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College often not worth time, money
The Pittsburgh Tribune-Review ^ | Thursday, February 24, 2005 | Mike Seate

Posted on 02/24/2005 9:12:40 AM PST by Willie Green

A waitress at one of my favorite Strip District restaurants last week used one of the industry's oldest cliches. She delivered a meal and reminded me that she "really didn't do this" for a living.

Waiting tables, she explained, was simply something she was doing until a well-paying job opened up in the field she studied during six years in college.

While this is rote conversation for wait staff in places like New York and Los Angeles, where everyone with a tray of linguini in their hands is waiting for a slot on NBC's "Fear Factor," it's unusual for Pittsburgh.

Or is it?

The waitress, it turns out, spent all that time and nearly $150,000 of her family's money studying social sciences, but after graduating she became disappointed with the entry-level salary of her chosen field.

"I can make, like, twice what I'd make as a social worker waiting tables," she confided, "so I'm probably going to just stay here."

(Excerpt) Read more at pittsburghlive.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Culture/Society; Editorial
KEYWORDS: academia; career; education; thebusheconomy; vocation; work
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To: RobRoy
BTW, I majored in pinball in college. Never completed so much as a quarter.

You must have been really good at pinball, to be on your original quarter the whole way through.

221 posted on 02/24/2005 12:05:52 PM PST by xm177e2 (Stalinists, Maoists, Ba'athists, Pacifists: Why are they always on the same side?)
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To: Aquinasfan
I only went into engineering for the money.

My friend actually thought about engineering, and then decided to follow his passion, art. He just did it in a way that impressed me. Internship, coop, working on skills he could use in the market as opposed to just making pictures.

I was the opposite. I went to chemical engineering because I wanted something challenging, loved chemistry, and had enough mechanical skills to be dangerous. When I got to my freshmen orientation, I was surprised to hear Chem E has the highest starting salary. Money isn't why I became and engineer, I became an engineer because that is where God lead me.
222 posted on 02/24/2005 12:06:13 PM PST by redgolum
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To: Radioactive

Network marketing?

A pox on you!!!

Lower than lawyers....


223 posted on 02/24/2005 12:09:26 PM PST by 1stFreedom (1)
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To: Aquinasfan

I was just giving examples of the schools this program applies to.

As for my kid, he's living at home and commuting to class (about 35 minute commute).

We've already been through the "indoctrination" courses, LOL. The Humanities, Ethics, etc. It was nice having him home while going to those classes because we could discuss what was being taught in class.

His Am Govt teacher was a staunch Republican, that was a rare find.

From here on in, course wise, it's math, science and technology, so I'm not too worried about liberal agendas in those classes.


224 posted on 02/24/2005 12:12:16 PM PST by dawn53
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To: RobRoy
(IA + AA) x A = PA

I like it.

225 posted on 02/24/2005 12:15:31 PM PST by Donald Rumsfeld Fan ("Memos on Bush Are Fake but Accurate". NYTimes)
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To: xm177e2

Good one!

You are not far from the truth though. Whadaya do when the break is over, it's time for class, and you have 8 games up on the machine from your original quarter? You can't just throw them away.

Answer: You skip class - day after day after day. Pretty pathetic. And yes, I was paying out of my own pocket.


226 posted on 02/24/2005 12:16:10 PM PST by RobRoy (Child support and maintenence (alimony) are what we used to call indentured slavery)
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To: myself6
Thanks for the advice, but at 49, I'm a bit too old for military service. Oddly enough, I'm young enough to have living parents who do value my computer expertise, now that they've decided to join the 21st Century!

Your advice about the military is good for younger folks, I had way too much revulsion towards the military back when I was in high school to have considered it. It's one of my regrets in life that I listened to a bunch of McGovernites who just simply hated this country and everything it stood for, rather than look out after my own future, and my country's freedom.

227 posted on 02/24/2005 12:17:30 PM PST by hunter112 (Total victory, both in the USA and the Middle East!)
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To: Conservatrix
"It amazes me that the two most sucessful guys in radio-- Rush and Hannity-- are both college dropouts."

Don't forget Bill Gates.

228 posted on 02/24/2005 12:21:05 PM PST by Donald Rumsfeld Fan ("Memos on Bush Are Fake but Accurate". NYTimes)
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To: Willie Green

Heh, it does depend heavily on what a person's major was.

Any sort of biology, chemistry, physics or engineering degree can land a job, and a masters or a Ph.D. means more responsibility and pay.

Now, history, social science, english, and etc are SOL unless they are very skilled and can get a job in academia.


229 posted on 02/24/2005 12:22:43 PM PST by Constantine XIII
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To: RobRoy
And yes, I was paying out of my own pocket.

That couldn't have been very expensive. If you were so good at pinball, it would only cost a couple bucks a day.

