound of shovels as the men went about their morose task.

Under the direction of Walter Coleman, Sprague's secretary, the assemblage commenced with the exhumation of Slocum and Ballou. Just then a young black girl, full of curiosity, made her way from a nearby cabin to investigate. She approached the diggers and inquired if they were looking for "Kunnel Slogun"? If so, she said, they were too late and would not find him.

She went on to recite a chilling tale, claiming that a number of men from the 21st Georgia Regiment had robbed the grave several weeks prior. They had dug up Slocum, severed his head from his body and burned the mutilated corpse in an attempt the remove the flesh and procure the bones and skull as trophies. His coffin had been thrown into the creek, only to be later used in another burial.

Horrified, Sprague demanded to see evidence of such an atrocity. Followed by most of the anxious but skeptical group, he accompanied the girl as she led them to a nearby hollow, where they found a heap of charred embers along the bank of the creek. The ash was still gray, denoting that it was only a few weeks old. There they found what appeared to be bones. Upon closer inspection, Surgeon James B. Greeley of the 1st Rhode Island Cavalry identified a human femur, vertebrae and portions of pelvic bones. Nearby they found a soiled blanket with large tufts of human hair folded inside.

As the troopers carefully collected the terrible evidence, one noticed a white object in the branches of a tree along the creek bank. A horse soldier waded into the stream and recovered two shirts, one a silk and the other a striped calico, both buttoned at the collar and unbuttoned at the sleeves. The circumstantial evidence seemed to concur with what the little girl had told Sprague, and it seemed even more plausible when Greeley did not locate a human skull or teeth with the other remains.

To add to an already confused, strange situation, Sprague insisted that he recognized both shirts as having belonged to Major Ballou -- not to Slocum. Private Richardson, who had nursed Ballou in his last moments a week after the battle, concurred. With the identity of the beheaded body now in question, the anxious group rushed back to the gravesite. The troopers still had not found anything in the first grave. To probe for a solid object, Greeley suggested running a saber blade deeper into the ground. One was handed forward and thrust into the soft, mud-soaked soil. Driven almost to the hilt, it met with no resistance. The grave was empty.

The same tactic was applied to the other grave, but with different results, as a hard object was soon struck. Several cavalrymen began to dig, and they uncovered a rectangular box buried no more than 3 feet deep. The box was pulled from the grave, and the lid was pried off to reveal the body of 37-year-old John Slocum, rolled up in a blanket. Easily identifiable by his distinctive red, bushy mustache, Slocum's remains were surprisingly intact. It now appeared that the missing body was that of Ballou.

To gather further evidence, Sprague, in company with his aide and Lt. Col. Willard Sayles of the 1st Rhode Island Cavalry, went to the homes of nearby residents. In the process they met a 14-year-old boy who claimed to have witnessed the awful deed, and verified that it was soldiers from the 21st Georgia Infantry who had carried it out. The boy went on to reveal that the plot was premeditated, and that the Georgians had planned it for several days. He also claimed that the Rebels tried to burn the corpse, but had to prematurely dowse the fire because of the horrible stench it emitted. A farmer by the name of Newman confirmed the boy's story, contending that no Virginian would have done such a thing and that those responsible were from a Georgia regiment.

Sprague also talked to a woman who had nursed the wounded at Sudley Church after the battle. She claimed that she had pleaded with the Georgians to leave the dead at peace. Unable to persuade them, she had saved a lock of hair cut from Ballou's head, in the hopes that someday someone might come to claim the body. Colonel Coleman took the lock of hair, promising he would return it to Ballou's wife.

The rationale for such a desecration did not come from the battle. The 8th Georgia Infantry was the only regiment from that state that may have come into contact with the 2nd Rhode Island, and the 21st Georgia did not arrive at Manassas until after the battle, staying in winter quarters in the neighborhood of Sudley Church.

Perhaps the men of the 21st saw their actions as a misguided attempt to revenge the 8th Georgia's losses at the hand of the 2nd. While in search of Slocum they uncovered both graves -- Slocum in a simple box and Ballou in a coffin. Thinking the commanding officer must be buried in the coffin, they inadvertently mutilated the body of Ballou -- not Slocum.

