TRANSFORMING THE ECONOMY -- The Ownership Society: Score One For Bush!

Iconoclast ^ | by R. Bastiat

[Toddsterpatriot]

How can we owe 8 Trillion dollars + Interest to the Federal Reserve for monies lent to the US Government?

Let me rephrase my question. How do you get that number?

[blabs]

Its called the national debt

[shield]

This guy must have read your post of the analysis of Bush's RNC Speech. ;o)

[LS]

It didn't take much insight: Bush made clear what he's doing.

[shield]

Most people really didn't get it....That's why I loved your analysis...it helped to grasp what he was actually saying. In fact, as hard as I researched at that time, I couldn't find an analysis like yours any place. ;o)

[LS]

I assume this refers back to the piece I posted on "Liberty's Century?"

One reason many people---on both right and left---I think miss this is that as a historian, I recognize that significant changes only occur over time. Seldom do you get an "Emancipation Procamation." More often, you get a John Marshall announcing an "elastic clause" that becomes the basis for all sorts of new laws.

My view is that the old paradigm (dontcha just love that word) that we are going to somehow use the mechanisms of GOVERNMENT (the presidency, the legislature, least of all the courts) to rein in the GOVERNMENT doesn't make much sense. Rather, just as the "new media" had to make an "end run" around the MSM, so too the reduction of the size of government and its influence can only occur by making an end run around government---get the private sector to grow faster, so fast that government relatively starts to shrink.

[shield]

That's the one....

My view is that the old paradigm (dontcha just love that word) that we are going to somehow use the mechanisms of GOVERNMENT (the presidency, the legislature, least of all the courts) to rein in the GOVERNMENT doesn't make much sense. Rather, just as the "new media" had to make an "end run" around the MSM, so too the reduction of the size of government and its influence can only occur by making an end run around government---get the private sector to grow faster, so fast that government relatively starts to shrink.

An end run around big government...extremely interesting. Now how much sense does that make...volumes...I Love it!!!

[Southack]

"I wouldn't be so distrustful of the Patriot Act if it was accompanied by a corresponding tightening of our sieve-like borders."

We've built miles and miles of 12 foot tall steel border fences from the Pacific all the way into Arizona, stalled only in places by environmental lawsuits against their construction.

We're also scanning container ships and containers themselves electronically now.

There's still a lot to be done, but what you aren't hearing about is that we've made some baby steps in the right direction already.

[blabs]

As a historian, I hope you realize that governments do not normally get smaller. In fact, history proves that once government gets power it grows bigger and stronger, and not vice versa.

IMO, the only thing historical about this scam is that it falls in line with the rest of history

This shenanigan is an end runaround allright, a runaround from the government, to the corporations and individuals, back to the government in increased tax revenue, derivative structures, and other funding to grow the leviathan to gargantuan proportions

Bush is a Globalist, not a patriot. Bubbles greenspan is facing an unprecedented situation and he needs consumer and corporation spending to avoid a deflationary scenario. Most people are up to their necks in debt, and corporations balance sheets aren't looking too good either, especially the majors with defaulting and underfunded pension positions. Hiring numbers are low, especially for "quality" jobs. Manufacturing is almost not existant. Real estate ReFi's are about tapped out and valuations in many locales are at breaking points. Foreigners are losing their ass on FRN's and getting more nervous each day. Inflation is rising. Our deficits are at an all time high. Our exports are pathetic. There's so much more, but I won't spend all day on the doom and gloom

Let's just say that this infusion (aka "Ownership Society" Ooohhh!) is exactly what Bubbles "G" and the Fed need to extend their scam until the next bubble bursts.

The only things that will be shrinking are your rights and freedoms.

[LS]

Sorry, but you are myopic as hell. No, governments don't "shrink"---except of what you said was true, there would be nothing BUT government. And no, I don't see my rights going out the window. In fact, I have far MORE rights today than in 1993---Ohio, for ex., just passed a concealed carry law.

Believe what you want. Enjoy your bunker.

[blabs]

Ever heard of war? This is why governments get toppled. Whether it's an internal uprising, or an external invader, if a governmnet becomes hositle or overbearing (or weak), they will either self destruct or be destroyed.

As far as more rights today than in 1993, give me a break. You got to be kidding? Because the state of Ohio gave now "gave" you a "Right" to a conceal carry, when the bill of rights clearly stated that this right shall not be infringed.

Oh woe is me!

[Toddsterpatriot]

Its called the national debt

That's pretty funny. I own some T-bills. Last I checked, I wasn't the Federal Reserve.

[Toddsterpatriot]

Manufacturing is almost not existant.

I think you mean non existent.

Manufacturing still exists in America. At the last Free Mason meeting the Rockefellers told Greenspan to get the Federal Reserve to secretly buy it up and ship it to New Jersey. It's in a Self-Storage locker. Shhhh.

[blabs]

What does this have to do with the price of bread? T-bills are short term securities, also known as "Debt Instruments". The U.S. Treasury issues securities to raise the money needed to operate the Federal Government and to pay off maturing obligations - its debt, in other words. T-Bills are not money, hence not FRN.

How about that 8 Trillion Dollar answer?

[Toddsterpatriot]

National debt is all the money the government owes. I get the idea that you think the government owes the 8 trillion to the Federal Reserve.

[blabs]

Manufacturing is almost not existant.

Manufacturing still exists in America. At the last Free Mason meeting the Rockefellers told Greenspan to get the Federal Reserve to secretly buy it up and ship it to New Jersey. It's in a Self-Storage locker. Shhhh.

perhaps you missed the "almost" in that first line. I know manufacturing still exists in America, but I think Rock and Bubbles "G" would definetly not pick Jersey as a storage point.

Too many environmental regulations!

[Toddsterpatriot]

perhaps you missed the "almost" in that first line.

The manufacturing sector of the U.S. economy has experienced substantial job losses over the past several years. In January 2004, the number of such jobs stood at 14.3 million

CBO

Yeah, almost 14.3 million jobs. Hardly noticeable. A rounding error.

[LS]

Yah, I've heard of war. Have you heard of "nonsense?"

[blabs]

Thats a pretty pathetic number.

[blabs]

Are you sure you're a historian?