Is the "Nuclear" terrorist threat real, believeable or more hype than reality?

July 14, 2005 | Ice Flyer

[ICE-FLYER]

"The Nuclear threat is very real." So warns some from The Aspen Strategy Group. We have lately been treated to interviews on Michael Savage, articles in the nations major news papers and the occasional mention in televised media.

What I want to know is this; now that many of you in here have read, seen, ore heard it, what is your critical analysis of it all?

As for me I don't put much stock in the story of 20 suitcase nukes just awaiting their order to go off at the same time. If the Bib Ladens of the world had them they would have used them as soon as they could. It has been claimed they have had one or more of these bombs since 1998 or 2000. If this is so why use aircraft to hit buildings in New York?

I am sure conspiracy theories abound as to the locale of the "suitcase" nukes, but I do not discount that terrorists would love more than anything to have one so to me the threat is real but not in the manner as described by some.

Your thoughts?

[Perdogg]

I heard a report that we will hit with something in next 90 days.

[Paloma_55]

I am 100% certain that we will be hit with a dirty bomb or some other form of WMD that will render the island of Manhattan a wasteland.

Why?

Because, that is what they want to do and we are not doing what is necessary to stop them.

The borders are porous.
Our enemies are tenacious.
Our government is embedded with Democrats who have determined that Bush is the enemy, not Al Quaida.

[Thud]

Not, unless the definition of "nuke" does not include chain reactions. Most anyone who can steal an x-ray machine and doesn't care about living much longer can powder the radioactive source in it which provides the x-rays, and dump the stuff in a city street. Some expertise would be required to powder the source without taking a lethal radiation dose in the process, and about as much (though different) expertise to use a small amount of regular explosives to spread the powder over a wider area.

All of this is feasible but the stuff wouldn't be lethal, or hard to clean up, unless inhaled somehow. The major effect would be to create headlines screaming "EEK - A NUKE!"

Making a for-real dangerous dirty bomb would require considerable expertise and work, and then the thing still wouldn't be that lethal. It would be more of a financial problem for the cleanup.

Anything involving a chain reaction would be still more difficult to do. Those are the things to worry about.

[Names Ash Housewares]

There is nothing that the islamo-facist zealots are not capable of. Nuke or no nuke. They dream of an islamic earth. Death to all infidels.

This isnt a war on Islam. Yet. Its their choice. Not our wish.

And most muslims know this. Most muslims know that if the terorists go too far.....

Should we start losing cities.

Mecca is gone.

I think they know that.

We are a super power. and if its us or them. Its gonna be them.

[cvq3842]

I will bookmark, since I have little info but would like to see what others have to say.

I remember hearing that the "suitcase nukes," even if indeed missing and in enemy hands, are very hard to maintain and would not be operable if properly maintained.

Apparently building a primitive, Hiroshima-style nuke is relatively "easy" but for the nuclear fuel needed. Tracking the possible fuel sources is therefore said to be the best way to track this. (There are also some fine-tuning type issues with respect to a bomb, but again getting the uranium is the tough thing.)

I have no doubt that there are terrorists who would have no moral qualms about nuking a US city. there may be other strategic reasons in their minds for not doing so - of for waiting until several nukes could be used in several cities at once - but I don't think a feeling on the terrorists' part that such an attack would be "inhuman" or "excessive" would be part of the picture.

Finally, I believe the government is also capable of, and is planning to, use its capabilities to detect the radiological "fingerprint" of any nuclear weapon used if, God forbid, the worst happens. IF they can do this quickly and effectively, and IF our enemies know this, and IF they care whether we can do this or not, it might possible be some kind of deterrent. That seems an awful slender reed to grab onto, though. Thanks in advance for any corrections, additional info, etc.

[tallhappy]

The suitcase nukes in US has been put forth since shortly after 911.

It has come from questionable people.

[cvq3842]

I hope you are wrong.

I fear you are right.

It only has to happen once.

I have to unfortunately agree that the "odds" of it happening in, say, the next ten years are alarmingly high.

PLEASE, anyone, correct me if I'm wrong! Thanks in advance.

[Iscool]

I have no doubt that there are Russian suitcase nukes in this country, under the control of the Russians...That's why they were built...

There's no doubt that nuclear tipped missles are 20 or so miles off our coasts sitting on submarines waiting to be launched...

The Russians claim some of the suitcases are missing...Some may have been stolen...Some sold...

If the terrorists have one, or more, could be many reasons why they haven't used them...The terrorists could have used hundreds of suicide bombers in the U.S. but they haven't, YET...

[Hatteras]

The explanation I gathered from hearing Paul Williams on Michael Savage last night was that the weapons are here but the knowledge and technical know-how to set these things off were still being developed. For instance, one or two terrorists who were part of last year's list of seven most wanted and believed to be in the U.S. were actually, at that time, taking nuclear physics type courses at McGill(?)University in Montreal. They fled before authorities could catch up with them but they stole alot of technical documentation. Williams was unsure of their whereabouts now (whether they were apprehended or not). The other problem (my own understanding) is that there might be a shelf life with key ingredients to contend with.