As darkness began to set in, Governor Sprague suggested they continue with the original aim of the expedition and search for the body of Captain Levi Tower, another 2nd Rhode Island officer mortally wounded at the battle. By candlelight, Private Clark, who had witnessed Tower's burial, led the way. In the side yard of the bullet-scarred Matthews house Clark located the mass grave in which Tower was buried. The evening had grown too dark, however, to begin digging, and the party elected to continue the next morning. Seventeen men crowded into the Matthews' parlor for the night, the same room to which John Slocum had been carried following his mortal wounding. With saddles for pillows, the lucky 17 slept by the heat of the fireplace while the rest of the party remained outside, suffering through a drizzly night.

At first light, Sprague and Greeley ventured into a nearby field to investigate the skeletal remains of a horse, which Sprague supposedly recognized as one that had been shot out from under him during the battle. Meanwhile back at the house, the exhumation of Levi Tower was underway. The mass grave revealed eight bodies, including Tower's. Strangely, all of the men were found buried face down and barefooted, together with an unexploded shell, considered a blatant sign of disrespect by all present.

As the Federals dug away, a growing number of irregularly clad men had begun to gather on a nearby ridge. Fearing an ambush by guerrillas, the officers elected to return to Washington. The corpses were loaded into the wagons. Slocum's and Tower's remains had been placed in pine coffins, each marked with the appropriate name and date of disinterment. Ballou's casket was filled only with charred ash, bone, the blanket that contained his tufts of hair and the two recovered shirts. After collecting souvenirs from the area, the troopers mounted and the party departed Bull Run with a greater sense of the terrible realities of war.

On the afternoon of March 28, the bodies of Slocum, Ballou and Tower arrived in New York City. The 71st New York State Militia escorted the hearses through Manhattan and down Broadway to the Astor House, where the coffins lay in state. To watch the procession, onlookers crowded windows, balconies and the rooftop of Barnum's Museum.

Four days later, on a gray and stormy March 31, the remains of the three soldiers were reburied in Providence. Business was suspended, streets were draped in mourning and flags flew at half-mast. A grand procession of some 34 military units made its way down to Swan Point Cemetery. There, volleys of musketry were delivered amid the clap of thunder and tolling of bells. The three sons of Rhode Island had finally been properly laid to rest.

Governor Sprague, outraged by what had happened to Ballou, addressed the U.S. Congress' Committee on the Conduct of the War on April 1, 1862. He reported, in detail, the horrible findings of the expedition. The committee launched an official inquiry into the matter, with the chief aim of the investigation being to resolve "whether the Indian savages have been employed by the rebels, in their military service, against the Government of the United States, and how such warfare has been conducted by said savages." At some point, the theory had been introduced that somehow Indians in the employ of the Confederacy committed the deeds, reflecting white 19th-century Americans' view of Indians as much as anything suggested by concrete evidence. Nothing came of that accusation, but the story was picked up and sensationalized by the Northern press, appearing in The New York Times and the Providence Daily Journal.

The congressional committee's investigation unearthed further testimony of grave desecration. A local Manassas woman, Mrs. Pierce Butler, testified that she had witnessed several instances of unidentified Confederates exhuming bodies with the intention of boiling off the remaining skin and removing the bones as relics. Butler even claimed to have heard one soldier of New Orleans' Washington Artillery boast as he carried off a dug-up skull that he intended to "drink a brandy punch out of it the day he was married." On April 30 the committee officially concluded that soldiers of the Confederate Army had indeed performed such actions after the First Battle of Bull Run.

The actual truth in the case may never be known, as it is possible that those interviewed by the government simply stated what they thought would keep them out of trouble. It is indisputable, however, that Ballou's body was desecrated, and that Confederate soldiers likely did the deed hoping that they were actually abusing the corpse of a Union colonel. The 21st Georgia was singled out and blamed, though other regiments also camped in the vicinity and could have committed the act. If the Georgians did the deed, it would be a noticeable blemish on what was otherwise a long and commendable war record, as the regiment saw action in most of the Eastern theater's battles after Bull Run.

