How linux could overthrow Microsoft

MIT Enterprise Technology Review ^ | June 2005 (issue) | Charles Ferguson

[Wombat101]

And furthermore, I am well aware of the history of computer programming and it's languages (after all, I was a systems automation programmer for 10 years). In fact, I'll wager that I was building and programming the damn things before you were even born. Another poster on this thread made the same mistake of not carefully reading the post before making a comment on my grammar.

Now I know why every Linux project I've ever seen has failed spectacularly: it's biggest boosters can't read!

[Utilizer]

I used to like Linux years ago but now it seems bloated and slow

I hear you. I used to like Linux as well, and kept hoping that the difficulties in attempting to set it up as a useable desktop would be refined more and more fully as time went on and newer versions were developed. However, I still have the same problems with the newer versions that I had since I first started working with RedHat 4.2, and even the bootable CDs give Me difficulties with only one or two exceptions.

I am currently running a 'Doze OS with Outpost Firewall as protection from hackers, and it 'Just Works'. I still can not find a comparable set up in all of the Linux versions I tried. Another of the things I appreciated about Linux was its ability to support 'older' pc boxes, but lately that seems to be disappearing as well. I have also been keeping track of items such a Wine in an attempt to finally allow Me to run My favourite CAD programs under Linux, but even since waiting from about 1996 and WFW 3.11 nothing has advanced to the point where I can use it.

As for the Bootable CDs, little or no detection of a standard Serial Mouse (every distro seems to assume a PS/2 mouse and keyboard), no assistance for machines that can not boot from a CD (with the exception of one distro whose name escapes Me at the moment), and and icons / windows that are intended for 1028x764 resolution by default -again because the 'nix people assume that everyone and their brother finds that the optimal configuration. Yes, there are some options to run at a lower rez, but try using it when things such as the 'ReadMe' display from the File Manager gui extends below the screen and you can not resize it and even when you scroll down to the end of the file the last few lines remain hidden below the bottom of the screen. That and some of the icons on the lower right hand side of the desktop are not seen in the 640x480 rez and are only viewable in the 1024x768 desktop -and some of the 'lower-end' machines that the Linux proponents brag about Linux being so useful for simply do not have the capability of displaying that high a rez.

Not to mention three-CD distros that will only run on 128 Megs of RAM as a minimum setup. Sheesh, I still have an offbrand notebook that has eight Megs of memory (not upgradeable) that runs 'doze no problem -but dies with any version of Linux that I have tried. And no, it does not have a CD drive, just a tired floppy drive on its last legs.

And do not even get Me started about finding someone that will help with finding a similar firewall to the Outpost one that I find so useful. Most of the few responses go along the lines of 'N00b, just use (insert oddly named program here) with a CLI of (insert collection of letters and period here) with the (insert gobbledygook collection of dash-letters and / or forward-slash letters here)'. As if anyone that is not willing to spend ungodly amounts of time typing in huge amounts of letters and numbers is not worthy of using Linux at all.

Or a method of using a well-known CAD program within Linux somehow...

[pyx]

By the way, I know how it is when something new comes along and makes all things seem possible. I felt the same way when I first learned REXX programming and applied it to systems automation, however, C and it's derivatives, COBOL and PL-I are stil here. To this day, nothing has replaced Assembler code, either.

Dude yourself. Your original from #49 is above. You've been corrected. COBOL and PL/1 came about 10 years before C. You've been publically spanked. Accept it graciously, d0oD.

[Utilizer]

Bump for later reading...

[chilepepper]

...and a lobster can't tell its being boiled slow.

the turning point for me was when thunderbird under Linux was able to spawn off open-office for attached word documents with a reasonable set of fonts. i still have a dual-boot laptop next to my workstation that i would read these emails on w/ windows, and find that i never use it for that anymore and run linux on it instead.

i was always willing to give microsoft the benefit of the doubt, and figured i'd give XP a chance. of course, that was before XP *spontaneously* decided to convert my file system from VFAT32 to NTFS one of the times i was rebooting it. do a google search on converting back from NTFS to FAT32 sometime -- partition magic used to be able to handle this sort of thing, but not anymore -- its not really supported by anyone anymore.

