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Priests doing too much guessing (GREELEY ALERT)
Sun-Times ^ | November 26, 2004 | ANDREW GREELEY

Posted on 11/26/2004 1:05:21 PM PST by Chi-townChief

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To: netmilsmom
Eight seminarians from one parish? You must be doing something right. Congrats! We have a vocations crisis in my diocese but until recently we didn't have a vocations director, we had a vocations COMMITTEE and interested young men and women were supposed to contact this committee to receive guidance. As you can imagine, this was not a source of inspiration. We have now have a good, faithful, young priest in that role and we have a good holy bishop (the previous one was more of a manager and less of a shepherd) and vocations are up this year.

There was a very good exchange on this topic last year at our local parish. The church was losing its priest and being paired with another parish which was going to result in fewer masses and less access to the priest's time. The parishoners were in an uproar over it! They demanded their own priest. At a meeting with the diocese rep, she asked them when was the last time their parish provided a priest for the diocese. It turned out that it had been years and years. No one could remember. Well, pointed out the rep, if you're not providing priests, you're not in the best position to demand one.

The parish is the typical "feel good" parish with synthesized music, watered down sermons, and a Church building that looks more like a auditorium than a sacred space. They're biggest request for the priest was that he attend their kid's t-ball games. They really gave the impression that a priest was a hired hand. I think some of them were wondering if they could "hire" one elsewhere.

Like I said, you get the vocations you deserve.

21 posted on 11/26/2004 2:25:06 PM PST by PMCarey
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To: Keisha

lets start by boycotting these products that have this kind of advertising, I was watching prime tv with my friends family last night, spiderman, the game etc, and about died when that ad for Levis came on, it was unbelievable! No wonder our kids are messed up, they are getting the wrong messages, freedom of expression,oh yeah, lets tear up the Constitution too while we are at it, get out of my country then you wacko perverts!


22 posted on 11/26/2004 2:25:45 PM PST by Keisha
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To: Keisha

I agree with you fully. The biggest problem is our 50ish priests and Directors of Religious Education are mostly flaming libs that think that all Catholics want is touchie feelie religion.
That don't realize that Protestant churches are really good at doing Community. If the Catholic churches try it, sometimes we do a poor subsitute for it. If we get back to being Catholic and stop being the best of all worlds, Catholics will be back.


23 posted on 11/26/2004 2:27:18 PM PST by netmilsmom (Zell on DEM Christianity, "They can hum the tune, but can't sing the song.")
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To: NetValue
As I examine it from a management perspective, it seems that an autopsy will soon be in order.

I'm sure one said that observing Christ on the cross - and we know how that turned out!

24 posted on 11/26/2004 2:30:39 PM PST by PMCarey
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To: Chi-townChief
In the early 1960's we had the unfortunate luck of having a radical Liberal in the name of Pope John XXIII in charge of things. We might just as well as had Jimmy Carter. Anyway, this zealot changed the entire Church, under the auspices of the Vatican II council. The result, at least to me, is that there is not a dimes worth of difference between the mainstream Protestant sects (Lutherans, Episcopals, Presbyterians, etc), and the Catholic Church.

There was small warning fom the Holy SEE that this would take place. One week there was the traditional Latin rite and the week after we were virtually Ptotestant.

The old folks freaked, and most of the others went shopping for a new Church. Once the tradition of being Catholic was gone, why would anyone stay? The number one raiding target by other Churches were and is Catholics. And we have a cut and run Liberal to thank for it.

Thats the way I see it.

25 posted on 11/26/2004 2:33:00 PM PST by tenthirteen
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To: Chi-townChief
(friendly comment below from "VOA", who is NOT a Catholic, but is Catholic-friendly)

Ask what is causing the problems and you'll hear personal opinions and cliches,
most of which blame the laity.


