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Tension rises as China scours the globe for energy
The Telegraph ^ | 19/11/2004 | Richard Spencer

Posted on 11/19/2004 7:34:07 PM PST by demlosers

China's insatiable demand for energy is prompting fears of financial and diplomatic collisions around the globe as it seeks reliable supplies of oil from as far away as Brazil and Sudan.

An intrusion into Japanese territorial waters by a Chinese nuclear submarine last week and a trade deal with Brazil are the latest apparently unconnected consequences of China's soaring economic growth.

The connection, however, lies in an order issued last year by President Hu Jintao to seek secure oil supplies abroad – preferably ones which could not be stopped by America in case of conflict over Taiwan.

The submarine incident was put down to a "technical error" by the Chinese government, which apologised to Japan.

But even before the incident the People's Daily, the government mouthpiece, had commented that competition over the East China Sea between the two countries was "only a prelude of the game between China and Japan in the arena of international energy".

The Brazil trade deal included funding for a joint oil-drilling and pipeline programme at a cost that experts said would add up to three times the cost of simply buying oil on the market.

The West, however, has paid little attention to these developments. For the United States and Europe are far more concerned with the even more sensitive issues of China's relations with "pariah states".

In September, China threatened to veto any move to impose sanctions on Sudan over the atrocities in Darfur. It has invested $3 billion in the African country's oil industry, which supplies it with seven per cent of its needs.

Then, this month, it said that it opposed moves to refer Iran's nuclear stand-off with the International Atomic Energy Agency to the United Nations Security Council.

A week before, China's second biggest state oil firm had signed a $70 billion deal for oilfield and natural gas development with Iran, which already supplies 13 per cent of China's needs.

China has its own reserves of oil and natural gas and once was a net oil exporter. But as its economy has expanded by an average of nine per cent per year for the last two decades, so has its demand for energy.

This year it overtook Japan as the world's second largest consumer of energy, behind the US.

Its projected demand, boosted by a huge rise in car ownership as well as the need to find alternatives to polluting coal for electricity generation, has contributed to the surge in the price of oil this year. Shortages are already leading to power cuts in the big cities.

Since President Hu ordered state-owned oil firms to "go abroad" to ensure supply, they have begun drilling for gas in the East China Sea, just west of the line that Japan regards as its border.

Japan protested, to no avail, that the project should be a joint one.

The two are also set to clash over Russia's oil wealth. China is furious that Japan has outbid it in their battle to determine the route of the pipeline that Russia intends to build to the Far East.

Japan favoured a route to the sea, enabling oil to be shipped to both Japan and China. China wanted an overland route through its own territory, which would give it ultimate control if hostilities broke out.

Increasingly, analysts are saying that China's efforts have gone beyond what is safe or even in its own interests.

Claude Mandil, the executive director of the International Energy Agency in Paris, said the reserves in the East China Sea were hardly worth the trouble.

"Nobody thinks that there will be a lot of oil and gas in this part of the world," he said.

"It may be a difficult political issue but I don't think the energy content is worthwhile."

Eurasia Group, a New York-based firm of political analysts, said its oil experts worked out that China was paying such an inflated price for its investment in Brazil that the cost for the oil it ended up with was three times the market price.

"If China's economy falters, which, in my view, appears increasingly likely, then commodity prices will plummet, and with them, the value of the assets that produce them," Jason Kindopp, Eurasia's lead China analyst, said.

"Beijing may end up in a early 1990s Japan situation, where it is forced to sell recently purchased overseas assets for a fraction of what it paid for them."

China's wider aggression to secure oil and gas was the greatest threat to its international standing in the next decade.

"Sudan is the primary example," he said.

"It marks the first time in recent years that China has promised to wield its veto power in the UN Security Council against a petition initiated by the United States and backed by France and Great Britain."


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Extended News; Foreign Affairs
KEYWORDS: anwr; china; energy; mexico; napalminthemorning; opec; sudan; venezuela; wot
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1 posted on 11/19/2004 7:34:07 PM PST by demlosers
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To: demlosers
"The submarine incident was put down to a "technical error" by the Chinese government, which apologised to Japan."


