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Why the American Public Rejects the Bush Economic "Plan" (Part I)
AmericanEconomicAlert.org ^ | Wednesday, February 15, 2006 | William R. Hawkins

Posted on 02/16/2006 11:38:31 AM PST by Willie Green

For education and discussion only. Not for commercial use.

There was bad news for the White House and the Republican Party in the Associated Press-Ipsos poll on public attitudes conducted Feb. 6-8. By a 61-35 percent margin, respondents said that the country was on the "wrong track," and by 57-40 percent disapproved of the way President George W. Bush is running the country. Those surveyed also disapproved by a margin of 61-35 of how the Republican-controlled Congress was handling its duties, with a plurality of 47 percent saying things would be better if the Democrats were in charge. With Congressional elections only nine months away, the public could make that change if their dim view of the GOP persists.

Perhaps most perplexing to Republican leaders is that by 58-40 percent, those polled disapproved of how the Bush administration is handling the economy. A Gallup Poll conducted during this same time period also found a 56-40 percent disapproval score for economic policy.

The White House trumpets low unemployment (4.7 percent), rising real per capita after-tax income (up 7.9 percent since January 2001), booming housing construction, and low inflation. According to the 2006 Economic Report of the President, released Feb. 13, the future never looked brighter. How can people not be happy? Perhaps because the selective reciting of statistics in Washington does not pay the bills in Peoria.

Part of the problem with Bush administration stats is that they measure from the bottom of the 2001 recession rather than from the state of the economy before the recession. The recovery from the recession has actually been very slow, even though the recession was shallow. This is because the recession has masked some very negative structural changes in the economy which counter-cyclical policy – tax cuts, increases in government spending, and money creation by the Federal Reserve – is not designed to remedy.

Only 2,093,000 total jobs were added over the five years (2000-2004), a gain of only 1.58%, the weakest five-year increase on record. Only half of these net jobs were in the private sector, that part of the economy supposedly subject to the most stimulus in the Bush program (tax cuts and low interest rates). The other half came from increased government employment, not exactly where a conservative Republican administration would want it. Though the Labor Department hailed the creation of 193,000 payroll jobs in January, this was 40,000 less than most private sector economists had predicted and an indication that the economy is slowing.

Manufacturing has lost 2.9 million jobs, with losses slightly worse in durable than non-durable goods. There have been job losses in every major industry. A housing boom should boost durable goods production, except that too many of these items are now imported from overseas. And much of the construction work is done by illegal immigrants, who will work for much less than skilled American craftsmen.

There has also been a lost of 209,000 private-sector white-collar supervisory positions in line with the loss of blue collar workers. These well-paying jobs have been replaced by lower-paying service sector jobs in health care, social work, education, and restaurants. Unemployment is low because people have to work to eat, so they take whatever jobs are available. Even so, since Labor Dept. stats do not count people who have been out of work for more than six months, the kind of unemployment that affects how people and families actually live is still high. The Labor Department reports there are NOW over 5 million of these "discouraged workers" no longer counted as being in the labor force, but who still want a job. The editors of The Economist magazine of London, whose views on policy do not differ fundamentally from Bush's, have calculated that real unemployment in the United States is closer to 8 percent. Adults are not participating in the job market at 2000 levels (67.4 percent then versus 65.5 percent now), and total hours worked in 2005 were still less than in 2000. Additionally, the stagnation of wage and salary levels for most Americans does not indicate a tight labor market.

Another disturbing fact, which undoubtedly underlies the negative Bush poll numbers, is that households drew down their net savings last year. This has not happened since the Depression year of 1933 and indicates that the American people are trying to maintain their living standards without adequate income. The Bush approach of trying to boost "after tax income" by cutting taxes, rather than raising base income by creating better jobs, is a losing proposition.

In presenting the FY 2007 Budget to the Senate Finance Committee Feb. 7, Treasury Secretary John Snow argued for making the tax cuts enacted during President Bush's first term permanent, despite an estimated budget deficit for 2007 of $354.2 billion. Though he claimed that the economic recovery is strong and deep, he still said, "Tax increases carry an enormous risk of economic damage." This statement implies that the economy is not on a self-sustaining upward course, but is still dependent on heavy fiscal stimulus from the government.