The 2nd Rhode Island honored its dead commander when it constructed one of the forts that protected Washington and named it Fort Slocum. Today, the location is known as Fort Slocum Park, near Kansas Avenue in the northeast section of the District of Columbia. Present-day city dwellers often make their way to the former bastion. It is likely that few who visit the park know the history behind its name.

Many more people -- or at least those interested in the Civil War -- do know about Sullivan Ballou because of the famous letter attributed to him that has been reprinted numerous times. That the remains of the man who supposedly penned the sad missive were treated in such a crude manner after his death presents an unbelievable irony and symbolizes the tragedy and horror of any war.

http://www.historynet.com/acw/blsullivan_ballou/

343 posted on 10/22/2004 2:52:19 PM PDT by Heyworth
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To: wardaddy; WKB; bourbon; dixiechick2000

But for our beloved South,
we'd have democrat presidents
and congresses.

History is history.
I don't want it sugar-coated or distorted.

Right now, (and I mean this IN GENERAL.. as in Kerry states) look North to Massachusetts, New York,
and Illinois,...

now were another Civil War to start, I'd be with the South
against those damn Yankees. And y'all would too.


344 posted on 10/22/2004 2:59:05 PM PDT by onyx (John "F" Kerry deserves to be the final casualty of the Vietnam War - Re-elect Bush/Cheney)
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To: stand watie
complaining about such silliness as whether the spell-checker on FR works

So let me see if I understand this correctly. I mistakenly attribute a Shakespeare quote from one of his tragedies to another and I'm dumb, but you consistently misspell "original," which is about a 4th grade level word and it's the fault of the spell-checker. What's especially interesting is that last week someone pointed it out and you apologized, again blaming it on the spell check. Are you incapable of learning anything? If someone points out a consistent mistake that you make, are you incapable of correcting yourself?

Yeah, I confused Mosby and Forrest, Lear and Macbeth. I've accepted the corrections and haven't made the mistakes again. What do you do when corrected? Shift the blame to the spell checker and continue to make the mistake.

Hey, do you need Dr. Lubar's e-mail?

345 posted on 10/22/2004 3:00:13 PM PDT by Heyworth
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To: onyx

Big Amen.


Are you watching the Sinclair broadcast tonight?


346 posted on 10/22/2004 3:04:14 PM PDT by wardaddy
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Comment #347 Removed by Moderator

To: wardaddy

No, I don't get it here, but
I just watched it on line here:

http://www.buttondepress.com/BostonManifesto/stolenhonor.wmv


348 posted on 10/22/2004 3:07:54 PM PDT by onyx (John "F" Kerry deserves to be the final casualty of the Vietnam War - Re-elect Bush/Cheney)
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To: wardaddy

Did you get the HAPPY news from bourbon?
I did, just now.


349 posted on 10/22/2004 3:09:01 PM PDT by onyx (John "F" Kerry deserves to be the final casualty of the Vietnam War - Re-elect Bush/Cheney)
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To: bushpilot
Would a farmer burn his tractor?

Are you going to argue that slaves were never killed? Have it it. But here's another passage:" If a young buck killed a slave, his family was liable for the value of the slave, not the slave's life. Killing a free black was probably cheaper. When a slave murdered a white, he could be burnt at the stake. This happened not once, but at Knoxville, New Orleans, and other places. The judiciary was present among the executioners; it can't be excused by calling it a lynch mob: it was official."
http://www.du.edu/~jcalvert/hist/south.htm

But as for the passage in question, I accurately transcribed the text of the narrative. It's there for you to see. Like I said to Watie, if you want to argue that the narrative is fraudulent, take it to nolu chan. He's the one who cited it first.

350 posted on 10/22/2004 3:26:16 PM PDT by Heyworth
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Comment #351 Removed by Moderator

Comment #352 Removed by Moderator

To: bushpilot

What are you talking about?


