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It Didnít Work (Buckley declares Iraq a failure)
National Review Online ^ | 02/24/06 | William F Buckley Jr

Posted on 02/24/2006 7:12:07 PM PST by CometBaby

"I can tell you the main reason behind all our woes — it is America." The New York Times reporter is quoting the complaint of a clothing merchant in a Sunni stronghold in Iraq. "Everything that is going on between Sunni and Shiites, the troublemaker in the middle is America."

One can't doubt that the American objective in Iraq has failed. The same edition of the paper quotes a fellow of the American Enterprise Institute. Mr. Reuel Marc Gerecht backed the American intervention. He now speaks of the bombing of the especially sacred Shiite mosque in Samara and what that has precipitated in the way of revenge. He concludes that “The bombing has completely demolished” what was being attempted — to bring Sunnis into the defense and interior ministries.

Our mission has failed because Iraqi animosities have proved uncontainable by an invading army of 130,000 Americans. The great human reserves that call for civil life haven't proved strong enough. No doubt they are latently there, but they have not been able to contend against the ice men who move about in the shadows with bombs and grenades and pistols.

(Excerpt) Read more at nationalreview.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: buckley; buckleysondrugs; bushbotsrkool; conservativenomore; cultofpersonality; dubyaisinfallible; failure; freeperlitmustest; howdareyouquestionw; iraq; nationalreview; quislingbuckely; stfubill; wfb; whosyourdaddy
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All those who warned going to war in Iraq would cause hundreds of thousands of American deaths .. guess what? they were WRONG!

Remember when they were wagging their finger and saying “nothing will change” and that there would never be free elections in Iraq? Guess what? There were elections.

Then they said that there would be no spread of democracy in the middle east and guess what? Lebanese PM Karami resigned his pro-Syrian government and Egypt had elections with actual *opposing* candidates! This is the biggest democratization going on in the world today .. and it blows me away to think of the narrow time span in which it has all taken place.

Mr. Buckley, to me, it kinda looks like Bush's plan is working.

1 posted on 02/24/2006 7:12:11 PM PST by CometBaby
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To: CometBaby

Oh well, if Bill says so....I don't care.


2 posted on 02/24/2006 7:13:38 PM PST by airborne
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To: CometBaby
It ain't over till the Fat Lady sings, and in my book, she ain't even humming yet.......
3 posted on 02/24/2006 7:14:17 PM PST by b4its2late (Terrorists will either succeed in changing our way of life, or we will change theirs. - Rummy)
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To: CometBaby

Buckley is getting old. Some weaken with age, some don't. It's sad though.


4 posted on 02/24/2006 7:14:53 PM PST by Bahbah (An admitted Snow Flake and a member of Sam's Club)
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To: CometBaby

I haven't read any of Buckley's tripe for years. It's good to once again realize why every now and again. Thanks for the post.


5 posted on 02/24/2006 7:15:19 PM PST by perfect stranger
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To: CometBaby

Buckley fails to present alternative postulates, or what the alternative end game entails. He is being lazy again, and unwilling to tackle the tough choices. He just jotted this thing down in about 10 minutes as a diversion from his ennui.


6 posted on 02/24/2006 7:15:56 PM PST by Torie
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To: CometBaby

Good thing Buckley isn't in charge. I don't like quitters.


7 posted on 02/24/2006 7:16:31 PM PST by SIDENET ("IT'S A COOKBOOK!!!")
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To: CometBaby

Buckley has turned into something that rhymes with wussy. A big one.


8 posted on 02/24/2006 7:17:29 PM PST by Petronski (I love Cyborg!)
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To: CometBaby

This is a great disappointment.


9 posted on 02/24/2006 7:18:01 PM PST by pcottraux (It's pronounced "P. Coe-troe.")
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To: Torie
...as a diversion from his ennui.

LOL

10 posted on 02/24/2006 7:18:13 PM PST by Petronski (I love Cyborg!)
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To: SIDENET
Do the Iraqis celebrate TET as they do in Vietnam>
11 posted on 02/24/2006 7:18:30 PM PST by bybybill (If the Rats win, we are doomed)
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To: CometBaby

Buckley is wrong sometimes. He is wrong about legalizing drugs. He is wrong about this. Maybe he's turning Goldwater in his old age.