Back when I was teaching economics at the University of Tennessee, the textbook used for the introductory sequence was the top-selling work of Campbell R. McConnell. McConnell was a follower of Abba Lerner, who had taken the Depression era doctrines of John Maynard Keynes to the extreme. Whereas Keynes believed in running deficits during a downturn to stimulate the economy, he also favored paying down debts when times were good, thus balancing accounts over the course of the business cycle. Lerner and McConnell believed deficits should be run all the time, without concern for any mounting debts. Indeed, they feared the accumulation of personal savings. They called their theory "functional finance," the function being to continually stimulate an economy they did not believe could ever run reliably on its own.

This outlook was popular among liberal-left academics (like those who ran my department and made the textbook decisions) because it fit their notion that capitalism was an inherently flawed system whose internal contradictions required government management to overcome. Their view now seems to have been adopted by the Bush administration.

Putative conservatives cannot acknowledge the liberal lineage of their ideas, so they invented the new school of "supply side" economics. But the only real difference is that while liberals favor creating deficits by boosting government spending on programs for their constituents, supply-siders want to create deficits by cutting taxes for their constituents. But it is the same political game – one based on a dismal view of the underlying economy.

Snow fell back on supply-side rhetoric, claiming "lower tax rates are good for the economy and a growing economy is good for Treasury receipts. Indeed, our rate of economic growth led to record levels of Treasury receipts in 2005." But a closer look at the composition of tax receipts disproves his claim. According to the administration's Office of Management and Budget, individual income tax receipts for 2005 were $77.3 billion less than in 2000. The increase in overall tax receipts from individuals came mainly from social security taxes, which were not cut. These fall mainly on middle and working class families, whereas income tax cuts help those in the upper income levels. Individual income tax collection is not expected to reach the 2000 level again until 2007.

Corporation income tax receipts have gone up, indicating where in the economy the real money is being made. Indeed, the Bush administration seems to think mainly in terms of how the corporate sector is doing. The new Economic Report, for example, downplays the negative household savings rate, arguing, "Personal saving is only one part of national saving. The personal saving rate does not include corporate saving in the form of retained earnings; but corporate saving adds to the wealth of corporate shareholders and supplies funds for investment."

Snow himself acknowledged the flaw in his supply-side reasoning (inadvertently) when he told Senators, "In 2011 we will again reach, as a percentage of GDP, the levels we've seen over the average of the last 40 years." Thus, it will not be until three years after Bush leaves office that fiscal behavior will get back to normal. And even then, Snow defines downward what is considered normal.

OMB projections for 2011 have tax receipts at 17.9 percent of GDP. Forty years ago was 1966. The average share of GDP collected in Federal taxes from 1966 to 2001 – the 36 years before the Bush tax cuts went into effect – was 18.3 percent. Almost all the cases where the tax share was significantly lower were during recessions, when tax receipts declined due to reduced economic activity and high unemployment. One suspects that Snow wanted to go back 40 years so as to be able to average in the period of "malaise" during 1973-1979, when the tax ratio averaged 17.9 percent. Tax receipts naturally jump when times are good and people are making money. The tax share of GDP averaged 18.5 percent during the vibrant 20 years from Presidents Reagan to Clinton. But during the 2002-2005 period, tax receipts as a share of GDP have averaged only 17.1 percent. This fact reflects the extreme nature of the Bush tax cuts, and the weakening tax base.

Government spending during this period has not been historically high as a percentage of GDP despite the Iraq and Afghan wars. Indeed, it has run slightly less than the average of the 1990s – 19.6 percent versus 20.7 percent during 1990-2000. What has caused the budget deficits has been the drop in tax revenues. Thus, in the Bush plan, budget deficits will continue out to 2011, and beyond. This is another source of dissavings in the economy, as budget deficits destroy capital, decrease investment, and prevent Americans from reaching their full potential as producers of wealth. The winners are those rival economies overseas where people do save, invest, and produce to wipe out American industries in cutthroat competition.