353 posted on 10/22/2004 3:53:26 PM PDT by Heyworth
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Comment #354 Removed by Moderator

Comment #355 Removed by Moderator

To: elephant
I certainly do give a dam about what you think after your remarks.

That's really sweet. Thank you for caring enough to share that with me.

Please, however, do not mistake that this reply in any way means I care at all what you think about anything. I sense hostility but I could be wrong. If it is a sincere desire to learn, from me, things which have escaped you until now, then by all means, ask away.

You do give a damn about what I think? About what I think about what?

Are you so enamored by me that you would be happy to know what I think about frozen waffles? About Christ? About your momma? I'll be happy to give you the crumbs of my vast wisdom if you will focus just a tiny bit more. If you can.

356 posted on 10/22/2004 4:03:38 PM PDT by Do Be (The heart is smarter than the head.)
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To: bushpilot
CHAPTER XXVII SLAVE-BURNING, OR THE "BARBARISM OF SLAVERY."

We often hear pathetic appeals for money to send missionaries to the heathen, who burn widows on funeral piles, or throw their children into the Ganges; but the suttee was long since abolished in India; and so far as we know there is but one place on earth where human beings are burned alive. That place is the Slave States of America!

The following is from the St. Louis Democrat of July 20, 1859; it relates to a slave-burning that had recently taken place at Marshall, Missouri:

The negro was stripped to his waist, and barefooted. He looked the picture of despair; but there was no sympathy felt for him at the moment.

Presently, the fire began to surge up in flames around him, and its effects were soon made visible in the futile attempts of the poor wretch to move his feet. As the flames gathered about his limbs and body, he commenced the most frantic shrieks, and appeals for mercy, for death, for water. He seized his chains; they were hot, and burned the flesh off his hands. He would drop them and catch at them again and again. Then he would repeat his cries; but all to no purpose. In a few moments he was a charred mass, bones and flesh alike burned into a powder."

Read also the following description of a similar scene in Mississippi, from the Natchez Free Trader, 1858:

"The victim was chained to a tree, faggots were placed around him, while he showed the greatest indifference. When the chivalry had arranged the pile, in reply to a question, if he had any thing to say, he is reported to have warned all slaves to take example by him, and asked the prayers of those around. He then asked for a drink of water, and after quaffing it said, "Now set fire, I am ready to go in peace." When the flames began to burn him, in his agony he showed gigantic strength, and actually forced the staple from the tree, and bounded from the burning mass. But he instantly fell pierced with rifle balls, and then his body was thrown into the flames and consumed, to show that no such being had ever existed. Nearly four thousand slaves from the neighboring plantations were present as at a moral lesson written in characters of hell fire. Numerous speeches were made by the magistrates and ministers of religion (facetiously so called) to the slaves, warning them that the same fate awaited them if they proved rebellious to their owners."

Read also the following, taken from the Alton (Ill.) Telegraph of April 30, 1836; it is part of an account of a slave-burning published in that paper under that date:

"All was silent as death when the executioners were piling wood around their victim. He said not a word, until feeling that the flames had seized upon him. He then uttered an awful howl, attempting to sing and pray, then hung his head, and suffered in silence, except in the following instance: After the flames had surrounded their prey, his eyes burned out of his head, and his mouth seemingly parched to a cinder, some one in the crowd, more compassionate than the rest, proposed to put an end to his misery by shooting him, when it was replied, 'that it would be of no use, since he was already out of pain.' 'No, no,' said the wretch, 'I am not, I am suffering as much as ever; shoot me, shoot me.' 'No, no,' said one of the fiends who was standing about the sacrifice they were roasting, 'he shall not be shot. I would sooner slacken the fire, if that would increase his misery ;' and the man who said this was, as we understand, an officer of justice.

"If any one wishes evidence of other negroes being burned in the State of Missouri, I can furnish it--evidence of the burning of eight negroes within the last ten years, and innumerable instances of negroes being burned throughout the Slave States.Gilbert J. Greene .

" Tarrytown, N.Y., August 21, 1860."

