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Secret court modified wiretap requests
Seattle Post-Intelligencer ^ | 12/24/05 | Stewart M. Powell

Posted on 12/27/2005 7:17:53 AM PST by B Knotts

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To: savedbygrace
Has Robertson actually come out now and said that's why he resigned? The only thing I read was unnamed co-workers said that's why he resigned, but he wasn't making any statements.

That's all I know, though I think the unnamed co-workers are telling the truth. If it was health or personal or some other reason than protest, he would have denied it, IMO. Clinton appointed him and he is still doing the bidding of his master ;-)

21 posted on 12/27/2005 7:34:08 AM PST by SittinYonder (That's how I saw it, and see it still.)
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To: SittinYonder
This was a political hit that has risked security.

No way unless it results in action that would stop Bush. So far he seems to be saying neener neener.

22 posted on 12/27/2005 7:34:22 AM PST by HiTech RedNeck
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To: HiTech RedNeck

The political hit may have missed the mark. People were more excited about Christmas than wiretapping. But it was intended as a political hit. And being that specific about intelligence in a newspaper risks security. Bush said so himself.


23 posted on 12/27/2005 7:36:08 AM PST by SittinYonder (That's how I saw it, and see it still.)
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To: SittinYonder
When the NYT can be so precise as to say that calls between San Diego and a terrorist safehouse in Yemen were being listened to, security is jeopardized.

This is unlikely to have not been public information already through some other source. Or else the NYT is getting this intelligence out of their keisters like they do 50% of the time anyhow.

24 posted on 12/27/2005 7:37:04 AM PST by HiTech RedNeck
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To: HiTech RedNeck

Sounds like a good idea to me.


25 posted on 12/27/2005 7:39:49 AM PST by mlc9852
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To: HiTech RedNeck
This is unlikely to have not been public information already through some other source.

The first I heard of it was through the NYT via a leak, IIRC. Ongoing investigations, by law, are not public information.

26 posted on 12/27/2005 7:40:34 AM PST by SittinYonder (That's how I saw it, and see it still.)
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To: B Knotts
Very interesting.

The judges modified only two search warrant orders out of the 13,102 applications that were approved over the first 22 years of the court's operation. and

But since 2001, the judges have modified 179 of the 5,645 requests for court-ordered surveillance by the Bush administration. A total of 173 of those court-ordered "substantive modifications" took place in 2003 and 2004 -- the most recent years for which public records are available. ... The judges also rejected or deferred at least six requests for warrants during those two years -- the first outright rejection in the court's history.

If it is true that ... "They wanted to expand the number of people they were eavesdropping on, and they didn't think they could get the warrants they needed from the court to monitor those people"

I don't know if this court is "tinkering" with the warrants as presented to them or rejecting on their face due to the requirement that the "the government must show "probable cause" that the target of the surveillance is a member of a foreign terrorist organization or foreign power and is engaged in activities that "may" involve a violation of criminal law" hadn't been met.

Guess we'll never know without transcripts of the court session or copies of the original warrants. Which I don't believe we'll ever see or probably need to see. These are perilous times and maybe a more concerted effort is what we need up front. Maybe this should be more like a Grand Jury and "let them indict a ham sandwich". If it keeps or makes us safer I'm for it.
If the suspect has any constitutional rights they can be enforced at the hearing with his counsel present. If he has no constitutional rights (non-citizen) so be it.

We must remember - all it takes is one miss by us and the terrorist have met their goal. Vigilance.
27 posted on 12/27/2005 7:41:27 AM PST by K-oneTexas (I'm not a judge and there ain't enough of me to be a jury. (Zell Miller, A National Party No More))
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To: HiTech RedNeck

"Yet the paper has done more than merely try to embarrass the Bush administration these last few months. It has published classified information — and thereby knowingly blown the covers of secret programs and agencies engaged in combating the terrorist threat."

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1547499/posts


28 posted on 12/27/2005 7:42:45 AM PST by SittinYonder (That's how I saw it, and see it still.)
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To: SittinYonder

Until the USA becomes king of the world that can't put a lid on the Yemen side.