(Part II will follow next week.)


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Culture/Society; Editorial; Government
KEYWORDS: 109th; 2006agenda; assclown; balancedbudget; budgetdeficit; corporatism; deficitspending; globalism; nationaldebt; taxes; thebusheconomy; willielogic
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"I am one of those who do not believe that a national debt is a national blessing, but rather a curse to a republic; inasmuch as it is calculated to raise around the administration a moneyed aristocracy dangerous to the liberties of the country."

-- President Andrew Jackson - (1824)


1 posted on 02/16/2006 11:38:33 AM PST by Willie Green
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To: AAABEST; afraidfortherepublic; A. Pole; arete; beaver fever; billbears; Digger; ...

ping


2 posted on 02/16/2006 11:39:07 AM PST by Willie Green (Go Pat Go!!!)
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To: Willie Green

Were DOOOOOOOMMMMMED!


3 posted on 02/16/2006 11:41:30 AM PST by taxcontrol
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To: Willie Green

Willie, just screaming a lie over and over does NOT make it true. The only ones being rejected by the American People are YOU and the other Pat Buchannan Economic Isolationists.


4 posted on 02/16/2006 11:41:54 AM PST by MNJohnnie ("Close the UN, Keep Gitmo!")
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To: Willie Green

Many of the points raised in this article were thoroughly debunked on another thread about a similar article a couple of days ago.


5 posted on 02/16/2006 11:42:10 AM PST by Alberta's Child (Leave a message with the rain . . . you can find me where the wind blows.)
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To: Willie Green

I seriously doubt that the American public has the slightest idea about this plan. I reject pilates although I really haven't a clue what it is.


6 posted on 02/16/2006 11:42:45 AM PST by L98Fiero
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To: Willie Green

Shouldn't there be a BARF ALERT added to the title?


7 posted on 02/16/2006 11:43:20 AM PST by ConservativeBamaFan
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To: Willie Green

ping


8 posted on 02/16/2006 11:43:41 AM PST by pfony1
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To: Willie Green

Drops in tax revenues as the cause of deficits? The 2001 recession was shallow? 2000 as the benchmark for taxes?


9 posted on 02/16/2006 11:43:51 AM PST by misterrob (Islam is a hate crime)
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To: Willie Green
"57-40 percent disapproved of the way President George W. Bush is running the country"

That certainly includes dissatisfaction on things other than the economy.

Is this a DNC press release?

10 posted on 02/16/2006 11:44:02 AM PST by BenLurkin (O beautiful for patriot dream - that sees beyond the years)
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To: Willie Green

its the offshoring, and what's happening with private sector wages & pensions that is giving rise to these poll numbers.

so where does the President give an economic speech on HSAs yesterday - Wendy's. That's just what we need, tell US auto workers that the cars they make need to be better, provide no support to restricting the coming onslaught of imported chinese subassemblies and cars, then give an economic speech at Wendy's.

Then they wonder why the poll numbers on the economy are not good.


11 posted on 02/16/2006 11:44:32 AM PST by oceanview
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To: Willie Green
Perhaps most perplexing to Republican leaders is that by 58-40 percent, those polled disapproved of how the Bush administration is handling the economy. A Gallup Poll conducted during this same time period also found a 56-40 percent disapproval score for economic policy.

ROFLMAO!!

Willie, you need to put down the Crack pipe and come back to reality! To use such gibberish to validate any "story" is not for the Sane, and if you truly believe any story that posts such nonsense then you are beyond salvation, IMO.
12 posted on 02/16/2006 11:45:34 AM PST by Pox
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To: oceanview

To put any credence behind such poll number from those seditionists is insane, IMO.


13 posted on 02/16/2006 11:46:40 AM PST by Pox
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To: Willie Green
Part of the problem with Bush administration stats is that they measure from the bottom of the 2001 recession rather than from the state of the economy before the recession. The recovery from the recession has actually been very slow, even though the recession was shallow.

Of course the terror attacks on 9/11, the war in Afganistan and the war in Iraq didn't have anything to do with the slow recovery. And neither did the corporate accounting scandals (Arthur Anderson, Enron, WorldCom).