Some time in the early part of 1860, Mr. Davis, of Mississippi, publicly denied that slaves were ever burned alive at the South. This denial led to the collection of quite an amount of testimony upon the subject, most of which was published in the New York Tribune. We subjoin a few of these testimonies:

The editor of Hayneville (Ala.), Chronicle very justly observes:

"It is questionable whether burning negroes by whites has any better effect than to brutalize the feeling of a community. Several have already been burned in Montgomery County, without, it, seems, decreasing crime among them."

Here it is stated by an Alabama editor that "several" negroes have already been burned in Montgomery County. Several in a single county

Our next witness is a Mr. Poe, a native of Richmond, Va., and afterward a resident of Hamilton County, Ohio, where he was a highly respected ruling elder in the Presbyterian Church. In a letter written about twenty years since, upon the subject of slavery, he says: "In Goochland County, Virginia, an overseer tied a slave to a tree, flogged him again and again with great severity, then piled brush around him, set it on fire, and burned him to death. The overseer was tried and imprisoned. The whole transaction may be found on the records of the court."

The late John Parrish, of Philadelphia, an eminent minister of the Society of Friends, traveled through the Slave States on a religious mission, early in this century, and on his return published a pamphlet entitled "Remarks on the Slavery of the Black People." Among other instances of cruel punishment, he states that a slave "was burned to death at a stake in Charleston, surrounded by a multitude of spectators, some of whom were people of the first rank; ... the poor object was heard to cry, as long as he could breathe, 'not guilty--not guilty!'"

In the year 1836, a man of color was arrested in St. Louis for some offense, but was rescued by one Mackintosh, a free man of color, a steward on board a steamboat. On his way to the jail, in order to effect his escape, he stabbed and killed one of his captors. The wife and children of the murdered man excited the rage of the people by their lamentations, the jail was surrounded, the murderer demanded, and given up. He was led into the woods, on the then outskirts of the city, but near the spot where the court-house was afterward built, brush wood and green wood was piled about him, and fire set to the heap, in presence of a concourse of two or three thousand of the citizens of St. Louis. The poor wretch was from twenty minutes to half an hour in dying, during which he was praying or singing hymns in a calm voice. When his legs were consumed, the trunk disappeared in the blazing pile. "There," said a bystander, "it is over with him; he does not feel any more now." "Yes, I do," answered a steady voice from out of the flames.

A correspondent of the Cincinnati Herald , in July, 1845, writes to that paper that, not long before, some slaves near Oakland Cottage, Mississippi, were emancipated by the will of their master. For some reason the will was not carried out, and the slaves, exasperated by the delay, and fearful of being cheated out of the property in themselves, left them by their master, set on fire the house of the overseer, and a white child was lost in the flames. The incendiaries, eight or nine in number, were seized by the neighbors, and two of them immediately hanged. The rest were confined in a log-house, and chained to the floor. A torch was then put to the building, and the miserable creatures roasted by a slow fire, while the air was rent with their cries.

"I have just received," writes a correspondent of the N.O. Picayune, at Jackson, Mississippi, on the 25th of December, 1855, "the particulars of a most horrid affair just transpired at Lexington, in this State. A young lady of the neighborhood was assaulted, on a lonely road, by a slave, who attempted to violate her person. She was rescued, however, before he had as complished his purpose, and after being deposited in a place of safety, the alarm was raised, and a hunt for the negro who had fled, was instituted. He was soon found, and execution was speedy. He was taken into Lexington, chained to a stake, as burned alive.

The Montgomery (Ala.) Mail of April 3, 1856, says, "We learn that the negro who murdered Mr. Capeheart, was burned to death yesterday at Mount Meigs. He acknowledge himself guilty."

The Union Springs (Ala.) Gazette of the 23d of December, 1858, gives the particulars of the murder of a Mr. J. by his slave-boy Mitford. He had been whipped, and chained up from Saturday to Monday, and, when released by his master, seized an axe and killed him. The negro made no attempt to escape, and no resistance when taken. A public meeting was called on Wednesday to consider the case, and, by a unanimous vote of the assembly, it was resolved to burn him alive. "That evening," continues the Gazette, "at three o'clock, in the presence of five hundred persons, he was chained to a tree and burned."