12 posted on 02/24/2006 7:19:12 PM PST by Tall_Texan (Hate means never having to say you're crazy.)
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To: pcottraux

I have to agree .. A great disappointment. The left is going to have a field day with this.


13 posted on 02/24/2006 7:19:37 PM PST by CometBaby (You can twist perceptions .. reality won't budge!)
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To: Petronski

This is funny..cause Thomas Friedman of the NY Times...says the reason of all the new bombings is that WE are winning...and Al Quaida can't lose at home...it will destroy them...


14 posted on 02/24/2006 7:19:39 PM PST by Youngman442002
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To: CometBaby
Yes, but within their own counsels, different plans have to be made. And the kernel here is the acknowledgment of defeat.

I'd like to wait a few more months before changing horses. - tom

15 posted on 02/24/2006 7:19:42 PM PST by Capt. Tom (Don't confuse the Bushies with the dumb Republicans - Capt. Tom)
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To: CometBaby

"It Didn't Work"



Huh. Could have fooled all our soldiers OVER THERE who say otherwise. Oh well, I guess they're just imagining the good things they're doing.


16 posted on 02/24/2006 7:21:44 PM PST by macamadamia
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To: CometBaby

Buckley's right. The people over there don't seem to want democracy, only chaos. We can't force them to do the right thing. The ball is in their court now. What else can we do for them?


17 posted on 02/24/2006 7:23:02 PM PST by The Worthless Miracle
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To: CometBaby
Well...
  1. We defeated the fourth or fifth largest Army in a few weeks.
  2. We handed over soveriegnty to an interim goivernment on time.
  3. The interim government held elections to pick their own representatives on time.
  4. The representatives created a new constitution for Iraq within a coupole fo weeks of the schedule.
  5. The Iraqi people voted to approve the constitution on time.
  6. The Iraqi elected a new government under their new constitution on time.
Seems to be "working" to me...and all of this in the face of horrific threats to those who voted by terrorists and tryants who want to thwart the advance of freedom.

Their efforts (the enemiy's) are what aren't working BUckley

So guess what? All of those purple fingers don't lie, despite the MSM and liberal/socialists attempts to the contrary.

18 posted on 02/24/2006 7:23:08 PM PST by Jeff Head (www.dragonsfuryseries.com)
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To: CometBaby

I can stomach anti-Pat Buchanan threads, understanding that even committed Republicans are prone to 50 years influence of communist elements within our country.


If FReepers seriously start questioning William F. Buckley with such infantile criticism as "HE'S OLD", then I will say goodbye to this liberal piece of crap website.


19 posted on 02/24/2006 7:24:00 PM PST by SteveMcKing
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To: CometBaby

For crying out loud.. divide the country into three parts.. let them name their own countrys.. and let them fight it out.. Jeese.. they will end up doing that anyway.. It took Saadam wholesale murder to stop that from happening..


20 posted on 02/24/2006 7:25:54 PM PST by hosepipe (CAUTION: This propaganda is laced with hyperbole..)
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To: SteveMcKing

HE'S OLD.


21 posted on 02/24/2006 7:26:08 PM PST by SIDENET ("IT'S A COOKBOOK!!!")
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To: SteveMcKing
"Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people." -- Hyman Rickover (Often attributed to Eleanor Roosevelt)

22 posted on 02/24/2006 7:28:35 PM PST by Revolting cat! ("In the end, nothing explains anything.")
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To: SteveMcKing

Huh?


23 posted on 02/24/2006 7:29:52 PM PST by PackerBoy (Just my opinion ....)
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To: SteveMcKing

---If FReepers seriously start questioning William F. Buckley with such infantile criticism as "HE'S OLD", then I will say goodbye to this liberal piece of crap website.---

Are you series?


24 posted on 02/24/2006 7:31:10 PM PST by claudiustg (Delenda est Iran!)
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To: SteveMcKing
HE'S OLD

Now do us all a favor and say "goodbye".

25 posted on 02/24/2006 7:32:04 PM PST by COEXERJ145 (Pat Buchanan lost a family member in the holocaust. The man fell out of a guard tower.)
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To: Tall_Texan
"Buckley is wrong sometimes."