29 posted on 12/27/2005 7:48:22 AM PST by HiTech RedNeck
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To: SittinYonder

Who came forward and acknowledged the truth or falsity of the alleged information?

How do you know that Bush himself did not engineer the 'leaks'?


30 posted on 12/27/2005 7:49:25 AM PST by HiTech RedNeck
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To: K-oneTexas
If the suspect has any constitutional rights they can be enforced at the hearing with his counsel present.

Mostly impossible as these classified charges mandate a Kafka court.

31 posted on 12/27/2005 7:50:50 AM PST by HiTech RedNeck
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To: K-oneTexas
all it takes is one miss by us

I think the keystones really flatter themselves with this. The real deterrent is knowing that a war will come your way if you jihad the USA too much. As long as radical Islam still has a geopolitical vision this is their achilles heel.

32 posted on 12/27/2005 7:52:57 AM PST by HiTech RedNeck
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To: mlc9852

They need to be found and tried for treason. Keep mailing the White House and VP office to make sure they get the hint that America will not let up on them.


33 posted on 12/27/2005 7:55:13 AM PST by Bullitt
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To: SittinYonder

As one of the radio guys said, "this is one way to get rid of the liberals"


34 posted on 12/27/2005 7:56:49 AM PST by Bullitt
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To: K-oneTexas

This is the scariest part of the article:

"the Bush administration had difficulty obtaining FISA court-approved wiretaps on dozens of people within the United States who were communicating with targeted al-Qaida suspects inside the United States."

Why should this be a problem with the courts?
Doesn't make me feel safe if this is who we have to ask permission.


35 posted on 12/27/2005 7:59:17 AM PST by Tspud1
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To: B Knotts

The FISA court was set up under old technology, and probably has not kept up with the times of internet, cell phones, sattelite phones and encrypted messages. The way the Dem talking heads are speaking, you would think GW was only intrested in violating our rights, but this casts a whole new light onto the possible "why" of the Administration bypassing FISA. Hope this gets MSM attention, but we know the likelyhood of that is about as great as the Washington Senators winning a pennant. Where is Joe Hardy when you need him? LOL!


36 posted on 12/27/2005 8:00:13 AM PST by lexington minuteman 1775
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To: HiTech RedNeck

You're right there, I think. That is how past wars were fought. This one is a bit different, but it does seem that the same basic ideas must apply, and the ability of the enemy to strike must be destroyed in order to win. And certainly, knowing that you (and the country you in which you operate) will attract significant attention from the U.S. military has to be a deterrent.


37 posted on 12/27/2005 8:03:59 AM PST by B Knotts
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To: HiTech RedNeck
How do you know that Bush himself did not engineer the 'leaks'?

Sorry, when the most reasonable and obvious answer is the one that makes the most sense, I don't go cooking up conspiracy theories.

What motive does Bush have to "engineer the leaks"? How was he helped? What good have those leaks done for the WOT? What good did those leaks do for Bush himself? Why did he do his radio address the Saturday after the leaks live and condemn the leaks? Why did he meet with the NYT repeatedly to ask them not to leak the info?

The Dems, on the other hand, have routinely leaked info in an attempt to smear the president. Sometimes (Abu Ghraib) it works for them. Sometimes it falls flat.

Certainly I don't know if Bush engineered the leaks or not, but it's pretty warped reasoning to conclude that he did, unless I'm missing something. The dems, OTOH, have obvious reasons and a track record that points to them.

38 posted on 12/27/2005 8:05:15 AM PST by SittinYonder (That's how I saw it, and see it still.)
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To: SittinYonder; HiTech RedNeck
What good have those leaks done for the WOT?

Told the terrorists "we're watching you"

39 posted on 12/27/2005 8:08:02 AM PST by The Red Zone
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To: HiTech RedNeck

--you want thieves to think the police are watching them.

Too Machiavelian for Bush. Eisenhower maybe, not Bush.


40 posted on 12/27/2005 8:08:43 AM PST by bkepley
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