Posted on 03/30/2005 7:14:14 PM PST by wagglebee
Simplest explanation that fits all the facts I know, and it fits them perfectly.
BTW, have you heard A BIRD IN A BARREN CAGE? Keyword search BARRENCAGE . It's a song I wrote and recorded a few weeks ago, posted on a thread of its own.
I've been wondering about the medical examiner in Pinnelas County that will be given Terri's emaciated and tortured remains to conduct an autopsy, will he be the only one allowed to do it?
Gosh, ya think?
but it casts serious doubt on anything he says.)
Who do you mean Greer Pelos or MS ?
I don't think so. This is different because most/some of us have been involved in 'end of life' decisions when it's involved a terminally ill and dying family member... but the problem here is that this woman is physically healthy. You just can't go around starving and dehydrating perfectly healthy people to death, regardless of their mental capacity.
In my mind, needing to be fed isn't a medical intervention when it's the only physical problem a person has. I've been thinking lately of my great aunt (or even Ronald Reagan) who had to be fed pureed baby food by spoon. She didn't even know her own name and she could barely swallow the food.
"I do not wish to converse with ANY person who wants Terri dead. If that includes you... too bad for you."
I didn't say that. I didn't come close.
In fact, having been a part of such decisions, My mother spent years taking care of such people, and continues to be legal guardian of two. My sister operates a chain of care facilities for such people.
I'm probably more qualified that most on this thread.
What I'm saying is that if you're relying on this doctor's report then it won't get you where you wanna go. It's a cruel fraud from all accounts.
I have been supporting Terri's case for about two years now. Clicky Click Click
I Know All About Aphasia Do you? I also know all about forgiveness. Do You?
I don't have a good source, but I think a Google search might help. I think the date was October 1993, and it was a deposition by Michael Schiavo.
You don't have to drink the whole bottle to know if the milk's gone sour.
People just can't seem to get past Hammesfahr's peccadilloes.
Perhaps we should just disregard his report then, and look at the one from 3 weeks ago, this one is by Dr. Cheshire, a Mayo clinic neurologist:
http://www.sbcbaptistpress.org/bpnews.asp?ID=20441
(snippets)
“I believe that, within a reasonable degree of medical certainty, there is a greater likelihood that Terri is in a minimally conscious state than a persistent vegetative state,” William P. Cheshire Jr. wrote, after recently visiting Schiavo for 90 minutes and examining her medical records.
...........
Cheshire writes, “To enter the room of Terri Schiavo is nothing like entering the room of a patient who is comatose or brain-dead or in some neurological sense no longer there. … As I looked at Terri, and she gazed directly back at me, I asked myself whether, if I were her attending physician, I could in good conscience withdraw her feeding and hydration. No, I could not. I could not withdraw life support if I were asked. I could not withhold life-sustaining nutrition and hydration from this beautiful lady whose face brightens in the presence of others.”
Schiavo “demonstrates behaviors in a variety of cognitive domains that call into question the previous neurological diagnosis of persistent vegetative state. Specifically, she has demonstrated behaviors that are context-specific, sustained, and indicative of cerebral cortical processing that, upon careful neurological consideration, would not be expected in a persistent vegetative state.”
..............
Cheshire concludes his affidavit: “How medicine and society choose to think about Terri Schiavo will influence what kind of people we will be as we evaluate and respond to the needs of the most vulnerable people among us. When serious doubts exist as to whether a cognitively impaired person is or is not consciously aware, even if these doubts cannot be conclusively resolved, it is better to err on the side of protecting vulnerable life.”
You are so hell bent on trying to destroy the findings of the doctor?
Why? Let's be honest!!
Did you do that to the doctor that examined Terri for 45 mintues and made his conclusions??? Hmmmm
Is it truth you are looking for? hmmm
Do NOT post to me again... UNLESS YOU BELIEVE THAT TERRI SHOULD HAVE BEEN ABLE TO LIVE.
I do not believe in Euthanasia, abortion or EUGENICS. PERIOD.
SCREW "THE WEB!!
After reading this Physician's assessment of Terri; I am CONVINCED that She is being Murdered!!
The "Workup" of that Physician was the most Extesive, Elaborate, Erudite, & Thorough "Neurological Workup" of Terri Schiavo that I Have Seen!
What are you drinking, I thought this discussion was about the loon that wrote the posted report.
Colleen...
Thank you for actually READING my posts (unlike some).
I've been involved as clergy in two such situations. As I posted elsewhere, my family has been, or continues to be, professionally involved with the care of such people. I'm definitely with you on many issues.
I'm thinking there is a point where most of us would vote to let God / nature take its course. I'm sure that all of us would vote to provide prolonged medical care in other cases. The discussion needs to center about where that line exists, and what mechanism we use to determine whether someone has gone over that line.
In reality, what normally happens is that the "mercy killings" happen quietly, without consulting the courts, with the full cooperation of the doctors. I know. I've seen it happen. Dr. Kevorkian simply went public with the practice.
Can't believe him....
Cranford identified that Cheshire is a 'fundamentalist christian'.
Don't you know that? /sarcasm.
I don't get how an institution can be compliant in such malpractice. Isn't it criminal neglect?
I don't believe that in this country anyone has that much power over anyone else. At the very least it would be grounds to exclude him as a capable guardian, let alone husband.
Anyone who knowingly participated in such torture would also be liable for assault.
" Do NOT post to me again... "
Free country, Free Republic. If you don't like conversation and debate, go elsewhere. If you just like to rant, go elsewhere. I'm the big ugly guy at the end of the hall if you want to talk about it in person.
I had no idea my overly bright 1 year old child is actually a PVS case. Huh ... he doesnt respond to most 'commands' either.
Thanks for posting the words of Dr. Cheshire. I had read them before and found them to be thorough and thoughtful. Like so many Mayo Docs... I have spoken with in the past. Another great Doc there is a Dr. Calamia. Very, very kind, encouraging and confident.
If he continues to not respond to commands after 15 years, then you might have a proper analogy.
Ok. What is the big deal with this guy? Someone wrote a letter recommending him for a Nobel and suddenly the doctor is a quack? That doesn't seem reasonable to me.
Is that the only issue with this guy?
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