I don't know if this is helpful...
but if one-tenth of the reportage in Southern California media about the mess
of Catholic seminaries during the 1970s and 1980s are true...
The Catholics of the USA are just gonna' have to encourage the decent
priests and hope that a lot of the 1970s and 1980s seminary priests
retire early (by any means necessary!!!).
26 posted on 11/26/2004 2:33:06 PM PST by VOA
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To: PMCarey

You think the eight seminarians are unusual, look at this. We have 3 masses a day and five on Sunday. We say a Rosary before the main ones. There is one mass in Latin each week, which is a blessing for a mom trying to teach Latin to her children.
We even say the Kyrie in Latin in every mass. We have six priests! NO one walks out after communion and some ladies still cover their heads. We are Ethnic but not Eastern Rite.
Go back to the tradition and we grow the pious. There are enough liberal churches in our area that are losing families. I am very blessed to be here.


27 posted on 11/26/2004 2:35:59 PM PST by netmilsmom (Zell on DEM Christianity, "They can hum the tune, but can't sing the song.")
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To: Keisha

Amen


28 posted on 11/26/2004 2:50:57 PM PST by RepCath (Take it like a mandate)
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To: Chi-townChief
Research shows that Catholic priests are the happiest men in America

Well now this could be for several reasons
29 posted on 11/26/2004 3:32:54 PM PST by uncbob
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To: hinckley buzzard
I believe that in the 1940's, the Catholic Church was robust, respected, her priests were popular heroes, and they did indeed have the Holy Spirit.

And many many nuns and priests to stock their schools which did not charge tuition

Main reason school attendance is down is people don't have the $$$$$$

Vouchers would help cure that problem
30 posted on 11/26/2004 3:34:58 PM PST by uncbob
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To: Mercat
I've already changed parishes twice to find one where the theology is solid and/or aims about the third grade level but with no luck.

When you reach the breaking point, DO NOT DESPAIR! Look East! The Catholic Church is both Western (Latin Rite) and Eastern. As most of us realize, the Church began in the East. Our Lord lived and died and resurrected in the Holy Land. The Church spread from Jerusalem throughout the known world. As the Church spread, it encountered different cultures and adapted, retaining from each culture what was consistent with the Gospel. In the city of Alexandria, the Church became very Egyptian; in Antioch it remained very Jewish; in Rome it took on an Italian appearance and in the Constantinople it took on the trappings of the Roman imperial court. All the churches which developed this way were Eastern, except Rome. Most Catholics in the United States have their roots in Western Europe where the Roman rite predominated. It has been said that the Eastern Catholic Churches are "the best kept secret in the Catholic Church."

Earlier this year, totally frustrated with the liturgical abuse in my RC parish and fed up with the wreckovation of so many churches in my diocese, I followed the sage advice of a fellow freeper, check the Yellow Pages, and located 2 Eastern Catholic (not to be confused with Orthodox) Churches nearby. I was swept away by the beauty of their liturgy and total reverence for catholic tradition. The liturgy is chanted - a conversation between the celebrant and the congregation. Incense is used extensively throughout the liturgy to purify the Book of the Gospels, the altar and the Divine Offerings. When the priest dropped to his knees, extended his arms heavenward and called down the Holy Spirit to accept our offerings, I was left speechless. Communion is distributed ONLY by the priest(s), and on the tongue. There are no EEMs, no communion in the hand, no dancing girls or boys. Altar servers wear a cassock and surplice. Check the information at this link to determine whether or not there is an Eastern Rite Church in your community. If so, check the web for information on that particular rite and plan to attend their Divine Liturgy this Sunday. Note that in the Eastern Rite Churches, congregants gather after the liturgy for refreshments and conversation. They are very community oriented and the pastor will make a point of greeting each and every one who attends the mass, including you! Should you have any questions, do not hesitate to freepmail me. I will keep you and your family in my prayers.

Eastern Catholic Churches in the U.S.

