NASA Propulsion Strategy Reaches Back While Looking Ahead

Space.com ^ | October 3, 2005 | Brian Berger

[orionblamblam]

Pratt & Whitney has the license to manufacture them, and I believe they do jsut that with the RD-180s for the Atlas V.

So why are you opposed to using better performing *American* engines like the RD-180?

[Paul Ross]

Not Invented Here Syndrome

[Paul Ross]

NASA: Analysis Paralysis: Kick some behinds - move forward - show us something new

Show us the money.

[add925]

Show us the money.

Well said...

[orionblamblam]

That's your issue.

[Paul Ross]

That's your issue.

Perhaps. But consider that we want to be supporting AMERICAN space infrastructure...not foreign.

The sheer scale and scope of the American aeronautical/aerospace diaspora is really one of the untold tragedies of our time.

We should not be aiding and abetting that cavalierly or thoughtlessly.

[orionblamblam]

> But consider that we want to be supporting AMERICAN space infrastructure...not foreign.

OK. So... you want to re-develop (and go through the whole requalification process, costing billions and years) a low performing American engine rather than buy a high performing American engine off the shelf.

Makes sense.

[RightWhale]

There's no way to control or shut it down after its lit.

It can be shut down. Once it is shut down it cannot be restarted.

There is a port at the top end. If it is necessary to stop firing due to some anomaly or if the firing needs to be ended due to launch requirements, the port is blown open. Exhaust gases pass out the port, as well as the exhaust nozzle, and the pressure inside the rocket falls below what is necessary to sustain combustion. The flame goes out.

[Paul Ross]

Nope. No billions needed. No "low performing" engines, either.

[orionblamblam]

> Nope. No billions needed. No "low performing" engines, either.

Wait. Then why were you argueing in favor of the F-1?

[Paul Ross]

Sentimental favorite.

I recognize it isn't going to happen.

"Engineers, they're ALWAYS changing things"
---courtesy of Dr. McCoy.

[tet68]

Moon derived methane.

[SunkenCiv]

Probable Ping Possibilities, alliteratively speaking.

[SunkenCiv]

related topic:

Booster builder to design new rocket
www.flatoday.com | December 8, 2005 | JOHN KELLY
Posted on 12/08/2005 2:23:31 PM PST by tricky_k_1972
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1536667/posts

regarding Saturn V vs STS:

http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Chamber/2838/space.html

[snip]

Economics

Here are two comparative costs in 1995 dollars for getting a kilogram of payload into orbit. They're derived from figures in Space Travel by Bova & Lewis.

Delivery cost/kilogram
Saturn V $7253
Shuttle $22000

This is based on 2 Saturn V launches a year and 5-7 Shuttle launches. Forward claims the current cost to orbit is $5000/kg...

[KevinDavis]

[fallujah-nuker]

Easier to start from scratch or go with Shuttle derived.

I had wondered if the H2O2/Kerosene engine that Beal was developing would be adaptable as a booster.

[fallujah-nuker]

Easier to start from scratch or go with Shuttle derived.

I had wondered if the H2O2/Kerosene engine that Beal was developing would be adaptable as a booster.

[orionblamblam]

> I had wondered if the H2O2/Kerosene engine that Beal was developing would be adaptable as a booster.

Would be if it existed, but it doesn't. Scattered to the four winds when Beal went buggo and shut down the effort.

[MRMEAN]

Space exploration will never be practical or economic with chemical rockets.

[fallujah-nuker]

The new Shuttle-Derived Heavy Lifter configuration: Two SRB (2.6Million lbs thrust per) + 5 X 0.5 Million for each SSME = 7.7 Million lbs total.

I wonder if the RS-68 had been considered, it was designed for a single use while the RS-24 (SSME) was designed for reuse. If the launcher is totally expended the engine will only be used once anyway. Of course if you produce the RS-24 at a higher rate I imagine the costs will come down. I think it had to be overhauled after each flight anyway so a lot of the effort was expended. Just curious about this.