[swilhelm73]

Amusing. When will this "constitution" be put to a vote, by the people, in every country seeking to enter the EU?

Looking at the latest map;

http://europa.eu.int/futurum/ratification_en.htm

in only Portugal, Ireland, and Denmark will the people have a final say on the loss of their soverignty.

Of course seeing the results of past nos, perhaps calling even this a final say is overly optimistic.

Secession? Apparently you are not a student of history. Look for example at the American experiment where the right to secede was considered implicit within the Constitution...until someone actually tried to leave the Union*.

I'm also bemused how the people have a say over the most powerful part of the EU - the European Commission - which, unlike the Parliment, has the power to propose new laws.

*An argument can be made that the governments of the Confederate states, in denying the franchise to blacks, did not have the rightful power to secede, but outside of myself, I've never heard such an argument made.

[tjwmason]

in only Portugal, Ireland, and Denmark will the people have a final say on the loss of their soverignty.

Not so, other countries will be holding referenda, the difference between a binding referendum and a consultative one is essentially semantic in this case.

Secession? Apparently you are not a student of history. Look for example at the American experiment where the right to secede was considered implicit within the Constitution...until someone actually tried to leave the Union

A point which is definitely pertinent, though the legal situation regarding the War of Northern Agression is not as clear as it might be - for example Confederate President Jefferson Davis was not put on trial because it was acknowledged that he had broken no law (i.e., that the war was a war of agression), which further leads to the point that in the ultimate the more powerful will win.

A number of differences do exist, especially as regards the times as we find them. For example, a well established nation state redeclaring independence is a very different situation from a state which has never had an existence apart from a particular body (the 13 colonies fought together and quickly moved to the Articles of Confederation, and then the Constitution - England has a 1000 year history of independence from Europe).

[rogermellie]

as tj has pointed out, most countries of the EU will have a referendum on the 'constitution' - those governments that don't will have to face their electorates.

because the EU is a political organisation it is subject to politics, in politics anything is possible.

as for ceceding - theres a little thing called the english channel.....