I was disappointed because Paul Williams had problems gathering his thoughts and Savage was too impatient and kept cutting him off with more questions or comments.

[ex-Texan]

You may access some reports about suitcase nukes, briefcase nukes, and major problems with our borders Here There have been reports about major problems with Mexico, Canada and our open borders for months. It is clear to me that unguarded and wide open borders represent a "clear and present danger" to our National Security.

I do not have any opinion on the ultimate truth of the opinions expressed by the former FBI consultant who was a guest on Savage Nation. The people who ought to know the truth are not talking about it. I hope and pray that he is mistaken.

Fighting a war on terrorism overseas without locking down our borders is a major "mistake," to borrow a term from Bill Clinton.

[cvq3842]

I remember reading somewhere that the al-Qaeda types decided that in the short run, trying to pick off our allies (Spain, England, etc.) with terrorist attacks abroad was a more "profitable" strategy for them than attacking the US.

[lugsoul]

More hype than reality. But it is easier to keep you in line if you are scared sh#%less of this kind of stuff.

[maestro]

??......"The Computer-Banking-Nuclear threat is very real." So warns some from The Aspen 'IMF' Strategy Group....????

Sounds correct.....?

/BP gas prices in the U.S.A.?

[ICE-FLYER]

It has come from questionable people"

There is no doubt that much can be sensationalized and even outright made up. In a world of ever increasing ability to get information you can also be inundated with very credible sounding information. We need to be ever mindful to discern the truth in such matters. That’s why I posted this. To that end who then is questionable? The interviewee last night on Savage was rather credible to me, but in light of my military career and training I see that its a bit weak due to my thought that if they had a single or multiple nukes they would have used them by now.

[brownsfan]

"Most anyone who can steal an x-ray machine and doesn't care about living much longer can powder the radioactive source in it which provides the x-rays, and dump the stuff in a city street"

Your conceptualization is ok, but your details are flawed. If you can get nuclear material from an x-ray machine, you're doing something no one else can.

X-rays are generated by bombarding a tungsten target in a vaccuum tube with very high energy electrons. No nukes there.

I think you are thinking of a nuclear medicine scanner. Quite different, and much more tightly controlled than X-ray devices. However, you only need the source from a nuclear medicine machine, not the whole machine.

[Diana in Wisconsin]

"We are a super power. and if its us or them. Its gonna be them."

Amen to that. I've been ready to flatten Mecca for quite some time, now...

[Diana in Wisconsin]

I have a friend who tracks this stuff for fun. He sent me this article the other day. I report. You decide. ;) Personally? I think it's coming. And it's going to be ugly.

2005 WorldNetDaily.com

WASHINGTON – Rep. Tom Tancredo, R-Colo., a staunch critic of the federal government's lax immigration and border enforcement policies, said yesterday he would request a briefing from the Justice Department on information it has on plans revealed by WND this week for a nuclear attack on the U.S. by al-Qaida terrorists.

Tancredo said he was greatly alarmed by the report and would seek whatever information he could get from the nation's law enforcement authorities – either in classified or unclassified reports.

Al-Qaida's plans, known as "America's Hiroshima" according to captured terrorists and terrorist documents, calls for the multiple detonation of nuclear weapons, already in the possession of Osama bin Laden's operatives currently inside the U.S. The agents and arms having been smuggled across the U.S.-Mexico border with the help of the MS-13 street gang and other organized crime groups, according to the report originating in Joseph Farah's G2 Bulletin, a premium, online intelligence newsletter published by the founder of WorldNetDaily.

The attack is designed to kill at least 4 million Americans.

Al-Qaida has obtained at least 40 nuclear weapons from the former Soviet Union – including suitcase nukes, nuclear mines, artillery shells and even some missile warheads, according to the report. In addition, documents captured in Afghanistan show al-Qaida had plans to assemble its own nuclear weapons with material it purchased on the black market.

In addition to detonating its own nuclear weapons already planted in the U.S., military sources also say there is evidence to suggest al-Qaida is paying former Russian Spetznaz, or special forces operatives, to assist the terrorist group in locating nuclear weapons formerly concealed inside the U.S. by the Soviet Union during the Cold War. Bin Laden's group is also paying nuclear scientists from Russia and Pakistan to maintain its existing nuclear arsenal and assemble additional weapons with the materials it has invested hundreds of millions in procuring over a period of 10 years.

The plans for the devastating nuclear attack on the U.S. have been under development for more than a decade. It is designed as a final deadly blow of defeat to the U.S., which is seen by al-Qaida and its allies as "the Great Satan."

At least half the nuclear weapons in the al-Qaida arsenal were obtained for cash from Chechen terrorist allies.

But the most disturbing news is that high-level U.S. officials now believe at least some of those weapons have been smuggled into the U.S. for use in the near future in major cities as part of this "American Hiroshima" plan, according to an upcoming book, "The al-Qaida Connection: International Terrorism, Organized Crime and the Coming Apocalypse," by Paul L. Williams, a former FBI consultant.