If only Pat Buchanan was in charge of the economy! THEN our problems would be over.

14 posted on 02/16/2006 11:48:09 AM PST by Mr. Brightside (I know what I like.)
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To: Pox

almost every poll show american's opinion of the economy, is much lower then the president's personal approval rating, or his handling of war on terror issues, etc.


15 posted on 02/16/2006 11:48:47 AM PST by oceanview
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To: oceanview

And if I felt like it, I believe I would have no problem "engineering" a poll that proved beyond any doubt that all 300 million Americans believe you are from Jupiter, but that doesn't make it true now, does it?


16 posted on 02/16/2006 11:51:26 AM PST by Pox
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To: Willie Green

*BUMP* !


17 posted on 02/16/2006 11:52:01 AM PST by ex-Texan (Matthew 7:1 through 6)
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To: oceanview
Its the offshoring, and what's happening with private sector wages & pensions that is giving rise to these poll numbers.

Baloney. Poll numbers are the most over-analyzed numbers anywhere on the political scene today.

When looking for an explanation of a sitting politician's poll numbers (good or bad), look no further than the price of gasoline. Poll numbers for elected officials on the national level rise and fall inversely to the price of gasoline.

Go back and do the research on this . . . it really is that simple.

18 posted on 02/16/2006 11:52:05 AM PST by Alberta's Child (Leave a message with the rain . . . you can find me where the wind blows.)
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To: oceanview

And yet, unemployment is under 5%. Home ownership is at an all time high. The number of high wage jobs has risen, dramatically. Retail sales and new home sales just posted historic highs.

If people are suffering in this economy, the fault might lie more with them.


19 posted on 02/16/2006 11:52:51 AM PST by GeorgiaMike
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To: Willie Green
Why the American Public Rejects the Bush Economic "Plan"

You mean to tell me, conservatives aren't the only ones rejecting the big government Republicanism of PresBush and the GOP Congress?

>>>>Part of the problem with Bush administration stats is that they measure from the bottom of the 2001 recession rather than from the state of the economy before the recession. The recovery from the recession has actually been very slow, even though the recession was shallow. This is because the recession has masked some very negative structural changes in the economy which counter-cyclical policy – tax cuts, increases in government spending, and money creation by the Federal Reserve – is not designed to remedy.

If it wasn't for the three Bush tax cuts, just imagine where we'd be today. Having said that, things aren't so rosey on the domestic home front. For five years, Bush and the GOP Congress have advanced an agenda that ignores the conservative policy ideas of spending reductions and limited govt. Tax cuts are great, but without some serious spending cuts to properly balance fiscal matters, the tax cuts are vulnerable to some future Democrat POTUS, maybe a GOP POTUS, coming along and eliminating those tax cuts with he stroke of a pen. Then raising taxes at his/her discretion. In fact, I remember a POTUS named Clinton who did exactly that, back when he first took office. Bush41 ignored the Reagan agenda and then we got Clinton.

FRankly, I never expected to see Bush43 spend like a liberal and rubber stamp everything the GOP Congress handed him. Bush hasn't even had one single veto in his over five years in office.

20 posted on 02/16/2006 11:53:13 AM PST by Reagan Man (Secure our borders;punish employers who hire illegals;stop all welfare to illegals)
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To: Willie Green
?Willie,.....does this have anything to do with the book,...."The Death of the West"...???

(I,ve NEVER read that book.)

21 posted on 02/16/2006 11:55:56 AM PST by maestro
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To: Willie Green
Tax receipts naturally jump when times are good and people are making money. The tax share of GDP averaged 18.5 percent during the vibrant 20 years from Presidents Reagan to Clinton. But during the 2002-2005 period, tax receipts as a share of GDP have averaged only 17.1 percent. This fact reflects the extreme nature of the Bush tax cuts, and the weakening tax base.

Actually, this fact reflects the slow -- but steady -- change in the nature of our Federal tax structure, as Federal revenes from our progressive income taxes decline and revenues from our regressive payroll taxes increase. At the rate we're going, we'll have a "flat tax" system in place in about 25 years.

