Posted on 12/09/2004 9:22:17 AM PST by Nascardude
Edited on 12/09/2004 10:05:10 AM PST by Admin Moderator. [history]
LOL...I asked her about the flavor of her koolaide and she only got mad and denied it.
No one yet on this thread has come forward and said that yes, America is doing her absolute best and can do no better.
We can do better and must do better.
Odd thing is that I'm one of the few who wasn't for shooting the reserve unit that failed to report for convoy duty and I'm one of the few who think we as a country can do better at equipping our troops. Yet I'm accused of slamming the troops and not supporting them! Go figure.
Anyway, there's a story online today that is a no brainer and really does fit in well with the topic of this thread and the context of the reserve quartermaster unit that claimed maintenance problems.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6694659/
Well, this morning on NPR Weekend Edition Daniel "sure dumb" Schorr "reported" that the soldier asked the reporter for help in asking the question.
Since I don't believe Schorr or NPR most of the time, NPR should fire Schorr. I cannot believe this moron socialist is still commentating on the taxpayer dime!
It was always insubordination; now even more so.
By: MAUREEN DOWD
Published: December 9, 2004
Hoooo-rah! Rummy finally got called on the carpet.
Not by the president, of course, but by troops fighting in Iraq. Some of them are finally fed up enough to rumble about his back-door draft and failure to provide them with the proper armor for their Humvees, leaving them scrambling to improvise with what they call "hillbilly armor."
The defense secretary had been expected to go to Iraq on this trip but spent the day greeting troops in Kuwait instead. Even though Pentagon officials insist that security wasn't an issue, I bet they had to be worried not to travel the extra 40 miles to Iraq.
Rummy met with troops at Camp Buehring, named for Chad Buehring, an Army colonel who died last year when insurgents in Baghdad launched a rocket-propelled grenade into Al Rasheed, a Green Zone hotel once frequented by Western journalists and administration officials that is still closed to guests because - despite all the president's sunny bromides about resolutely prevailing - security in Iraq is relentlessly deteriorating.
As Joe Biden told Aaron Brown of CNN about his visit to Falluja, "They got the biggest hornets' nest, but the hornets have gone up and set up nests other places." He said that a general had run up to him as he was getting into his helicopter to confide, "Senator, anybody who tells you we don't need forces here is a G.D. liar."
Rummy, however, did not hesitate to give the back of his hand to soldiers about to go risk their lives someplace he didn't trouble to go.
He treated Thomas Wilson - the gutsy guardsman from Tennessee who asked why soldiers had "to dig through local landfills for pieces of scrap metal and compromised ballistic glass to up-armor our vehicles, and why don't we have those resources readily available to us?" - as if he were a pesky Pentagon reporter. The defense chief used the same coldly cantankerous tone and squint he displays in press briefings, an attitude that long ago wore thin. He did everything but slap the kid in the hospital bed.
In one of his glib "Nothing's perfect," "Freedom's untidy" and "Stuff happens" maxims, Rummy told the soldier: "As you know, you go to war with the Army you have."
It wouldn't make a good Army slogan, and it was a lousy answer, especially when our kids are getting blown up every day in a war ginned up on administration lies. Remember when the president promised in the campaign that the troops would have all the body armor they needed?
These young men and women went to Iraq believing the pap they were told: they'd have a brief battle, chocolate, flowers, gratitude. Instead, they were thrust into a prolonged and savage insurgent war without the troop levels or armor they needed because the Pentagon's neocons had made plans based on their spin - that turning Iraq into a democracy would be a cakewalk. And because Rummy wanted to make his mark by experimenting with a lean, slimmed-down force. And because Rummy kept nattering on about a few "dead-enders," never acknowledging the true force, or true nationalist fervor, of the opposition.
The dreams of Rummy and the neocons were bound to collide. But it's immoral to trap our troops in a guerrilla war without essential, lifesaving support and matériel just so a bunch of officials who have never been in a war can test their theories.
How did this dangerous chucklehead keep his job? He must have argued that because of the president's re-election campaign, the military was constrained from doing what it is trained to do, to flatten Falluja and other insurgent strongholds. He must have told W. he deserved a chance to try again after the election.
He had a willing audience. W. likes officials who feed him swaggering fictions instead of uncomfortable facts.
The president loves dressing up to play soldier. To rally Camp Pendleton marines facing extended deployments in Iraq, he got gussied up in an Ike D-Day-style jacket, with epaulets and a big presidential seal on one lapel and his name and "Commander in Chief" on the other.
When he really had a chance to put on a uniform and go someplace where the enemy was invisible and there was no exit strategy and our government was not leveling with us about how bad it was, W. wasn't so high on the idea. But now that it's just a masquerade - giving a morale boost to troops heading off someplace where the enemy's invisible and there's no exit strategy and the government's not leveling with us about how bad it is - hey, man, it's cool.