At least they apologized. That's the important thing.

:^?
2 posted on 11/19/2004 7:39:50 PM PST by spinestein (I'm not a journalist, but I play one on TV -Dan Rather)
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To: demlosers

I wonder what China has in mind for the long haul...


3 posted on 11/19/2004 7:40:08 PM PST by cynicom (<p)
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To: demlosers
Gee, Isn't Wal-mart Great!
4 posted on 11/19/2004 7:41:50 PM PST by investigateworld (( ......Hey Kerry, how did you like them apples?....))
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To: investigateworld

Unintended Consequences in the quest for ever-lower wage rates: China goes from a sleepy agricultural economy to an industrial giant, benefitting 1000 executives in 100 U.S. companies. But now they are competing for energy, which increases the price. You can add steel and aluminum to the list. Before long, prices will go back up to where they were when Americans were making the products, but the market will still be controlled by Chinese. And the benefit is...?


5 posted on 11/19/2004 8:12:14 PM PST by henderson field
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To: demlosers

PRC signed an agreement with Argentina last few days. I'll get the FR link in a second.


6 posted on 11/19/2004 8:16:24 PM PST by Lokibob (All typos and spelling errors are mine and copyrighted!!!!)
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To: demlosers

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1281756/posts


7 posted on 11/19/2004 8:18:54 PM PST by Lokibob (All typos and spelling errors are mine and copyrighted!!!!)
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To: henderson field
My point exactly!
I pray that "free traders" are right, but I suspect OUR craving for "cheap goodies" is going to bite us hard in the long run.
Of course if your thinking long run, you don't threaten to nuke a major city in the nation that buys the majority of your output. (Now dressing in the flame retardant suit.)
8 posted on 11/19/2004 8:21:07 PM PST by investigateworld (( ......Hey Kerry, how did you like them apples?....))
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To: investigateworld

That really is logical thinking, however, when has the PRC EVER been logical?


9 posted on 11/19/2004 8:22:25 PM PST by Lokibob (All typos and spelling errors are mine and copyrighted!!!!)
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To: Lokibob
Having had the chance to chat with a couple of their "businessmen" on a very long flight, after their 4th or so free drink, they really opened up.
I found them to be racist to the max and having very long memories. Having had a pub-lick skool education, I knew nothing about the Boxer rebellion or the consequences to China after. Lordy, those people have an attitude! And we did cr@p on them. Tie that into their "face" mentality I think we are on the USS Heap-O-Trouble.
10 posted on 11/19/2004 8:34:23 PM PST by investigateworld (( ......Hey Kerry, how did you like them apples?....))
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To: demlosers
The connection, however, lies in an order issued last year by President Hu Jintao to seek secure oil supplies abroad – preferably ones which could not be stopped by America in case of conflict over Taiwan.

There are no secure oil supplies abroad that America could not interdict.

China is an enemy of America. It bears remembering.

11 posted on 11/19/2004 8:56:40 PM PST by snarks_when_bored
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To: henderson field
You are right about the steel. We are shopping for a new refrigerator and all we see are stainless steel fronts and ugly black sides. Or faux finishes meant to evoke stainless steel. Where's all the steel going? See the WSJ Nov. 6 article below. (life is tough!)

Steel yourself for price of stainless

By Paul Glader, The Wall Street Journal

The stainless-steel kitchen is getting pricier, as rising wholesale stainless prices boost the cost of refrigerators, stoves and other appliances.

The price of stainless steel has risen as much as 60 percent in the past year, reflecting a shortage worldwide due in large part to demand for the metal in fast-growing China.

Paul Leuthe, corporate marketing manager for Madison, Wis.-based Sub-Zero, says metal prices are driving up the company's costs.