The best part about it is that nobody will even realize it.

22 posted on 02/16/2006 12:02:55 PM PST by Alberta's Child (Leave a message with the rain . . . you can find me where the wind blows.)
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To: Willie Green

National Unemployment < 5%
Dow Jones > 11,000
National Inflation = 4%
Federal January Surplus of $20 billion

Things seem to be looking up.


23 posted on 02/16/2006 12:04:50 PM PST by kidd
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To: Willie Green

"There has also been a lost of 209,000 private-sector white-collar supervisory positions in line with the loss of blue collar workers. These well-paying jobs have been replaced by lower-paying service sector jobs in health care, social work, education, and restaurants. Unemployment is low because people have to work to eat, so they take whatever jobs are available. Even so, since Labor Dept. stats do not count people who have been out of work for more than six months, the kind of unemployment that affects how people and families actually live is still high."

Sheer nonsense. If you look at the composition of the most recent jobs report for January, you will see that more than half the jobs created are in high paying sectors. More than 50% job creation in these areas indicates substantive job growth, not burger flipper jobs. The report also confirms that America is creating more than 30,000 new jobs, mostly in new-age industries, every week. Real wages are higher now than at the peak of the 1990s boom. This is no burger-flipper economy.

Further, the assumption that all service sector jobs are low paying is a leftist/liberal conceit with no bearing in economic reality. Service sector jobs are more than just beauticians and "social workers," but include attornies and finacial service professionals which are high paying jobs, as are the health care professional the dope who wrote this article thinks make minimum wage.

Also, this conceit of "there are a lot of people who have given up looking for jobs" is pure crap. That number is said by labor experts to be only another 1 percentage point over the official unemployment rate which is a static number in ANY economy no matter how good.

Most people who need jobs simply cannot afford to give up looking. I was unemployed for 2 yrs. during the "Clinton" boom and never gave up. I couldn't afford to. Most who do are second income earners. But to claim the number of those is "high" is simply not supported by the facts.

Finally, while anecdotal data is never that helpful, look around you? Do any of you really know anyone chronically unemployed who hasn't chosen to be? I don't know anyone other than a terminally ill friend who's unemployed. Again, I know that doesn't mean much but one can often measure the strength of the economy merely by seeing what's going on around them. From what I see, people are doing well. The stores are always packed with shoppers. New cars are all over the roads, etc.

Finally, what of the new fed. chair, and the old one, all speaking in glowing terms of the economy as well as most economists? Are they ALL missing something the leftist clown who wrote this article is the only one tuned in to? I doubt it.

What this article is is nothing more than a partisan hit piece meant to talk down the economy in time for the November mid-terms. Dems. know the strong economy will be a hinderance to them come November. This loser who wrote this braindead article is just part of the effort by Dems. to lie their way back into Congressional control.


24 posted on 02/16/2006 12:06:04 PM PST by MikeA
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To: Alberta's Child

Would you have a link to that thread? I'd love to read it.


25 posted on 02/16/2006 12:06:55 PM PST by MikeA
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To: MikeA

It was the one on Pat Buchanan's article titled "America's Hollow Prosperity" -- and had 400+ replies on it by last night. If you do a search for it here on FR and can't find it, let me know . . . and I'll try to get a direct link to it.


26 posted on 02/16/2006 12:09:57 PM PST by Alberta's Child (Leave a message with the rain . . . you can find me where the wind blows.)
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To: Willie Green

"There has also been a lost of 209,000 private-sector white-collar supervisory positions in line with the loss of blue collar workers."

And by the way, many times that number of supervisory jobs have been created since 2003 more than erasing the 209,000 supervisory loss during the recent slow down. The guy who wrote this fails to mention that his number is a historical one, not an ongoing one, and is cancelled out by supervisory positions CREATED. We're just not all that stupid sir.

Also, an add-on comment to something else I said. Even accounting for the 1 percentage point of people who have exhausted unemployment benefits or given up looking, the unemployment rate is still quite low at 5.7% if you want to add in the 1 percentage point. Besides, that one percentage point is mitigated at least in part by the number of people who collect unemployment but were fired for cause. Many employers agree to allow an employee let go for cause to collect unemployment. I've seen this numerous times INCLUDING a woman I use to work with who was fired for stealing thousands of dollars by misusing a company credit card. Those people are on unemployment not out of economic displacement, but because of an over-indulgent employer.