E-mail: liberties@nytimes.com
It'll take a lot more than a coached question from a wet behind the ears Tennessee reservist to rattle a tough old bird like Rumsfeld.
No problem rlmorel, your post was no harsher than mine. While I didn't name names, I took a jab at some of the freepers in general who were merely voicing an opinion. Sorry if I offended you or anyone else.
getmeouttaPalmBeachCounty_FL: Flame me if you want, but I am going to bed.
I read your post twice, but for the life of me I can't find a good reason to flame you. You expressed your opinion, ok by me. Maybe rlmorel inspired me with his thoughtful last post.
cyncooper: To be sure, there was some applause, but watching the video MOST did not react. By misreporting the facts you undermine any valid point you wish to make.
I saw the video three times, and I heard first a brief silence following the question, as though the crowed of troops were stunned by it, then a loud roar of applause and whooping. My impression was that most of these troops agreed with the question. I didn't videotape it and look at all the faces and actions of the crowd, if you or someone else did, then that person could do a better job of "reporting" the reaction. I agree with your comments concerning Dobbs and the fact that actions to upgrade the armor had already been underway.
You are completely over the top.
I can't understand why you spend so little effort looking out to see if the troops might have legitimate needs and so much effort defending Rumsfeld.
It is too bad that you can't see what these guys have to work with. Yes, they make do, but is that the best that we have to offer them, make-do equipment?
FYI, when anyone published stats on how many HUMVEEs are not armored, remember that those that stay on base don't need armor. That reduces the number of those that actually need upgrades. So no, they don't all need it. But dang, you should see the difference it can make!
Maybe you should lean more towards looking out for the troops instead of looking out for the administration.
The steady drumbeat of resistance against the war in Iraq is heard not only from Al Jazeerah, but from America's MSM as well. If you want to defend the twerps in the MSM, that's your choice.
It'd be my guess that Kevin Sites is someone you admire.
You can repeat lies about me all you want and it won't stick.
If this same question had been posed to a clinton administration you'd applaud it.
To me it doesn't matter who asked the question or what their motives were. The fact is that the issue is a concern among the troops in Iraq. MAYBE the added attention will bring some solutions...or are you against that?
You've only proven to me that you're more interested in shielding the administration from potential embarrassment than you are shielding the troops from harm.
BTW, I spoke with some reservists from Ohio today. They didn't have enough scrap metal to enclose the cabs of their trucks that they use for convoy escort.
That doesn't seem to bother you.
Yet a politically motivated question bothers you.
Go figure!
President Bush has proven that he will not let that happen and because of that, he deserves our support. If the day ever comes that he turns yellow, then I will criticize his administration, but not before. We owe it to our CinC and his troops to present a united front to the world. This public whining accomplishes nothing but to provide ammunition to our enemies in the MSM, academia and throughout the world.
I have vivid memories of the Vietnam War and those responsible for our failure. Where were you in 1968?
President Bush has proven that he will not let that happen and because of that, he deserves our support. If the day ever comes that he turns yellow, then I will criticize his administration, but not before. We owe it to our CinC and his troops to present a united front to the world. This public whining accomplishes nothing but to provide ammunition to our enemies in the MSM, academia and throughout the world.
That is a pretty powerful admission of my premise stated up thread and that is why those like you really got mad at me, mocked me, lied about me and opposed me.
You really ARE more interesting in supporting the adminstration than the troops.
And NO, it is not the same thing!
You ask me about 1968? I was too young then to serve.
I ask you about now. That was then, this is now. Where are you TODAY? There are plenty of VN vets serving and working in Iraq. Where are you TODAY?
Or is this a NATO matter?
NATO = No Action, Talk Only
This public whining accomplishes nothing but to provide ammunition to our enemies in the MSM, academia and throughout the world.
If you wish to defend the MSM and thereby help to weaken public resolve for this war, then by all means continue to be an unwitting dupe for the left.
Repeating your lies forever will not make them stick.
Funny how you've not once directly voiced concern or support for the troops, but plenty about the administration.
The MSM did not invent an equipment problem in Iraq. The troops did not cheer a question that was absurd to them. And for all the quotes from those that deny the need or want for armor, there sure is a lot of people trying to improve what they've got however they can do it. And yes, I've seen it myself.
Discussing this with you reminds me of the warning not to try to teach a pig to dance since the teacher gets filthy in the process and it only irritates the pig.
Go ahead, have the last word. Take your best shot, I expect it to be a cheap one.
MD4Bush, it's time to come out of the closet. Everyone knows you're a Doug Duncan operative.
And why have you been in hiding since February 8? Typical gutless Dimmycrap.
Jim, it's time to reveal this smear artist's identity.
MD4Bush, it's time to come out of the closet. Everyone knows you're a Doug Duncan operative.
And why have you been in hiding since February 8? Typical gutless Dimmycrap.
Jim, it's time to reveal this smear artist's identity.
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