To lure cost-conscious customers, some appliance makers are introducing similar-looking products made with cheaper materials, from aluminum to lower-grade steel painted in colors like "meteorite," and even plastic that looks like stainless steel. Others are including less stainless in their products. Meanwhile, to justify the premium prices of the real thing, some retailers are aiming to make better grades of stainless a selling point, the way bedding makers pitch 400-thread-count sheets.

The goal: to keep the lucrative stainless-kitchen craze going. The stainless look has been a huge boon for appliance makers, becoming a staple of high-end kitchens in recent years. Stainless steel, which consists of traditional carbon steel mixed with at least 11 percent chromium and often nickel, is shinier than traditional steel, doesn't corrode as easily and has a neutral hue that easily matches floors, cupboards and walls.

Kitchen designer Boffi says 25 percent of the kitchens the company does are either completely stainless or have a large percentage of products and materials in stainless.

As an appliance metal, stainless isn't without its flaws: It smudges and can be prone to scratch marks. Moreover, stainless isn't magnetic, which means parents can't easily put drawings, notes or photos on the front of their refrigerator.

With the economy showing signs of improvement, demand for stainless-steel appliances remains strong, despite the higher prices. Sales of major home kitchen appliances are up about 30 percent this year from 2001 levels, according to the Association of Home Appliance Manufacturers.

To convince shoppers that the real thing is worth paying for, some industry observers expect companies to begin trying to increase awareness of stainless-steel grades. The idea is for consumers to discuss the nickel count of their refrigerator over cocktails, just as they do bed-sheet thread counts.

Stainless steel comes in varying degrees of nickel content and other alloying materials. At this point, retailers outside of the restaurant-products industry don't promote the distinction, except in cookware and the occasional range hood or work table.


12 posted on 11/19/2004 8:58:47 PM PST by ProtectOurFreedom
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To: demlosers

Bump ... This needs to be read by everyone ... especially
the brilliant minds at CATO.


13 posted on 11/19/2004 9:29:46 PM PST by the_gospel_of_thomas (Know your Enemy and Know yourself)
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To: the_gospel_of_thomas

Bump.


14 posted on 11/19/2004 10:29:35 PM PST by hedgetrimmer
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To: Shermy; Allan

Ping.


15 posted on 11/19/2004 10:42:23 PM PST by Mitchell
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To: demlosers

FYI

China asks Southeast Asian nations to cooperate in tapping oil
Nov 18, 2004 05:23:00 PM

Anil K Joseph
Beijing, Nov 18 (PTI) China, which is facing an energy crunch, today urged Vietnam and other Southeast Asian nations to agree for "joint development" of the disputed South China Sea area so as to tap the unexploited natural resources there, including oil and gas.

"We are ready to conduct cooperation with other countries, including Vietnam in ASEAN on the basis of mutual respect, equality and mutual benefit. We should actively explore how to conduct joint development work in the disputed waters of the South China Sea," Chinese Foreign Ministry spokeswoman Zhang Qiyue said.

Brushing aside Vietnam's reported protest against a recent bilateral agreement between China and the Philippines to explore oil around the Spratlys in the South China Sea area, Zhang said the pact was in conformity with the code of conduct signed between China and other members of the Association of Southeast Asian Nations (ASEAN) in 2002.

"It is true that China and the Philippines signed an oil cooperation agreement on jointly developing the seismic survey work in the region. The purpose of this agreement is to study and assess the oil and energy in the region," Zhang said.

"It is actually an important move for the two countries to implement the principles in the code of conduct of all the parties in the declaration of the South China Sea," she said. PTI


16 posted on 11/19/2004 10:43:48 PM PST by hedgetrimmer
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To: demlosers

I remember seen somewhere that if everyone want a living
standard equivalent to Europe, we need an additional three earth.


17 posted on 11/20/2004 12:19:57 AM PST by however1
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To: All

Let's all praise Nixon for going to China. And Kissinger, too. They should have read Napolean's warning.


18 posted on 11/20/2004 3:55:16 AM PST by razoroccam (Then in the name of Allah, they will let loose the Germs of War (http://www.booksurge.com))
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To: Kathy in Alaska; RedWing9; MJY1288; esther2; Left_Coast_Conservative; lonestargal; lonestar; ...

