Totalization With Mexico Could "Total" Social Security

Men's News Daily - The Gunners Corner ^ | Monday, April 18, 2005 | Mike Minton

[FBD]

>"The requirement is proof. An illegal must have proof that he paid in. He must have his pay records/pay stubs.

He must be able to prove that he is the person mentioned in the records/stubs."<

Ok, so whose account is the *illegal paying into? He's got a phony Social Security number, or is using someone else's which he stole, which is in itself felony fraud, so why should an illegal citizen be entitled to any S.S. monies?

Furthermore, the rumor is, that the Bush administration wanted to allow illegal aliens "guest workers" to be eligible for S.S. bennies after only 18 months of paying in.

I fail to see how someone paying into the Social Security system (at minimum wage) for 18 months will cover the amount paid back out to them, or their spouses, or for their survivors.

But in a previous post, you intimated that the gubmint numbers crunchers have this all dialed in and that they (and you) believe it's illegal immigrants who are keeping the sytem alfoat. This would be the same bunch of characters who figured the sytem would stay afloat forever, based on the premise that the average age of death was 65.

Uh-huh.

[FBD]

"The real problem with your position is that actuarial science is not subject to emotional rhetoric and spinning. The SS Administration uncountable actuaries who do nothing but cruch numbers all day-every day"

OK Ben, fine... then how about YOU stop with the emotional rhetoric about how illegal aliens, (particularly those from Mexico) are saving this country from bankruptcy, then shall we? That's a constant refrain from you.

Let's crunch some numbers: Let's be generous and say that an employer works his illegal worker 52 weeks out of the year, 6 days a week. He might make 22,000 dollars in a year.

The illegal alien will have paid less then $5000.00 into Social Security, at the end of 18 months work.

Now after only 18 months of paying in to the system, he's going to be eligible to collect Social In-Security, when he retires at 65. That will take about 1 year for the illegal to receive back all of that money, and from then on it's all deficit spending. You don't think a bunch of folks from Mexico won't figure out that all they have to do is come here, work 18 months to get on the gravy train, then retire in Mexico, where 400 bucks a month is enough to live on?

So, Ben, you still want to try to make us all believe that these illegal Mexican aliens are keeping our Social In-Security pyramid scheme afloat?

(Rhetorical question, I'm sure you do...)

[stboz]

We want jour steeenkin' country! Alla you tacos are belong to us!!

[FBD]

>"Maybe this is why the President wants to get Americans off of Social Security, to make way for his beloved Mexicans."<

Yeah, one big happy family. Actually, I think Mexico would have a revolution, if the border was closed, and we shut off the money spigot. So, that's probably the reason.

[Ben Ficklin]

In your second paragraph you use the phrase "Futhermore, the rumor is.."

You and all your cohorts have a sinister mind-set. Conspiricy Kooks.

Rather than let yourself be manipulated, you should doubt those who are trying to spoon-feed you.

Of course it takes more time and understanding, but you have the internet and with some digging, you can find the facts-reality.

[A. Pole]

Totalization Treaty bump!

[PGalt]

Thanks for your links & information.

[swampfox98]

Should the President sign this treaty, it would instantly make millions of Mexicans, both legal AND ILLEGAL, eligible for S.S. benefits.

The President will sign this treaty come hell or high water. It is time for the American people to wake up and realize that Bush is no longer the President of America, but President of the American Union.

He has done his best to bankrupt this country by encouraging the outsourcing of jobs. He has ignored the horrible living conditions of Americans who are forced to live among millions of illegals. Do you think he cares? No way. Bush answers to a higher world power, and that power has told him to destroy America as a sovereign natio, and become one with the European Union.

[ARCADIA]

Hillary is no dope, and she'll use this as a make or break issue in '08.

It is already a make or break issue.

[texastoo]

Hedge,

Richard Nixon gave us the Environmental Protection Agency in 1970.

[em2vn]

Good ole "W" he should think about rewarding the work of the American citizen not millions of illegal immigrants.
He just can't get away from that elitist, upper Northeastern, country club breeding.
I think he follows the path that renders all workers to be worthless, shiftless no goods and only the corporate leaders and those of their status have value.Therefore it is always worthwhile to always hire and support the lowest wage peon.

[hedgetrimmer]

Duly noted

[antisocial]

I usually just stuff the postsge paid envelope with as much stuff as I can get in it, then write somewhere conspicuously
that they can get all future contributions from their illegal alien friends.

[Nowhere Man]

If I read this correctly, it looks like Mexico isn't satisfied with the money it receives from the United States via oil sales, remittances, foreign aid, and tourism. Now they want a piece of the social security pie, as well.

I like Michael Savage's idea of making Mexico give us one barrel of oil for each illegal we have, according to Savage, it would be 20 million barrels for 20 million illegals. I don't think Savage goes far enough and in this case I'm more of a radical than he (although I would support Savage's original idea if mine would be turned down) where I would bump it up to 2, 5 or even 10 barrels for each illegal.

[FBD]

I note you entirely dodged the question, typical of you, and "your cohorts".

You are a govt. bureuacRat, aren't you Bennie.?

BTW, Why don't you explain the undefined Bush guest worker policy, if you know of it? Almost 5 years into his Presidency, and all we can do, is guess about the details of his so called "guest worker" program, and how long they need to work before becoming eligible for SS benefits.

The so called "rumors" that were floated out there came from substantial sources. All of which are more reliable then your spin, and obfuscation.

Better get back to work, at your cubicle, Bennie boy. Us taxpayers expect you guys to earn your living, not spending it at your computer as a spokesman for La Raza.

[FBD]

Oh, and again, the question was:
If an illegal alien has a phony Social Security number, and/or is using someone else's which he stole, which is in itself felony fraud, why should an illegal citizen be entitled to any S.S. monies?

But you won't answer it, you'll go off on your "conspiracy kook" rant again won't you?

[FBD]

sadly, it appears you are right about your observation...

regards

[Ben Ficklin]

In the past, you have admitted to me that you realize that there will be no mass deportations nor border length fences built.

Likewise, I'm sure you will admit that the prisons needed to house 10-20 million felons will not be built.

You need to accept practical reality.

[FBD]

Stop your obfuscating and answer the question.
Why should someone who has FALSIFIED SS numbers, or other ID documents, and have FRAUDULENTLY misrepresented themselves, via FORGED ID documents, be eligible for any Social Security benefits?
Do you deny that forgery and fraud are FELONIES?


By the way, the GAO has stated:

Proof of eligibility:

"(The agency) does not consider the work-authorization status of the individual when they earned the wages," the inspector general's report said. "It only considers whether the individual can prove he or she paid Federal Insurance Contribution Act (FICA) taxes as part of this work."

"To qualify for Social Security benefits, Mexicans must prove they worked in the United States at least 18 months."

[Ben Ficklin]

There you have it:

"The individual can prove he or she paid FICA"

The issue of the criminal act(fraudulant papers) has absolutly nothing to do with the money. If someone wants to prosecute them, they can. They won't because the cost to benefit ratio is outta sight.