27 posted on 02/16/2006 12:13:57 PM PST by MikeA
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To: Alberta's Child

Oh thanks. I was one of those who replied, so I can find the link in my past comments. Thanks for your willingness to help however!


28 posted on 02/16/2006 12:14:46 PM PST by MikeA
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To: MikeA
>>>>From what I see, people are doing well. The stores are always packed with shoppers. New cars are all over the roads, etc.

Most people I know are doing well. Credit card and personal finance companies are doing well too. Americans are in debt up to their eyeballs. Personal savings are at an all time low. Americans do have a lot of equity built up in their homes and that's good. Hopefully the housing market won't take a dive anytime soon. All in all, its definitely hasn't been an easy transformation from a mostly industrialized nation to a computer, information, entertainment based society. Pop culture rules. Google, Yahoo and MS are the big stuff today. GMC, Ford and Chrysler are history.

29 posted on 02/16/2006 12:21:09 PM PST by Reagan Man (Secure our borders;punish employers who hire illegals;stop all welfare to illegals)
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To: Reagan Man

"All in all, its definitely hasn't been an easy transformation from a mostly industrialized nation to a computer, information, entertainment based society. Pop culture rules. Google, Yahoo and MS are the big stuff today. GMC, Ford and Chrysler are history."

True. But notice the economy has successfully transitioned from a manufacturing economy to a service and tech sector economy. Despite these seismic economic shifts, the economy has continued to thrive interrupted only by 2 short and shallow recessions in the last 2 decades. High debt and low savings rates haven't seemed to mitigate that much. Like you say, some of the saving grace are people benefitting from home equity.


30 posted on 02/16/2006 12:25:09 PM PST by MikeA
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To: Willie Green

DUMB ASS!

LLS


31 posted on 02/16/2006 12:25:44 PM PST by LibLieSlayer (Preserve America... kill terrorists... destroy dims!)
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To: maestro
Willie,.....does this have anything to do with the book,...."The Death of the West"...???

Well in his book, PJB focuses more on the socio-cultural issues rather than economics.
But yes, I'd say that, overall, this article compliments and is compatible with PJB's positions.

32 posted on 02/16/2006 12:27:41 PM PST by Willie Green (Go Pat Go!!!)
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To: GeorgiaMike

wage growth was 3.1% last year. take government workers out of the pool, who get contracted salary increases, and remove the top 2% of all private wage earners - and you'll find private sector middle class wages are decreasing. and we all know what is happening to private pensions and medical benefit co-pays (for everyone not in government employment).


33 posted on 02/16/2006 12:53:19 PM PST by oceanview
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To: MikeA

Some of your comments here did look familiar -- I probably read your replies on the other thread, too. LOL.


34 posted on 02/16/2006 1:02:30 PM PST by Alberta's Child (Leave a message with the rain . . . you can find me where the wind blows.)
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To: Mr. Brightside
"measure"

Ditto..what you said. According to these geniuses Bush can't win. I can imagine that these are the kind of pessimists who if the Dow hits twelve thousand sometime this year, they'll say that it should have hit fifteen thousand. People "reject" the Bush economic policies because they're told it's awful by Big Media...who lie through their teeth.

35 posted on 02/16/2006 1:07:22 PM PST by driftless ( For life-long happiness, learn how to play the accordion.)
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To: Alberta's Child; MikeA
It was the one on Pat Buchanan's article titled "America's Hollow Prosperity" -- and had 400+ replies on it by last night.

Well here's the link for you,
but I didn't see where anybody refuted any of the facts that Pat presented.
Mostly the same silly gaggle of naysayers squawking because Pat Buchanan wrote the article.
They always chant the same mantra, no matter what the topic is.

36 posted on 02/16/2006 1:08:06 PM PST by Willie Green (Go Pat Go!!!)
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To: Alberta's Child

LOL, what's sad is I don't even remember what I wrote now!