According to Williams, former CIA Director George Tenet informed President Bush one month after the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks that at least two suitcase nukes had reached al-Qaida operatives in the U.S. President Bush reportedly went "through the roof" upon hearing the news, prompting him to order his national security team to give nuclear terrorism priority over every other threat to America.

"Each suitcase weighed between 50 and 80 kilograms (approximately 110 to 176 pounds) and contained enough fissionable plutonium and uranium to produce an explosive yield in excess of two kilotons," wrote Williams. "One suitcase bore the serial number 9999 and the Russian manufacturing date of 1988. The design of the weapons, Tenet told the president, is simple. The plutonium and uranium are kept in separate compartments that are linked to a triggering mechanism that can be activated by a clock or a call from the cell phone."

It is worth noting Bush failed to translate this policy into securing the U.S.-Mexico border through which the nuclear weapons and al-Qaida operatives are believed to have passed with the help of the MS-13 smugglers. He did, however, order the building of underground bunkers away from major metropolitan areas for use by federal government managers following an attack.

Bin Laden, according to Williams, has nearly unlimited funds to spend on his nuclear terrorism plan because he has remained in control of the Afghanistan-produced heroin industry. Poppy production has greatly increased even while U.S. troops are occupying the country, he writes. Al-Qaida has developed close relations with the Albanian Mafia, which assists in the smuggling and sale of heroin throughout Europe and the U.S.

Some of that money is used to pay off the notorious MS-13 street gang between $30,000 and $50,000 for each sleeper agent smuggled into the U.S. from Mexico. The sleepers are also provided with phony identification, most often bogus matricula consular ID cards indistinguishable from Mexico's official ID, now accepted in the U.S. to open bank accounts and obtain driver's licenses.

The Bush administration's unwillingness to secure the U.S.-Mexico border has puzzled and dismayed a growing number of activists and ordinary citizens who see it as the No. 1 security threat to the nation. The Minuteman organization is planning a major mobilization of thousands of Americans this fall designed to shut down the entire 2,000-mile border as it did in April with a 23-mile stretch in Arizona.

According to Williams' sources, thousands of al-Qaida sleeper agents have now been forward deployed into the U.S. to carry out their individual roles in the coming "American Hiroshima" plan.

Bin Laden's goal, according to the book, is to kill at least 4 million Americans, 2 million of whom must be children. Only then, bin Laden has said, would the crimes committed by America on the Arab and Muslim world be avenged.

There is virtually no doubt among intelligence analysts al-Qaida has obtained fully assembled nuclear weapons, according to Williams. The only question is how many. Estimates range between a dozen and 70.

The future plan, according to captured al-Qaida agents and documents, suggests the attacks will take place simultaneously in major cities throughout the country – including New York, Boston, Washington, Las Vegas, Miami, Chicago and Los Angeles.

In response to the G2 Bulletin revelations, Chris Simcox, founder of the Minuteman Civil Defense Corps, a citizen action group demanding the U.S. government take control of its borders, said an immediate military presence on the borders is now imperative "to stop the overwhelming influx of unidentified, potentially hostile and seditious persons coming across at an alarming rate."

"Terrorists have carte blanche to carry practically anything they want across our national line at this time," he said. "As ordinary citizens have warned this government for years, the only surprising part about the new information reported here is that nothing apocalyptic from Mexican-border weapons trafficking has yet happened. Terrorism has reared its ugly head in London again these past few days, and as we know all too well we are not immune in this country.

"At this point, the next attempt to attack America at home is just a matter of 'when,' not 'if.' And our unsecured borders have surely contributed to this threat – yet our government officials continue to fiddle while our nation's margin of security and safety burns away. The president and Congress had better wake up before they have to answer for another devastating terrorist incursion on our own soil."

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=45246

[Thud]

oops, thanks. It's good to know that the sources are harder to obtain than I thought. I recall an old story about a truck with scrap metal from Mexico setting off the radiation detectors at Los Alamos. There was a radioactive source, or pieces of it, from a discarded medical machine in the scrap.

[laishly]

Nuclear weapons are not simple devices. They must be precisely and constantly maintained to be operational. Three factors are significant, in my opinion. First, the so-called suitcase nukes from the Soviet era are most likely inoperable, even if they still exist. Second, the islamofascists are pretty primitive when it comes to advanced technology. Third, if and when they get a nuclear weapon they will use it at the earliest opportunity because they can't insure its continued operability for an extended period in the field, especially if it is positioned in this country.

The most likely scenario would be a nuclear explosion in a shipping container in the port of NY, Miami, or LA soon after its arrival, but even pulling that off would not be easy for them.

I think that Savage's scenarios are a little paranoid and fantastic. However, you are not paranoid just because you think someone wants to kill you, and it doesn't hurt to be cautious. Open borders is not only not cautious, it's asking to be attacked.