...and before i discovered that 'lsass.exe' was writing to my laptops' hard disk every two seconds. do a google search on "lsass.exe" and "constant I/O" and see how many "solutions" you come up with, then see how many solutions *actually work*

i must have tried every single one that was suggested, turned off a gazillion services, indexing, etc, etc -- still hear this water torture krkk, krkk, krkk on my laptop every two seconds. how many people suffer with this without knowing it since they have XP on workstation and don't watch the activity light? on my laptop the access make a definite noise, and the XP task manager show CONSTANT reads an write by lsass.exe even when the system is completely IDLE!

the problem with microsoft stuff is plainly evident to me: microsoft does not have enough people to work on their products and actually understand what they do. this explains my problems, but also SP2 problems, worms, viruses, SPAM, spyware and all the other "value added" by microsoft.

this is why open source is winning the battle - modern software needs every eye possible, in as many countries as possible in order to understand and keep modern software as bug free as possible. a modern computer is just way to complex for it to be any other way...

[Wombat101]

And again, learn to READ. Here's a hint: when a comma is included after a clause it indicates that a new clause is about to begin. In this case, the comma is used in place of the conjunction AND.

I'll make it even easier for you to understand by deconstructing and re-writing that part of the sentence in basic 4th grade English:

"...C and it's derivates": This refers to C and it's follow-on's, such as C+, and C++. One could stretch this eben further to include C-based coding such as that used in IBM's C-LIST and Candle Corporations AF/OPERATOR software. The references to C and it's progeny is followed by a COMMA. In English, a comma is used to indicate that a new clause is about to begin. The comma is often used in place of the conjunction AND.

Since you are too stupid to understand what I'm talking about, we'll now re-write this sentence so as to save your braincells.

"....C and it's derivatives AND Cobol AND PL/1 are still here..."

Note that without the use of the simple comma I had to use the conjunction AND twice in order for your tiny mind to understand what I've written. This, of course, assumes that you understand it now. Since you have drunk the Kool-Aid on Linux, however, I doubt that even that simnpler rendition of a sentence that you have the opportunity to read sixty time by now, will suffice.

Now you have been publicly spanked, RETARD....

[jpsb]

Yea, I used to be able to run Linux as an OS on a 486 with 16 meg of RAM, XWindows for a user interface a Oracle as a database. Everything worked fine. These days a P1 with 48 meg of ram crawls run Linux but win2000 runs just fine. No more Linux for me. If I put Unix on a old box it will be free bsd osx, aix, or Solaris.

[Utilizer]

True. I still have some 486 motherboards lying around, and even an old 386 or several. Most of the boxes I have are set up for 586 or 686, with the slowest one currently being a P200 with 64M of ram -My 'internet' box. After all, how much do you really need to display a web page?

The default memory I run on most of My boxes (four) is 64M, with a fifrth box for some video work at 128M. I have tried many different versions of Linux and am becoming more and more disappointed with the lack of support for the machines I work with. I would really like to switch over and have a 'nix only setup, but still find that it is not really suited for the desktop as of yet.

[Utilizer]

I just took stock of My setups, and I notice that a few boxes are still running RedHat v4.2 with an Xwindows gui. Depressing, actually. An old distro will run on most of My boxes, but very few of the newer ones will. Even My previous favourite, Peanut Linux, now just dies in the initial install phase when I try to put it on one of My machines. So I suppose I will continue to run RH4.2 where possible, and the old 'Doze distro (W95OSR2 or pehaps W98). They 'Just Work'. No danger of Linux toppling MS anytime soon from where I stand.

And please, no flames from the Linux zealots. I happen to like Linux, and have tried continually for many years to not only recommend it to people but to try to use it Myself. However, the two things I need from it most (well, three actually -I need it to work properly on My machines), namely a configurable firewall like Outpost Firewall and the ability to run My CAD program (there is no Linux version of it) are still forcing Me to run a 'Doze setup to this day. Until those problems are solved, at least for Me, Linux is not ready for the desktop, not matter what is claimed for it.

[jpsb]

One of these days a I will take a close look at free bsd, if it is still a nice clean Unix OS it will run fine one an older box.