37 posted on 02/16/2006 1:09:55 PM PST by MikeA
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To: BenLurkin

Not to mention, all these polls have over-polled Democratic respondents relative to the actual voting population. Further dissatisfaction can also be explained by the "nothing but negative" news coverage of the MSM.

The more important measure is consumer sentiment which was measured being quite high recently. From the report on the Consumer Confidence Index:

"The Conference Board Consumer Confidence Index, which had increased in December, improved further in January. The Index now stands at 106.3 (1985=100), up from 103.8 in December. The Present Situation Index rose to 128.4 from 120.7. The Expectations Index declined to 91.5 from 92.6 last month.

The Consumer Confidence Survey is based on a representative sample of 5,000 U.S. households. The monthly survey is conducted for The Conference Board by TNS. TNS is the world's largest custom research company. The cutoff date for January's preliminary results was January 24th.

"Consumer Confidence is now at its highest level in more than three years (June 2002, 106.3)," says Lynn Franco, Director of The Conference Board Consumer Research Center. "This month's increase was driven solely by consumers' assessment of current economic conditions, especially their more positive view of the job market."



These numbers are totally out of line with right direction/wrong track polling numbers and the polling data cited in this hackneyed article, as well as the very strong December and January retail sales reports, both of which were strong.


38 posted on 02/16/2006 1:16:29 PM PST by MikeA
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To: Willie Green
but I didn't see where anybody refuted any of the facts that Pat presented.

Let's assume that your God PJB's comments are 100% correct. How is turning our country into a Jew-hating socialist worker's paradise going to make it a stronger or better country? Don't you know that even the great USSR couldn't long ignore the brutal competition of a market economy? Get out of the past, the 50's are gone and will never return no matter how much PJB wishes it to be.

39 posted on 02/16/2006 1:19:06 PM PST by AmusedBystander
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To: BenLurkin

"There was bad news for the White House and the Republican Party in the Associated Press-Ipsos poll on public attitudes conducted Feb. 6-8. By a 61-35 percent margin, respondents said that the country was on the "wrong track," and by 57-40 percent disapproved of the way President George W. Bush is running the country."

These polls if you check their internal numbers have over-polled Democratic respondents relative to the actual voting population. Other contributors to these dissatisfaction numbers can also be explained by the "nothing but negative" news coverage of the MSM that colors peoples' opinions. None of this is reflective of economic reality.

The more important measure is consumer sentiment which was measured being quite high recently. THAT measure is much more reflective of economic reality than skewed media polls. From the recent report on the Consumer Confidence Index:

"The Conference Board Consumer Confidence Index, which had increased in December, improved further in January. The Index now stands at 106.3 (1985=100), up from 103.8 in December. The Present Situation Index rose to 128.4 from 120.7. The Expectations Index declined to 91.5 from 92.6 last month.

The Consumer Confidence Survey is based on a representative sample of 5,000 U.S. households. The monthly survey is conducted for The Conference Board by TNS. TNS is the world's largest custom research company. The cutoff date for January's preliminary results was January 24th.

"Consumer Confidence is now at its highest level in more than three years (June 2002, 106.3)," says Lynn Franco, Director of The Conference Board Consumer Research Center. "This month's increase was driven solely by consumers' assessment of current economic conditions, especially their more positive view of the job market."


These numbers are totally out of line with right direction/wrong track polling numbers and the polling data cited in this hackneyed article, as well as the very strong December and January retail sales reports, both of which were strong.


40 posted on 02/16/2006 1:19:22 PM PST by MikeA
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To: GeorgiaMike
Home ownership is at an all time high.

Don't you really mean that home mortgages are at an all time high? People with mortgages don't own their homes.

41 posted on 02/16/2006 1:21:15 PM PST by raybbr (ANWR is a barren, frozen wasteland - like the mind of a democrat!)
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To: Willie Green
I think my most pointed comment pretty much refuted much of the "doom & gloom" slant to Buchanan's article.