They closed their pleasant Christmas holidays of 1858 in the same way in Troy, Ky. On the first day of last year, 1859m at the annual negro sales at Troy, Mr. James Calaway, the brother-in-law of one Simon B. Thornhill, who, it seems, had been murdered by a slave in revenge for some punishment, mounted a box in the street, and exhorted the people to do speedy justice upon the murderer, and closed by saying, "All that feel as I do, will follow me." Eight hundred or a thousand followed him. They went to the jail, took out the prisoner, and in the jail-yard itself, drove down a stake, to which they chained him hand and feet. Fine split wood was piled around him, and he was miserably burned to death. "He gave," says a correspondent of the Maysville (Ky.) Eagle, "some of the most hideous dreams I ever heard come from any human being."

The Vicksburg Sun of Saturday, March 31, 1860, says that a negro man belonging to Mr. Woodfolk, on Deer Creek, was brutally burned at the stake for the murder of a negro woman. All the negroes on that and the adjoining plantations witnessed the burning. "His fate was decreed by a council of highly reiable gentlemen."

In 1856, Dr. Parsons, of Boston, a gentleman of unquestionable character, published a little work of travels at the South. He copies from the Sumter (Ala.) Whig an account of a recent burning of a slave in that county. "Dave," the slave, belonged to James D. Thornton, was accused of having murdered a daughter of his mistress, and, after his arrest, confessed his guilt. Thornton and his friends took him from the jail by a stratagem, and bore him off in triumph. "They left in high glee," says the Whig, and carried their prisoner to the appointed place of sacrifice. Here he was "tied to a stake, with fat light wood piled around him, and the torch was applied in the presence of two thousand persons, who had met there to witness the novel scene." There were, it seems, some rumors afloat, that "Dave" was tortured, but these, the Whig declares, were "entirely untrue." So, burning men alive is not torture in Alabama. An inquiring mind, which is not sensitive, might seek to know what is.

Dr. Parsons gives another instance which occurred not long before his visit in Georgia, the particulars of which he received from eye-witnesses. A slave had received from his mistress some punishment of great severity, when he seized a hatchet, and, as he supposed, killed her, though she afterward recovered. On committing the deed, he ran at once to the court-house and surrendered himself to justice. Justice in civilized countries would have been hanging. In Georgia, it was this: The slave was given to the mob, who first gave him fifty lashes a day for five days to prepare him for what was to follow. On the following Sunday, he was taken from the jail, and suspended, naked, by his two hands, from the limp of a large oak-tree near the court-house. A fire made of hard-pine shavings was kindled beneath him, and "then the clear bright flames quickly ascended, curling about the limbs, encircling the body, scorching the nerves, crushing the fibers, charring the flesh--and, in mortal anguish, he was (in the words of an eye-witness) 'sweating as it were, great drops of blood.'" But before life was entirely extinguished, the lungs, the heart, the liver, were cut and torn from the body, with knives fastened upon poles, and with these quivering organs elevated above the crowd, the executioners shouted, "So shall it be done to the slave that murders his mistress!"

On the 7th of January, 1857, three years ago, Mr. John Kingsley, of Portsmouth, Ohio, wrote to the Antislavery Standard of this city that he was the week before in Carter County, Ky., where he saw a negro tied to a stake, a pile of dry wood heaped about him, and set on fire. The man belonged to one Wm. McMinnis, of that county, and was suspected of planning an insurrection. He was first whipped, 200 lashes, but denied his guilt. Fire was then tried, and, though not burned to death, he died next day. Mr. Kingsley, unable to remain and witness the sufferings of the agonized creature, road away and attempted to excite the neighbors to a rescue; he was told to mind his own business.

Big Rapids , Mecosta Co., Mich.,

March 28, 1860.