Buckley has had a history of being on the unpopular side of some issues with Conservatives. He has disappointed me a before. Besides, it won’t be so .. unless it actually happens in Iraq. He may have been the father of the 50s Conservative Movement, but he’s one step in his grave now. He doesn’t have it anymore. Rich Lowry seems to be a good replacement.

26 posted on 02/24/2006 7:32:16 PM PST by CometBaby (You can twist perceptions .. reality won't budge!)
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To: CometBaby
He concludes that “The bombing has completely demolished” what was being attempted — to bring Sunnis into the defense and interior ministries.

So, one bombing, destructive as it was, convinces Buckley that the mission is a failure? By that kind of reasoning, democracy in the U.S. is a failure because Tim McVay bombed and destroyed a federal building full of people.
27 posted on 02/24/2006 7:32:19 PM PST by adorno
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To: CometBaby
"I can tell you the main reason behind all our woes — it is America." The New York Times reporter is quoting the complaint of a clothing merchant in a Sunni stronghold in Iraq. "Everything that is going on between Sunni and Shiites, the troublemaker in the middle is America."

Translation: "Before the Americans came, we Sunnis were able to keep the 80% Shiite and Kurdish majority in a state of second class citizenship, we got preferential treatment and we could massacre the Shiites and the Kurds whenever they got too uppity. Ahh, for the good ole days before the Americans came and turned my world up side down!"


Shiites Filling a Saddam-Era Mass Grave in Iraq

28 posted on 02/24/2006 7:32:36 PM PST by Polybius
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To: COEXERJ145

Of course I could always stay for spite....

Nice slanderous tagline you have there!


29 posted on 02/24/2006 7:34:34 PM PST by SteveMcKing
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To: CometBaby

I remember when Barry Goldwater started goings senile.


30 posted on 02/24/2006 7:35:03 PM PST by CWOJackson
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To: CometBaby

---He has disappointed me a before. ---

He doesn't see the right to keep and bear arms as particularily important.


31 posted on 02/24/2006 7:36:27 PM PST by claudiustg (Delenda est Iran!)
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To: SteveMcKing
See what you've done? You've done provoked them!
Here's suitable musical accompaniment to the thread!


32 posted on 02/24/2006 7:38:13 PM PST by Revolting cat! ("In the end, nothing explains anything.")
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To: CometBaby
(Excerpt) Read more at nationalreview.com ...

No thanks. He's old.

33 posted on 02/24/2006 7:39:42 PM PST by PGalt
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To: COEXERJ145

HE'S REALLY OLD...and btw who died and made him the purveyor of all wisdom?
I'm backing the BOYS and the POTUS


34 posted on 02/24/2006 7:41:08 PM PST by Bushman2 (QUITTER NEVER WIN AND WINNERS NEVER QUIT)
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To: CometBaby
Buckley's old, the Rolling Stones are old, Hitlery will be too old in 2012, where am I, at FreeAgeist.com?! (You just wait for Ann Coulter, and Michelle Whatsername, and her sister Laura Whatsername to get 'too old'!)
35 posted on 02/24/2006 7:43:03 PM PST by Revolting cat! ("In the end, nothing explains anything.")
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To: SteveMcKing
BYEE!
36 posted on 02/24/2006 7:43:20 PM PST by WarEagle (This is obviously Karl Rove's fault...)
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To: Bushman2
who died and made him the purveyor of all wisdom?

He is trashing President Bush so for some that makes him next to god.

Oh, and Buckley is Old.

37 posted on 02/24/2006 7:43:54 PM PST by COEXERJ145 (Pat Buchanan lost a family member in the holocaust. The man fell out of a guard tower.)
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To: SteveMcKing; All; Admin Moderator
I can stomach anti-Pat Buchanan threads, understanding that even committed Republicans are prone to 50 years influence of communist elements within our country. If FReepers seriously start questioning William F. Buckley with such infantile criticism as "HE'S OLD", then I will say goodbye to this liberal piece of crap website.

Sorry to bother you Admin, but isn't this a comment a little too short to qualify as a true "opus" ??

Cheers!

38 posted on 02/24/2006 7:46:09 PM PST by grey_whiskers (The opinions are solely those of the author and are subject to change without notice.)
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To: CometBaby
Mr. Buckley, to me, it kinda looks like Bush's plan is working.

Buckley can be an insufferable bag of wind, when he wants to be.