[Utilizer]

Hmm. There's an idea. I have not tried that one, but considering that it is less popular than Linux (ducks to avoid flying objects from the Linux advocates) I do not know if it will solve My application difficulties. *sigh* Too bad. I would really, really like to move away from a 'doze desktop, and I happen to like the way KDE looks.

[pyx]

ROFLMAO !
You're not terribly original in your reply and insult but, I sort of expected you might lack imagination. You seem sort of obsessive about that comma. It is after all, pretty much all you have to cling to. Then again, maybe you were too busy kicking college graduates out of your office and figuring out how to BS your way through things, instead of maybe taking remedial English. Your Clintonian explanation would probably cut it over on DU.
By the way, did you know that COBOL and PL/1 were developed about 10 years before the C language ? And did you know how funny you look with that giant vein poppin' out on your forehead and just pulsin' away ? You've amused me enough and you can have the last word now.

[Wombat101]

Okay, one more time because you apparently have nothing better to do except argue a moot point way after you've lost.

a) It has been repeatedly proven that you lack a basic knowledge of grammar.

b) it has been repeatedly clarified that 1) I never asserted that COBOL and others were derivatives of C, 2) I never intended to create a time-line of the history of computer languages and 3) That you are an idiot.

c) You have lost the argument on 1) it's merits (or lack thereof), 2) you're shocking ignorance and 3) at the hands of someone who knows the business indise and out, from top to bottom.

d) As for me BS'ing, I worked my way up the ranks and have scraped plenty like you off my shoes along the way. I have forgotten more than you can ever claim to have known after 20 years.

e) If you showed up in my office looking for a job, I'd hand you a broom, since you can't read an know nothing about the subject of this thread.

f) I refuse to continue wasting time on you.

[Casaubon]

yer a meany!!

:P

[Casaubon]

I like linux...er..freebsd
I mainly use it for server/ftp/print/piratesoftware/etc reasons :)

but to be HONEST!

linux has a long way to go before it is as user friendly as windows.(my geekness cringes at that statement)

but its true.

Whyle unix based systems are more stable, your OS is not the reason you use your computer.

i use my computer to work, play WoW(UndeadLords.net), etc...in otherwords applications.
Until unix based systems(pick your flavor) have the newest apps like windows they will always be 2nd fiddle.

2 cents.

[pyx]

someone who knows the business indise and out

ROFLAMO

[Halfmanhalfamazing]

^^^^^^^^^^^Thanks, but I asked how many million Linux users there are, and you gave me stats for Mac users.^^^^^^^^^^

I gave both.(this was the second link in the post you're replying to)

http://wired-vig.wired.com/news/mac/0,2125,64504,00.html?tw=wn_story_related

[wired quote]After taking account for piracy, Gartner said 2004 worldwide market share for Mac OS is 2.5 percent, versus 1.3 percent for Linux. However, this will change next year. Gartner predicts in 2005, the Mac will slip to 2 percent market share, and Linux will grow to 2.1 percent. By 2008, Linux will have grown to 3.4 percent, while the Mac will remain at 2 percent.[wired quote]

I hope you don't take offense to using percentages instead of raw numbers; (said) millions of users.

^^^^^^^^^^ According to Doctor HTML's statistics for last week, the Mac platform share for web user agents was 3.77, and Linux was 0.25.^^^^^^^^^^^

Doctor HTML? Uhhh.... what's the basis for their numbers, their own website/product? Google put it at 1% in June 2004.

Both IDC and Gartner do market research which I'm sure(yes, I don't know what/how they do) is based upon more than just one source.

I doubt IDC's numbers, but Gartners don't seem a stretch. Given that both state 2005 as the year, I don't have a problem going with that.

Consider this....

http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtml?type=technologyNews&storyID=8511006

I think I've said it twice in this discussion.(I might not have, as I discuss linux in quite a few places)

Poorer countries are the basis for my argument. They can't afford anything else. China would be at the top. With MS's continual clamp down on piracy you get increased marketshare. That and linux very much is usable to the average person.

I doubt the counter's numbers as well, but who knows.