If prosperity in this country were anywhere near as "hollow" as Buchanan suggests it is, there would be no career prospects for some inside-the-Beltway snot who has never had a real job in his life. When I meet Pat Buchanan at a truck stop somewhere in the Midwest and learn that he's working as an over-the-road trucker for 43 cents per mile, then I'll concede that maybe he's right about this "hollow prosperity" nonsense.

Mostly the same silly gaggle of naysayers squawking because Pat Buchanan wrote the article. They always chant the same mantra, no matter what the topic is.

That's because he always chants the same mantra, no matter what the news of the day is. I've debunked many of his claims enough times that I probably do sound repetitive.

Back in the 1990s he was complaining that high-tech "service" jobs weren't as good as the manufacturing jobs we had 50 years ago -- and now he's complaining that the loss of these jobs is an ominous sign for this country. When he complains about the loss of jobs that he never thought were worth a damn in the first place, he really comes across as a pathological malcontent.

42 posted on 02/16/2006 1:22:22 PM PST by Alberta's Child (Leave a message with the rain . . . you can find me where the wind blows.)
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To: raybbr

It could also be said that few people hold title to or own equity in homes without mortgages.


43 posted on 02/16/2006 1:24:13 PM PST by BenLurkin (O beautiful for patriot dream - that sees beyond the years)
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To: GeorgiaMike
Only 2,093,000 total jobs were added over the five years (2000-2004), a gain of only 1.58%, the weakest five-year increase on record. Only half of these net jobs were in the private sector, that part of the economy supposedly subject to the most stimulus in the Bush program (tax cuts and low interest rates). The other half came from increased government employment, not exactly where a conservative Republican administration would want it.

The number of high wage jobs has risen, dramatically.

Did you read the article. Are those govt. jobs the high wage jobs you refer to?

44 posted on 02/16/2006 1:24:38 PM PST by raybbr (ANWR is a barren, frozen wasteland - like the mind of a democrat!)
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To: Reagan Man

Well, understand that Bush is a Moderate, not a Conservative. He only looks like a Conservative when compared to the Democratic Party, which is so far Left that in the last election, the US Communist Party chose to support the Democratic candidate in unusual break from it's tradition of fielding it's own candidate.

Consider how the Dem's committ hate thought and hate speech routinely towards this Moderate, even Liberal in some areas, President.

Says a lot about the Dem's, nothing good btw.


45 posted on 02/16/2006 1:24:43 PM PST by OldArmy52 (China & India: Doing jobs Americans don't want to do (manuf., engineering, accounting, etc))
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To: Willie Green

"By a 61-35 percent margin"

Less then 15% of the people control 85% of the money.

I'll listen to them. A man once noted that Wall Street was a place where people in Rolls Royces we told how to invest by people that drove VW's.

I don't spend any time wondering how the masses handle their money since I have seen too many reports the 70% of the people have no idea how to handle money.


46 posted on 02/16/2006 1:27:25 PM PST by edcoil (Reality doesn't say much - doesn't need too)
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To: Willie Green
Part of the problem with Bush administration stats is that they measure from the bottom of the 2001 recession rather than from the state of the economy before the recession.

Hey William R.! Do you remember 9/11?? $7 trillion to $8 trillion lost???

47 posted on 02/16/2006 1:31:05 PM PST by <1/1,000,000th%
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To: Alberta's Child
I think my most pointed comment pretty much refuted much of the "doom & gloom" slant to Buchanan's article.

You didn't have any pointed comments.

48 posted on 02/16/2006 1:45:32 PM PST by Willie Green (Go Pat Go!!!)
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To: raybbr; GeorgiaMike
People with mortgages don't own their homes.

So the lender gets to keep any increase in the value of the property? Can the people who pay the mortgage borrow against the equity? I think that would be a difficult thing to do if you didn't own the home. The average American household has 57% equity in their home. Are you saying that this wealth doesn't belong to them?

49 posted on 02/16/2006 1:54:39 PM PST by Mase
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To: ConservativeBamaFan

Given the title itself and who posted it, did you really need a barf alert?


50 posted on 02/16/2006 2:05:41 PM PST by Hardastarboard (HEY - Billy Joe! You ARE an American Idiot!)
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