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To: Hoplite
If the show were on the other foot, there would be no Israel.
On the other hand, there already is an Arab state on 3/4 of 1922 Palestine.
The issue then is how much of the disputed territory, Israel should take. Most of the "settlements" are either on previously empty land, or land owned by Jews prior to 1947-49.

The costs of supporting Israel are known. What are the costs of not supporting Israel?
Are we to believe that the Muslim world will cease to have grievences? I doubt it. They will have an excuse for Jihad as long as any non-Muslim nation controls territory once controlled by Muslims or any Muslim in Dar Al-Harb is slighted. Of course, the ultimate goal of Muslims is a world-wide Caliphate.

Scheuer knows this. His blaming Israel is therefor a clear attempt to buy off Islam. Of course, the question is why Israel and not Russia, Spain, of Greece?
Instead of dealing with Islam, he preffers to whine about Jewish power.

50 posted on 02/12/2005 12:30:02 AM PST by rmlew (Copperheads and Peaceniks beware! Sedition is a crime.)
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To: rmlew
We're not going to cut Israel loose, and Scheuer is not attempting to buy off Islam - he's calling for a clear-headed evaluation of our fight with Al Qaeda, to be followed by the necessary steps to carry on that fight to a successful conclusion.

I don't see how you can combat a problem, win a war, unless you realize really what the enemy is up to and what he's about, and what motivates him. As long as we cling to these ideas that they're criminals and we can settle the issue with primarily the use of law enforcement in the court, and a very moderate application of military power, I see no reason for hope. I use an epigram there from Lincoln after the battle of Antietam where he said: "These people just don't realize we're in a bloody war and it's going to have to be fought out to the end", and that's about where we are. - Michael Scheuer

American-Israeli relations go under the "what motivates him" part of Scheuer's comment.

As to justifying Israeli expansion across it's 1947 borders, if that can be justified, then so too can Palestinian reclamation of areas which were previously empty land or owned by Palestinians prior to 1947-49, right?

Of course not - this isn't about what's justified, its about what's possible given the current situation, which favors Israel, is maintained as the status quo by America as it is in our interest to maintain it that way, but is being used by some in Israel to carve out lebensraum at the expense of Palestinians, which is contrary to our interests.

57 posted on 02/14/2005 11:44:08 AM PST by Hoplite
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