Patriots FYI ping.


19 posted on 11/20/2004 5:05:03 AM PST by patriciaruth (They are all Mike Spanns)
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To: patriciaruth

Gotta get that energy somewhere to make all that crap that Walmart sells to us. {/irony}


20 posted on 11/20/2004 5:14:06 AM PST by DoctorMichael (The Fourth Estate is a Fifth Column!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)
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To: investigateworld
Gee, Isn't Wal-mart Great!

Walmart is indeeed a great retailer. You seem to have a problem with them, but they have lowered the cost of many items. \

China is not just sold in Walmart. Go to RadioShack, or BestBuy, go to any clothing chain, or hardware store. Check out the local furniture shop. What used to be made in NC, is now coming from Kaitung...

The average American makes twenty times what a Chinese does, and spends it the same way. First for a roof overhead, then food, then comes everything else. We have a lot more for everything else... and thanks to our needs, so do the Chinese, now... But, we have given them technology for free, and that is the biggest danger... Loral, et al, were FOB's, and Billary sold out our soul, and our secrets! We just pay for it, now and in the future!

21 posted on 11/20/2004 5:15:21 AM PST by pageonetoo (I could name them, but you'll spot their posts soon enough.)
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To: investigateworld

We stopped the Japanese invasion into China. Read about Nanking. What the Japanese did to China was far and away much worse than anything we did.

We were allies in WWII with China and USSR. Russia is not our mortal enemy now, and if we remain vigilant, there's every hope we can pass through these choppy waters and eventually come to a denouement with China as well.

Meanwhile, it looks like time to push for a solar power satellite array to be built by an international consortium like the Alaska pipeline was.

My science sense tells me that hydrogen power cells are not the answer, and cold fusion is a dream unless Albiquerque blows up unexpectedly.


22 posted on 11/20/2004 5:15:57 AM PST by patriciaruth (They are all Mike Spanns)
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To: patriciaruth

The heathen rage!

The global village is not a happy settled utopia. The pressure cooker is building and the steam valve is pitted.


23 posted on 11/20/2004 5:19:08 AM PST by Just mythoughts
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To: razoroccam

Or Kipling's


24 posted on 11/20/2004 5:19:34 AM PST by joesnuffy ("The merit of our Constitution was, not that it promotes democracy, but checks it." Horatio Seymour)
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To: joesnuffy
A few thoughts which you should consider. As you read this the ChiComs have at least, note at least, 8 MIRVed nuclear intercontinental ballistic missiles pointed at the United States. You may thank ex-President Clinton et al for this fact. He authorized the technology transfers that permitted the ChiComs to be able to do this.

As an aside: About 15 years ago, give or take a few, I walked into a big, local gun store. The salesperson tried to interest me in a Chinese made SKS that was brand new in cosmoline right out of a case of them. I said no, but asked him where he could get brand new unused ChiCom rifles. He said that the ChiCom army was selling their old weapons so they could modernize their weapons!

Another factoid: When I was in grade school in the 40s, Pennsylvania poured more steel that any country in the world. There was a steel plant in Homeshead, PA that was over a mile long which operated 24 hours/day. One of the sights was to watch a shift change. Now it is closed. I don't even know if the building exists.

Another factoid: You could drive over to Youngstown, Ohio and the Bessemer converters would light up the night sky - every night as they made steel. Now, I don't think that one is operating.

I think that the US should wake up sometime soon. I recall a saying I believe by the German statesman Bismark, "You can do anything with a bayonet but sit on it." How large is the ChiCom army today? Check and see who is operating the Panama Canal today.

25 posted on 11/20/2004 6:11:12 AM PST by Citizen Tom Paine (An old sailor's opinion.)
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Comment #26 Removed by Moderator

To: Battle Axe

Depolymerization is easier. So is cooking tar sands, and using the silicate sludge leftovers to produce high grade ceramics, in addition to the usable petrochemicals produced.

