Bill would allow "intelligent design" for science classes

Phillyburbs.com ^ | 4/8/05 | MARTHA RAFFAELE/AP

[wagglebee]

HARRISBURG, Pa. - School boards would be allowed to require the teaching of "intelligent design" - a concept that is the subject of a federal lawsuit in Pennsylvania - as part of science lessons under a bill that has been introduced in the state House of Representatives.

It's unclear whether the measure, sponsored by only a dozen lawmakers, will go anywhere as the Legislature prepares for state budget negotiations with Gov. Ed Rendell over the next two months.

Rep. Thomas C. Creighton, the prime sponsor, said it would encourage school boards to broaden the discussion of biological origins to include concepts besides the theory of evolution. Intelligent design holds that the universe must have been created by an unspecified guiding force because it is so complex.

"To say we're smart enough to know that there isn't an intelligent designer, we're being very arrogant in our thinking," said Creighton, R-Lancaster.

Opponents argue that intelligent design is merely a secular variation of creationism, the biblical-based view that regards God as the creator of life. They say teaching it in public schools violates the separation of church and state.

A federal lawsuit is pending against the Dover Area School District school board, which adopted a policy in October requiring ninth-grade students to hear a statement about the concept during evolution lessons in biology class.

The American Civil Liberties Union filed the lawsuit along with the nonprofit Americans United for Separation of Church and State, and it is monitoring the legislation closely.

A legislative endorsement of intelligent design would conflict with Pennsylvania's science standards, which specifically call for the teaching of evolution, said Larry Frankel, the ACLU's legislative director in Pennsylvania.

"You can't teach religion as science," he said.

Pennsylvania is one of at least nine states where lawmakers have introduced bills this year concerning the teaching of evolution in public schools, according to the National Conference of State Legislatures.

Neither the Pennsylvania School Boards Association nor the state Education Department has taken a position on Creighton's bill.

[wagglebee]

A legislative endorsement of intelligent design would conflict with Pennsylvania's science standards, which specifically call for the teaching of evolution, said Larry Frankel, the ACLU's legislative director in Pennsylvania.

The left has gone to court innumerable times to force any possible mention of God from schools, so why is it wrong to have a legislature assert their power to enact new laws?

[HKTechBoy]

You know, there's a tribe in deepest darkest Africa who believes when the New Moon comes they have to gather around the fire and make all this noise to bring the Moon Back. When the anthropologist told them "The other tribe doesn't believe in that" they replied "Well Lucky for them that we do it for everybody."

So if we teach ID alongside evolution, we might as well teach the above with Copernicus

[mblaise]

"You know, there's a tribe in deepest darkest Africa who believes when the New Moon comes they have to gather around the fire and make all this noise to bring the Moon Back. When the anthropologist told them "The other tribe doesn't believe in that" they replied "Well Lucky for them that we do it for everybody." "

i really don't understand why people have to turn science into religion.. as far as i've read, the basic argument for ID goes something like " ... off the top of my head, i CAN'T IMAGINE how complex phenomenon can emerge from simple basic laws... therefore it has to have a superbeing specifically intervening at every step..."

as if god isn't smart enough to have crafted evolution, genetics, cosmology, general relativity, particle physics, etc...

[Fast1]

Christ Just the wonder of it all plus the fact that the universe follows a uniform set of rules and laws should be enough for anyone.. ever wonder why astronauts come back religious?

[wagglebee]

ever wonder why astronauts come back religious?

Not to mention almost everyone who has ever been in combat, caught at sea in a storm, etc.

[Fast1]

Agreed!

[PatrickHenry]

EvolutionPing

A pro-evolution science list with over 260 names. See list's description at my homepage. FReepmail to be added/dropped.

[qam1]

You lie

See

http://www.maaf.info/expaif.html

[Torie]

Do any of your cohort PH actually know how evolution is taught in high school? Do they point out what is unknown about the theory, what are the gaps, and just how little is known about how non-life became life? Teaching science and eschewing superstition, or labeling something as "science" when it isn't a part and parcel of the scientific method, is grand, but part of the job is to teach just how much science has failed to solve, and remains unknown, and how theories sometimes hit the dust, or have to be drastically revised. The key is to emphasize that so much is a work in progress. (My recollection when I was in high school as to the answer to the question then, a zillion years ago before rocks cooled, was "poorly.")

Just how good are high schools at doing that? That is my question. I pose the question as a near atheist. Cheers.

[wagglebee]

If you reread what I wrote you will see that I said, "nearly everyone who has been in combat."

So, your trivial list of a few dozen athiests is hardly proof that I'm a liar.

[gobucks]

"ever wonder why astronauts come back religious?"

Links please ... makes sense of course, but I'd like to see some references ... I have not heard of this before .. tthanks...

[I got the rope]

When did it become ok for some group of outside beauracrats to tell a school what they can and cannot teach?

That being said, ID is not science.

[Mr. Buzzcut]

as if god isn't smart enough to have crafted evolution, genetics, cosmology, general relativity, particle physics, etc...

Yup -- I always figured that "science" was just God implementing the physical part of His plan.

[gobucks]

There is something deeply, deeply wrong with this picture:

; somehow, standing up and shouting "Praise Man, no God is exists, and I'm not afraid to say so!", somehow that is seen as being 'brave'.

It is weird.

[PatrickHenry]

Do any of your cohort PH actually know how evolution is taught in high school?

I haven't a clue. Like everything else I hear about regarding the government schools, I assume they do a terrible job. However, introducing a bunch of nonsense like creationism (or it's closeted version, ID) into a science class will make an already-bad situation far worse.

My main concern, however, is that the MSM is going to play this evolution vs. creationism issue as a "conservatives are idiots" theme, and it will definitely be harmful in future elections. Republicans are on the verge of a generation of control of the government, but silly stuff like this can ruin everything.

[I got the rope]

Just how good are high schools at doing that? That is my question

Good question. I have another. How well are they teaching math,literature, writing, etc.?

I don't trust public schools to do any of it. That is why I homeschool my children.

[I got the rope]

That's just creepy. My first thought is that this is a group of homosexuals that want some recognition.

[Joe 6-pack]

"So if we teach ID alongside evolution, we might as well teach the above with Copernicus"

Even within our limited ability to comprehend the cosmos, you and I could agree that the tribe's hypothesis is incorrect, and proffer an explanation for the moon's *return* based on both our own observation and our willingness to accept (by faith) the research and findings of others, providing a powerful, if not overwhelming counterpoint to the tribe's beliefs.

What is your powerful caveat to the Theory of Intelligent Design that is so overwhelming that Secular Darwinian Evolution should be taught to ID's exclusion?

[Vaquero]

someone in the evolution ping list's tagline is something to the effect that (and I paraphrase) " Liberalism is a cancer on American, and Creationism is a cancer on Conservatism"

Nuff said.....

[Torie]

Ok, but if evolution is mis-taught, then that to me opens the door to the crude balancing of suggesting doubt through the blugeon of positing that well maybe science will never know, because it is beyond science. Sometimes suck squared is better than just plain suck, because the exponent acts as a check. What do you think? The key lesson here should be to teach doubt, how much we do not know, and that sometimes posing questions are more important than the answers, and that much will remain unknown while we remain on this mortal coil.

Darn it, teach the young little monsters to think!