* * * In the township of Extra, in Ashley County, Arkansas, the discovery was made, that a widow named Hill, and a slave woman, belonging to J.L.M--,Esq., who lived with her, had been murdered, and the house burned to conceal the deed. The alarm soon spread, and an investigation was instituted by Mr. M--, in connection with many of the leading citizens. Suspicion fell upon a slave named Ike, belonging to a man named Perdue. Ike was whipped nearly to death, in order to extort from him a confession, but he persisted in denying any knowledge of the affair. Mr. M--then poured upon his bleeding back spirits of turpentine, and set it on fire! Ike then confessed that he and a negro named Jack, belonging to J.F. Norrell, were hired by one Miller to assist in performing the deed. One fact, however, greatly invalidated this testimony, and that was, that Mr. M--and Mr. Norrell were deadly enemies, and Ike must have known that nothing could have pleased Mr. M--more than to convict Jack, thus subjecting his most bitter enemy to a loss of a favorite slave, worth twelve or fifteen hundred dollars. Jack was, however, immediately arrested and brought before the regulators, and certain circumstances seeming in some degree to corroborate Ike's statement, stakes were driven into the ground, and the two slaves chained to them. A large quantity of fat pine was piled around them and J.L.M--set it on fire! In a few minutes, nothing but charred and blackened corpses remained. A subscription, was circulated to indemnify the owners for their losses.

Mr. Norrell told me that when the flames were rising ten feet above Jack's head, he said to the dying slave, "I have raised you, Jack, and I never caught you in a lie. You are going to die! nothing can save you; and now, tell me truly, as you hope for heaven, are you guilty?" Jack answered from the flames, "Master, I don't know any more about it than you do." Mr. Norrell and all his family believed Jack to have been innocent, and shed tears as they spoke of him.

The act of burning turpentine upon the lacerated back, I had from the lips of Mr. M--himself, who rather boasted of his ingenuity in thus eliciting testimony when ordinary means had failed.

I have given true names and can give the names of more than one hundred men in the vicinity, and I am ready at any time to make affidavit to what I have stated.Corydon E. Fuller.

Such is the barbarism of slavery. And let no man say that these "evils" of slavery are no part of the system, and not justly chargeable to it. As well may we expect drunkenness without broils and litigation, and idleness and destitution, as to expect to hold men and women in slavery without scourgings, and thumb-screws, and murder, and almost every species of torture.

God never made a man to be a slave, and no measure of cruelty can reduce an immortal spirit, made in the image of God, to entire submission to life-long bondage. Hence, while slavery exists, chains, and thumb-screws, and slave-maiming, and slave-burnings must exist, as the only means by which one race can be kept in a state of even partial submission to another. And even with all these terrors before them, the wonder is that the slaves do not arise, and assert their freedom at all hazards. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ http://digilib.nypl.org/dynaweb/digs/wwm97258/@Generic__BookTextView/2379

357 posted on 10/22/2004 4:09:39 PM PDT by Heyworth
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To: bushpilot
No, they were hanged. Except Giles Corey, who was pressed to death because he wouldn't confess

Are you trying to frame the argument that no one was ever burned at the stake in America? Check out the fate of the the alleged plotters of the attempted slave rebellion in New York in 1741.

"More weight!"

358 posted on 10/22/2004 4:14:22 PM PDT by Heyworth
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To: onyx; bourbon

Just got in from a lite flat jog.....getting ready for the Sinclair broadcast.


Bourbon!

Irish twins....just like my daughters...

You go dawg(as in horn).

Would that I was a bit younger wealthier and that my 4 year old was not such a handful....I'd have 10 children.

I love when good folks have loads of beebies.


359 posted on 10/22/2004 4:53:35 PM PDT by wardaddy (handmaidens for everyone!)
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To: stainlessbanner

Hey Peter...no one gives a sh*t if YOU are offended or you think anyone else is offended.

Personally, all these thin-skinned PC jerks offend the hell out of me with their constant whining.

I'll say it again - I DON'T GIVE A RAT'S ASS IF YOU ARE OFFENDED. IF YOU DON'T LIKE TO BE OFFENDED - MOVE!


360 posted on 10/22/2004 4:59:42 PM PDT by Fledermaus (Kerry is a Nuanced Nuisance!)
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