31 posted on 11/26/2004 3:49:38 PM PST by NYer ("Blessed be He who by His love has given life to all." - final prayer of St. Charbel)
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To: PMCarey; netmilsmom; Keisha
Bump to my 31>
32 posted on 11/26/2004 4:02:15 PM PST by NYer ("Blessed be He who by His love has given life to all." - final prayer of St. Charbel)
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To: Chi-townChief; american colleen; sinkspur; Lady In Blue; Salvation; narses; SMEDLEYBUTLER; ...
Catholic Ping - please freepmail me if you want on/off this list


33 posted on 11/26/2004 4:03:20 PM PST by NYer ("Blessed be He who by His love has given life to all." - final prayer of St. Charbel)
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To: netmilsmom
We even say the Kyrie in Latin in every mass.

If you say "Kyrie Eleison," you say it in its original Greek.

Five of your Sunday Masses are the Novus Ordo, correct?

Why do you have six priests? Some retired, or in residence?

Your parish could have three priests and take care of all the Masses.

34 posted on 11/26/2004 4:07:05 PM PST by sinkspur ("It is a great day to be alive. I appreciate your gratitude." God Himself.)
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To: Charlemagne on the Fox

BUMP!


35 posted on 11/26/2004 4:21:01 PM PST by Don Corleone (Leave the gun..take the cannoli)
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To: squirt-gun
Let him who is without sin cast the next stone...

Do you mean 'sin' in general? Or 'sin' as in 'child molestation' as in 'FELONY'?

36 posted on 11/26/2004 4:24:14 PM PST by solitas
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To: PMCarey
It has to make a difference for one to be Catholic. The Church cannot be afraid to say that it's better to be good a Catholic than to be a good atheist. It's better to be a good Catholic than to be a good protestant. And it's infinitely better for you to be a good Catholic than a bad Catholic and here's what marks a bad Catholic and you should start asking yourself which you are.

Amen brother (or sister)!

What's been beaten down is the Catholic identity, either for 'ecumenical' reasons or 'pc' reasons (sort of the same thing), both equally misunderstood completely... far too many Catholics are that way only because they were baptized so. They have no idea, really, what it means to be a Catholic. And they aren't hearing it from most priests, especially ones like Fr. Greeley.

37 posted on 11/26/2004 4:26:46 PM PST by american colleen
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To: NYer

AAAACK! Greeley!


38 posted on 11/26/2004 4:27:57 PM PST by murphE (fight terrorism in the womb END ABORTION NOW)
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To: Cicero
Dioceses like Boston and Chicago which now have good bishops on the heels of bad bishops ...

Just to let you know that Archbishop O'Malley of Boston has appointed Voice of the Faithful leaders in key chancery positions. Things here are getting worse and the faithful priests are beside themselves from what I hear. The one approved Tridentine Mass will not have a home as that parish is slated to close in June. The Latin Mass group here has petitioned the Archbishop for a FSSP priest to lead them and the Archbishop has refused. While the archbishop may be personally a good and holy man, God alone knows what the heck is going on.

39 posted on 11/26/2004 4:34:59 PM PST by american colleen
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To: tenthirteen
The result, at least to me, is that there is not a dimes worth of difference between the mainstream Protestant sects (Lutherans, Episcopals, Presbyterians, etc), and the Catholic Church.

We have the Real Presence, Confession, Holy Orders, First Communion, Marriage as a sacrament, a consistant teaching that the sanctity of life is the first and foremost consideration, a belief that birth control is contrary to God's will, teaching against divorce and remarriage, keeping the Lord's Day by attending Mass --- Gosh! I could go on and on about why I am a Catholic and not a Protestant!

The old folks freaked,

True for the most part, I remember that. No comparison between a pipe organ and a guitar or an awe inspiring work of art and a felt banner.

... and most of the others went shopping for a new Church.

I dunno which new Church they joined since the Protestant demominations are in pretty bad shape... I think some Catholics just stopped going gradually, lured away by a newly liberated society (if you want to go to Mass, smells and bells don't keep you, a deep faith does).

I don't think John XXIII was a liberal but I don't think he was wily enough to see what the liberals/progressives had in mind... give them an inch and they'll take a mile every time.

40 posted on 11/26/2004 4:48:44 PM PST by american colleen
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