Ceramic itself has the potential to replace several metals and/or plastics in a variety of applications.


27 posted on 11/20/2004 7:49:28 AM PST by L,TOWM (Time to take the kid gloves OFF, Mr. President...)
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To: demlosers

The last few paragraphs are the best. Change is coming.


28 posted on 11/20/2004 8:08:02 AM PST by dr_who_2
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To: demlosers

Wasn't it Chan Kahecik's (spelling dubious, spell check didn't help, neither the dictionary.) government in charge in China when it was made a permenent member of the UN security council? If so, Taiwan should legally be the China that controls that power.

Maybe if we boycott Wal'Mart, China won't have such a great need for oil. Buy American or don't buy at all.


29 posted on 11/20/2004 8:32:46 AM PST by F.J. Mitchell (Specter promises not to block Bush appointees, yippee! but will he nuke barriers erected by JC Dems?)
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To: henderson field
"And the benefit is...?"

The benefit is that over a billion people in China get a chance to live a better life. That's what capitalism is all about.

30 posted on 11/20/2004 8:39:57 AM PST by Truthsayer20
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To: patriciaruth

Nuclear is the only rational and reasonable answer. The only problem is the well funded irrational, unreasonable worry warts and their never ending parade of mindless law suits and violent protests.


31 posted on 11/20/2004 8:41:28 AM PST by F.J. Mitchell (Specter promises not to block Bush appointees, yippee! but will he nuke barriers erected by JC Dems?)
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To: however1
"I remember seen somewhere that if everyone want a living standard equivalent to Europe, we need an additional three earth."

More green propaganda. How many times have the doomsayers said that the earth can't support so and so many billion people and been proven wrong each time? Human ingenuity and technology has served us well so far. I don't see any reason why this cannot be the case in the future.

32 posted on 11/20/2004 8:44:24 AM PST by Truthsayer20
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To: investigateworld

Lordy, those people have an attitude!"'

China is much like the Arab world, a primitive backwater with a thin veneer of civilization, and a grudge for centuries of self-induced failure projected outward in classic narcissistic fashion.

Like Araby, the Chinese borrow pride from the shadow of grandeur from ages past, while living like medieval peasants in a 21st century world.

China has been more aggressive in its efforts at modernization but their crippling weakness is about half a billion essentially under-/unemployed people with no hope for sharing in the coastal urban speckles of prosperity.

They have a mag-lev train from the airport, but 50 million people who (literally) live in caves.


33 posted on 11/20/2004 8:48:10 AM PST by hinckley buzzard
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To: patriciaruth

Thanks for the ping!


34 posted on 11/20/2004 9:03:20 AM PST by Alamo-Girl
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To: Truthsayer20

right on!


35 posted on 11/20/2004 9:09:56 AM PST by Haro_546 (Christian Zionist)
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To: Truthsayer20
The benefit is that over a billion people in China get a chance to live a better life. That's what capitalism is all about.

Yeah, right. Most of the proceeds of China's "capitalism" are going to their massive military buildup. You're right actually, this is what capitalism turned out to be all about in this case, selling our enemies the rope to hang us with.
36 posted on 11/20/2004 9:13:26 AM PST by milemark (Proud to be an infidel.)
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To: milemark
I get the feeling china is laughing all the way to the bank.


(this photo was stolen from fellow FReeper, shellshocked)

37 posted on 11/20/2004 9:24:47 AM PST by Air Assault (Arm Yourselves!!)
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To: demlosers

China needs a big dose of hyrdrogen energy dropped right on Beijing.


38 posted on 11/20/2004 9:27:32 AM PST by JesseHousman
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To: cynicom
I wonder what China has in mind for the long haul...

Hint: It's cold, white, and full of pine trees...and oil, platinum, gold, and uranium. And hardly anyone lives there...

39 posted on 11/20/2004 9:28:51 AM PST by Mr. Jeeves
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To: milemark
Most of the proceeds of China's "capitalism" are going to their massive military buildup...this is what capitalism turned out to be all about in this case, selling our enemies the rope to hang us with.