230 posted on 02/24/2005 12:24:22 PM PST by xm177e2 (Stalinists, Maoists, Ba'athists, Pacifists: Why are they always on the same side?)
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To: Constantine XIII
Any sort of biology, chemistry, physics or engineering degree can land a job, and a masters or a Ph.D. means more responsibility and pay.

Nah, those diplomas might as well be a target,
and the bullseye reads "outsource me" in bold, capital letters.

231 posted on 02/24/2005 12:28:13 PM PST by Willie Green (Go Pat Go!!!)
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To: MediaMole

"If she'd spent her time studying real science instead of 'social science,' she could have had a good job."

Oh, I don't know. Economics is a "social science," yet one can get a decent enough job in the financial sector with an econ degree.


232 posted on 02/24/2005 12:30:48 PM PST by hispanichoosier
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To: Willie Green

Only if you do a relatively whimpy job like coding computer programs, or some other routine, repetitive "chore"-type job.

We can never have enough of the heavy duty degrees, for example, physics Ph.Ds. Unemployment of physics Ph.Ds is usually below 2%, according to the American Physical Society.

If someone has the mettle to earn a Ph.D. in a hard science, then they'll be able to get a job, by Jimny!


233 posted on 02/24/2005 12:33:10 PM PST by Constantine XIII
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To: Richard Kimball

Pacino in that movie was a piker compared to some of the NYC big law firm partners I've known and worked for. Even satan couldn't have held a candle to the evil of some of those guys.


234 posted on 02/24/2005 12:35:21 PM PST by Modernman ("Normally, I don't listen to women, or doctors." - Captain Hero)
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To: Constantine XIII
Unemployment of physics Ph.Ds is usually below 2%, according to the American Physical Society.

A lot of that is subsidized by academia's voracious appetite for junk science.

235 posted on 02/24/2005 12:38:49 PM PST by Willie Green (Go Pat Go!!!)
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To: Lloyd227
My older brother went to WPI. Watch out for the druggies there, he got in with the wrong crowd and started trying out some street pharmaceuticals on a regular basis, ended up destroying his life. It's a great college don't get me wrong, but it has a reputation for being the college of a lot of whack jobs.
236 posted on 02/24/2005 12:38:56 PM PST by DarkSavant
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To: Rubber_Duckie_27
But I agree, too many students would rather have a fluff major and spend 4-5 years partying instead of working hard and having a good job after graduation.

Almost all BA undergrads are useless by themselves. I got my BA in Poli Sci but I knew I was going to go to grad school after college. I lived with five guys in college- three of us went to law school, one went to med school, one went to Business School. Only one guy ended up working in his BA field (Journalism).

237 posted on 02/24/2005 12:40:21 PM PST by Modernman ("Normally, I don't listen to women, or doctors." - Captain Hero)
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To: Willie Green

$150,000? maybe if paying list price. By studying hard and acing entrance/standards exams (SAT, GMAT, etc.), being flexible about choosing schools, playing off personal advantages (gender, race, origin, disabilities, etc.), bargaining with schools, etc. one can bring the price way down.

A co-worker got 25% off his MBA school by being willing to fill in a last-minute entry-class vacancy. Someone dropped out of the program 2 days before it started, the school asked Ed if he wanted to fill the spot, and he said yes ... and recognizing that the school would rather charge less than have a vacancy (like airline seats), he demanded a 25% discount - and got it.

A friend has MS and wants to attend law school. Being unable to afford it, he studied like crazy, practically aced the entrance exams, applied to 30+ top schools, and made it clear he is disabled. Seeking "diversity", some schools will likely accept him at next to no cost.

My wife wants her MBA. Studying like crazy, she nailed a 4.0 in her last undergrad year, and scored moderately high on the GMAT. Being a foriegn national, female, high-scoring, requesting an assistantship, and applying to a big-name well-endowed school which finds itself lacking in students with the first two factors, there's a good chance tuition will be $50. Another school offered 75% off.

Most of my MSCE was paid by employers with a tuition reimbursment program. During a period of unemployment, NY state offered to pay my way (in a fit of ethics, I declined).

Yes, the list price for university degrees is high. Paying it makes entrance easy. Doing some work ahead of time, plus being flexible, can drop that price substantially. Work hard, play your strengths, get creative. Don't pay list price.


238 posted on 02/24/2005 12:43:55 PM PST by ctdonath2
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To: Semaphore Heathcliffe
I agree. I'm an undergrad myself, and I have had lib arts majors that are nearing graduation ask me about enrolling in my major! (Manufacturing)

The modern equivelent of apprenticeship is an internship, most people in the applied science and technology department get them over the summer, and then are offered jobs upon graduation.

239 posted on 02/24/2005 12:52:33 PM PST by jsmith48 (www.isupatriot.com)
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To: Modernman

Glad you're on our side.


240 posted on 02/24/2005 1:24:38 PM PST by Richard Kimball (It was a joke. You know, humor. Like the funny kind. Only different.)
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