CA: Los Banos weighs fine for elderly man who tried to build fence (87-year old WW2 vet)

Bakersfield Californian ^ | 12/11/04 | AP

[NormsRevenge]

LOS BANOS, Calif. (AP) - City officials here must decide whether to charge an 87-year-old man for damage caused when he tried to erect a fence in the middle of a street bordering his property.

Bernard Gardner said he was trying to reclaim property the city of Los Banos took from him for a street-widening project in the 1940s, when he was off fighting in World War II.

The street was damaged when one of Gardner's neighbors used a jackhammer to dig three post holes in the middle of West L Street. He was stopped by city crews in Los Banos, about 50 miles south of Modesto.

Gardner said he was upset that in August the city tore out cactus he had planted along a fence bordering the street.

"I was perfectly willing to let them have the street until they took out the cactus," Gardner said. "They just came and ripped everything out. I tried to point out that I owned the property."

Public Works Director Ray DeSa said the cactus was in the city's right of way and was removed for a repaving project.

"Currently Mr. Gardner's property line ends where the fence is," DeSa said. "There is no property in the street. He unfortunately may be misinformed."

[GOPcapitalist]

LOL! The city almost certainly has the legal title to the street in this case so he won't hold up in court, but as far as a little much-needed civil disobediance goes, I gotta give this guy credit. Dig some more holes in the street and stick it to 'em!

[Sonar5]

Pictures.... I want Pictures.......

"Cranky guy putting a fence in the middle of the street...."

Priceless.....

I see a commercial in his future.....

Regards,
Joe

[jb6]

I remember I had a small garden in my parents backyard, it was at the very back of the yard, just past the fense, still our land. Well it was along the line of sewer line, right before the swampy woods.

I used to carry water down there in buckets (all uphill from the garden) when it didn't rain. I was 11 years old. Anyways, after months I finally had two really good rows of corn going and some other stuff, was really proud of it. Then one day, when I was off with my parents, the city pricks came to cut back the follage (something they hadn't done in 5 years) and raped my garden. It wasn't enough to take the corn and everything, they had to tear it all up too.

[Servant of the 9]

I'd have to reread the Soldiers and Sailors Relief Act of 1941, but I am not sure there could be a legitimate taking on his property while he was serving.

So9

[keat]

And pictues you shall have.

[Sonar5]

That is awesome....

caption the cop...

"Sir can I have your autograph, and can you write to a good friend....."

and...

As soon as someone else shows up, Can I get my picture taken with you..."

Thanks for the pics...

Regards,
Joe

[drjimmy]

LOL! The city almost certainly has the legal title to the street in this case so he won't hold up in court, but as far as a little much-needed civil disobediance goes, I gotta give this guy credit. Dig some more holes in the street and stick it to 'em!

Just who do you think is going to pay for the cost of fixing the holes? It's either going to be the rest of the city's taxpayers, or the old coot himself. He ain't sticking anything to "the city." It's easy to laugh until it happens in your hometown.

[GOPcapitalist]

He ain't sticking anything to "the city." It's easy to laugh until it happens in your hometown.

Nah, cause in my city they don't fix the potholes we have anyway.

[AndyJackson]

Do you live in DC too?

[GOPcapitalist]

Funny you mention that - yes, I spend about half the year in the DC area. The other half I spend in Houston, which has the same problem thanks to former mayor Lee P. Brown (the P stands for Pothole)

[jim_trent]

I have designed a number of street projects (I work for an engineering consulting firm). In 95% to 99% of the cases, the right-of-way was obtained when the ground was platted. It always belonged to the City, County, or State, whether or not they use it immediatly.

Still, there are constantly people around here that decide they own the public property next to them. They don't. You would not believe some of the stories I have heard. Of course none of them have any legal papers filed anywhere to prove their claims. Still, they rail against the damb gubbmint stealing "their" land. It isn't theirs. They are trying to steal from me and every other taxpayer.

Unfortunately, I have heard some of the same stories posted here. And then there are a number of posts about how the damb gubbamint is stealing land from honest patriots again. It very well may happen, sometimes and somewhere, but most of what I have seen posted here is pretty obviously bunk.

I would be VERY surprised if he EVER owned this property.

[farmfriend]

Rights, farms, environment ping.
Let me know if you wish to be added or removed from this list.
I don't get offended if you want to be removed.

[E.G.C.]

BTTT!!!!!!!

[sergeantdave]

Well, Jim, I own property that extends into the middle of a public road. It's on the plat. I could legally build a fence thru the middle of the road. I don't because I get along great with the road crews and they've done a few favors for me with their heavy equipment.

I haven't decided what to do yet. Maybe I'll trade this piece for property the county owns.

[jim_trent]

You may be one of the 1% to 5% that have a legitimate claim. I repeat the word "may" until someone else (an independent third party) does a title search and checks the chain of ownership. I can tell you from personal experience, though, that most people who make a claim that they own public property, don't.

[sergeantdave]

Title search done. The land was surveyed, both by the previous owner and the county did its own survey.

I won't put up a fence because that would be asinine. Either I'll charge them a dollar a year for rent or trade it for a piece of county property I have my eye on to raise up a small building.

[jim_trent]

Your situation happens, but it is rare, luckily for me since it is a legal mess. The road should never have been put there. What I suspect in the cases like that that I have been involved with is that the owner of the land at the time the road was put in was politically connected (or was one of the good-ol-boys with the county supervisor) and had a long private driveway put in at taxpayers expense. After the area was divided into "acreages", other people started using it and it became a defacto road. Still doesn't make it right. It should never have been put there. It should be closed off and abandoned, but that is rarely done.

[sergeantdave]

Actually, the original surveys done in the 1840s were all screwed up. Some of the township lines are off by 100s of feet. But I guess when you're in the wilderness eating mosquitoes and getting chased up trees by wolf packs, you tend to hurry the job a bit.

For example, dozens of miles of Wisconsin actually belong to Michigan. Again it's a mess-up by the original surveyors. It would be interesting to see Michigan challenge the ownership. We were going to form up an expeditionary force and take it back, but we couldn't get enough beer for the multi-year squatting action it might take. :-)

In my case, the county bought my neighbors land to widen a road. What they didn't take into account is that a small piece of my land abutting the neighbor's was also taken. By taken I mean that vehicles use it. It's part of a turnaround at a deadend dirt road. We have some strange shaped land around here due to mining back in the 19th century. I'll need to send a legal notice to them so the land isn't taken by adverse condemnation.