Wow. As China abandons Mao, you embrace Lenin's argument.

China's standard of living has quadrupled in the last twenty years.

Who do you think an expanded consumer market will benefit in the long run?

(Hint--it's the most capitalist country on Earth...)

40 posted on 11/20/2004 9:31:39 AM PST by TigerTale ("An America that is a force for democratic change is a very dangerous foe indeed."--Victor D. Hansen)
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To: Mr. Jeeves
Russia has to decide, be a virgin bride for China, or depend on EU in a mutual defence pact. Anyone that would depend on EU for military help would be insane.

Regardless of which way Russia turns they will lose. Trying to pacify an 800 lb gorilla living next door is fruitless. They are in a hopeless position.

41 posted on 11/20/2004 9:36:34 AM PST by cynicom (<p)
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To: milemark
"Yeah, right. Most of the proceeds of China's "capitalism" are going to their massive military buildup. You're right actually, this is what capitalism turned out to be all about in this case, selling our enemies the rope to hang us with."

So all the millions of Chinese entrepreneurs are really doing their hard work just to give it all away to the state for a military buildup? Sounds like Marxist propaganda against America.

The Chinese are not some gigantic hive mind plotting to take over world. Like most people, they are individuals just wanting to improve their lives. The free market is the best tool for that, as they have realized.

42 posted on 11/20/2004 9:44:11 AM PST by Truthsayer20
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To: patriciaruth
They even bitched about our liberating them. Seems we allowed the Japanese army to travel in armed formations to the coastal cities so they could be returned to Japan.

They wanted to execute the leadership on the spot. By leadership, they meant corporals on up.
43 posted on 11/20/2004 10:11:53 AM PST by investigateworld (( ......Hey Kerry, how did you like them apples?....))
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To: demlosers

It's only a matter of time before we are at war with the Chinese.


44 posted on 11/20/2004 10:33:56 AM PST by nonliberal (Up the feces tributary without a means of locomotion.)
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To: investigateworld
Gee, Isn't Wal-mart Great!

Yes they are great. Before people go jumping all over Wal-Mart be reminded of the constraints placed on them from government oppression. It's not their fault that it's cheaper to make a pair of jeans in Beijing. If American businesses could throw off the yoke of over-regulation and wasted revenue to prepare their taxes, then perhaps we could make some cheaper products in America. The minimum wage, OSHA, EPA, and the IRS are the problem.

And despite all this Wal-Mart continues to be a shining example of what we can do with limited freedoms. Wal-Mart fights the war the best they can to live up to their customer's expectations.

45 posted on 11/20/2004 10:49:44 AM PST by numberonepal (Don't Even Think About Treading On Me)
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To: numberonepal
I used to have a construction company, prior to retiring ...I paid more in worker's comp than I ever netted and I had zero claims. But even with ALL government regulation removed, no American worker can compete with 50 cent an hour workers.
I cap on Sam Walton as he wrote in his book that he attended church and hence made spirituality part of his business plan. He would not confront the Chinese about their jailing of Christians, hence in my opinion, placed the dollar before his belief systems. There is a word for that.
46 posted on 11/20/2004 11:06:46 AM PST by investigateworld (( ......Hey Kerry, how did you like them apples?....))
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To: demlosers

We are creating another superpower with no morals


47 posted on 11/20/2004 11:18:08 AM PST by redfish53
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To: redfish53

I think on purpose...


48 posted on 11/20/2004 11:19:39 AM PST by redfish53
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To: redfish53
United we stand...divided the republic fails...it's good to have competition
49 posted on 11/20/2004 11:21:01 AM PST by redfish53
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To: cynicom

There is a lot of speculation as to what the Chinese will do with all of the US Treasury bills, etc., that they have invested in. I've been wondering if they might not take a page from the US war with Mexico and seize Siberia, then pay off the Russians for what they took.


50 posted on 11/20/2004 11:26:03 AM PST by DeaconBenjamin
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