39 posted on 02/24/2006 7:47:01 PM PST by Jorge
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To: CometBaby

I've never understood why people have thought that Buckley was such a great writer. He is a horrible orator. Thankfully, most people don't know who he is, and even fewer care.


40 posted on 02/24/2006 7:47:37 PM PST by connectthedots
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To: SteveMcKing

I agree with you. Conservatives can be just as hypocritical and close-minded as liberals, and sometimes more. If Buckley wrote a column praising the President, he would be applauded, but because he disagrees, he is labeled as old and senial.

If you disagree with his points, fine, but why get personal? Incase you have not noticed, Pres. Bush is not exactly a young man either. William Buckley is still smarter than 95%-100% of everybody on this forum even at his age. Disagree with his points if you want, but leave the childish attacks out of it.


41 posted on 02/24/2006 7:48:06 PM PST by SC33
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To: CometBaby

Mr. Buckley,

With all due respect, sir, you've gotten lazy. You have resorted to reading the newspaper to get your news. It is sad that you seem to have missed all of the good news from Iraq. It's sad that you don't realize that outside of Baghdad and the 3 provinces under curfew, life has vastly improved for the Iraqi people. It's sad that you've lost your will to foght for what's right. It's just sad.

Sincerely Disappointed,
REDWOOD 99


42 posted on 02/24/2006 7:48:23 PM PST by REDWOOD99
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To: Revolting cat!
Yes, most astute.

Senior conservatives fought the good fight for decades, before it was popular, before communication ever favored free ideas.

Bunch of spoiled unruly freshmen showed up in 2001, melded 9-11 into a weapon for their leftist views, and now proceed to insult and dismiss the work of champions like Buckley and others.

It's cool to wear a varsity jacket -- but Neocons represent the airheaded girlfriends who stole them off the backs conservative athletes who earned them. (And then they go and cheat on them, naturally...)

43 posted on 02/24/2006 7:51:52 PM PST by SteveMcKing
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To: COEXERJ145

Buckley has outlived his usefulness around here anyway. The only time he ever gets trotted out in support of an issue is over making drugs legal and they can't use President Reagan.


44 posted on 02/24/2006 7:52:17 PM PST by CWOJackson
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To: CometBaby

He may have 'disappointed' you before but he is usually right. In this case, in the long run, he will be right again. Rich Lowry is nothing more than a partisan hack. I'll take the esteemed Mr. Buckley's views over Lowry's any day of the week


45 posted on 02/24/2006 7:53:06 PM PST by billbears (Deo Vindice)
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To: CometBaby; All
Direct link to article
46 posted on 02/24/2006 7:54:20 PM PST by EveningStar
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To: connectthedots
I've never understood why people have thought that Buckley was such a great writer. He is a horrible orator. Thankfully, most people don't know who he is, and even fewer care.

Horrible orator?!?!!?!

Hey, when you're right, you're right!

I liked what he said most of the time, but I always had such a hard time trying to stay awake in between his sentences. Most people could give a long speech in the time it took him to utter a single thought.
47 posted on 02/24/2006 7:55:21 PM PST by adorno
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To: SC33

Couple weeks ago I engaged with a poster I didn't know-- turned out she was an 85 year old woman!

Perfectly wise and interesting in her comments. Moreso than the obvious opposition we are sensing here tonight.


48 posted on 02/24/2006 7:56:03 PM PST by SteveMcKing
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To: The Worthless Miracle
"Buckley's right. The people over there don't seem to want democracy, only chaos."

Their turnout for the 2 elections was very high, even by American standards, so it's probably not accurate to say they don't want democracy.

49 posted on 02/24/2006 7:56:43 PM PST by Sam Cree (absolute reality) - ("Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one." Albert Einstein)
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To: CometBaby
One of these postulates, from the beginning, was that the Iraqi people, whatever their tribal differences, would suspend internal divisions in order to get on with life in a political structure that guaranteed them religious freedom.

The accompanying postulate was that the invading American army would succeed in training Iraqi soldiers and policymkers to cope with insurgents bent on violence.

This last did not happen.

Here are the central points of the article. I cannot argue with any of it.
50 posted on 02/24/2006 7:57:14 PM PST by Revolting cat! ("In the end, nothing explains anything.")
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