Xbox 360 demos running on Macs

Cnet News ^ | May 13, 2005 | Richard Shim

[Panerai]

The nifty clips of video games supporting Microsoft's new Xbox 360 console are running on Apple machines, Microsoft confirmed on Friday.

"We purchased a number of Apple G5's because very specific hardware components of the G5 allow developers to emulate some of the technology behind future Xbox products and services," a Microsoft spokesperson said in a statement. "This is an interim development tool that will be replaced with a more powerful and comprehensive solution later."

The current systems shown at product introductions are prototypes. Final systems are expected to come out in all three major regions--North America, Europe and Asia--by the end of the year.

The prices for the new consoles have yet to be announced, but executives have said they won't be released until after the E3 game conference in Los Angeles next week.

Some details have been released on the new console, such as its 20GB hard drive, DVD-ROM drive and 500MHz ATI graphics processor, but others will be announced during the conference. Executives have said that up to 40 titles for the Xbox 360 will be announced by the end of the year.

The new console from Microsoft is based on a similar IBM PowerPC architecture used in Apple computers--the Xbox 360 uses three 3.2GHz symmetrical cores, according to the company. Apple has been using PowerPC chips since 1994 and Apple Chief Executive Steve Jobs has said the company is happy with IBM's PowerPC family of chips.

[Panerai]

Mac ping !

[A Balrog of Morgoth]

LMFAO.

I'm a Windows PC drone, but still, this is just plain funny.

[ColdSteelTalon]

IBM's As/400 iSeries systems uses the power PC chip. Rock Solid.

[lsee]

I got yer Mac ping right here!

[Terpfen]

Why is it funny? Xbox360 uses three PowerPC cores. The development kits had BETTER have a PowerPC CPU on them.

[A Balrog of Morgoth]

Why is it funny? It's hilarious. Microsoft using Apples to demonstrate their next console?

[Nick Danger]

Well, it took twenty years, but I was wrong. So I have to 'fess up to my mistake.

In 1986, IBM announced something called the RT/PC, the "Risc Technology Personal Computer," to much fanfare. I thought it was a load of hype, and I said so in a letter published in Electronic News, then the industry bible. I said no matter how good it was, they would never achieve the economies of scale that Intel had, and so the chip itself would never be cost-effective.

I underestimated how persistent those IBM guys can be. Here they are in 2005, and they have gotten design wins for a direct descendant of the 801 processor in the RT/PC, in both the Sony and the Microsoft next-generation game boxes. With that, they are in a volume league with Intel.

I love it when a plan comes together, even if it wasn't my plan. So hats off to some very persistent engineers and marketeers, who have made a 20-year dream come true. Not bad for chip guys from New Yawk.

Bill Gates, you're next.

[Panerai]

Or, Ironic

ironic = Poignantly contrary to what was expected or intended.

[Panerai]

"I love it when a plan comes together"

[RightOnTheLeftCoast]

What astonishes me most is the quantum leap between the current Xbox and the next-gen one they're talking about.

Compare: Xbox has, what, a Pentium III? Versus "the Xbox 360 uses three 3.2GHz symmetrical [RISC] cores", per the article.

That's a far bigger leap than from a VW Beetle engine to what's under the hood of the hottest Ferrari. It's just mind-boggling. It's like comparing the spark you get with a barbecue igniter to a thunderbolt. Just... damn.

[Terpfen]

The Xbox360 basically IS a Mac, if you only consider the PowerPC CPU cores. Nintendo uses the PowerPC chips also. They're IBM CPUs, not Apple CPUs, but giving developers G5s is a quick, simple way to get their projects started.

I'm not seeing the humor.

[ThinkDifferent]

That's a far bigger leap than from a VW Beetle engine to what's under the hood of the hottest Ferrari.

It's impressive, but it's not *that* much of a leap. The Xbox CPUs appear to be based on the Cell core, which is fairly simple PowerPC design. It can run at high clock speeds, but isn't as efficient per cycle as the PowerPCs in Macs. (That's why a dual 2.0GHz Mac can run the software that will eventually be on the 3 3.2GHz Xbox processors). Still, getting that kind of power for $300 or so is not bad at all, especially once hackers figure out how to run Linux or OS X on it.

[RightOnTheLeftCoast]

Really, I think it is rather a big leap. Let's estimate:

Beetle engine: 40hp or so (maybe downhill).

Hot Ferrari: shall we be super-generous and guess 800hp?

So, that's a factor of 20. I suspect that's a smaller ratio than Pentium III vs. triple-Cell, at least for math and array operations of the sort needed for games and graphics.

Wonder what sort of weapons-related restrictions the Feds will slap on this puppy.

[RightOnTheLeftCoast]

Of course, I'm talking about the original, air-cooled Beetles...

[RightOnTheLeftCoast]

OS X will be tough, as there's a bunch of magic in the Macs' firmware. But Linux should happen within a couple months of the Xbox 360's release. A given Cell's inherent networkability, this would be one heck of a slice of a pretty impressive massively parallel computing array.

[Terpfen]

So, that's a factor of 20. I suspect that's a smaller ratio than Pentium III vs. triple-Cell...

Xbox360 isn't using the Cell processor. Or did you mean to type triple-core?

[RightOnTheLeftCoast]

"this is just plain funny"

Actually, I'd love to see all of Microsoft using Macs, especially its engineers. What could be more promising for Windows users like you and me? Microsoft ripped-off the Mac before. Next time, maybe they'll get it right.

[Terpfen]

See my #17. Xbox360 uses a triple-core PowerPC, not the Cell. The Cell processor is a joint Toshiba-Sony-IBM processor, with IBM doing the manufacturing. Sony isn't going to let its main rival use its Cell processor, which is already confirmed to be the CPU of the PS3. The only thing we don't know is how many cores the PS3's Cell will have. Rumor is that Sony's trying to find a sweet spot, and they're shooting for 8 or 9.

[RightOnTheLeftCoast]

Maybe I'm confused. See post 13.

Whatever, if it's using a three-core PowerPC chip and not a Cell-based chip as post 13 surmised, that's just as impressive.