Posted on 05/01/2006 10:43:03 PM PDT by FairOpinion
This thread is about a man who loves Iran and wants to overthrow the regime. **Something that would be incredibly beneficial to us and the world.**
All you came here to do is insult him and his father, and along the way insult FReepers who admire him and his father, and pick fights.
That's what you've always done on these threads.
That's why you're a Troll.
No, I hope Reza Palavi can "pull this off" and be successful.
But why are they making thier plans public?
I mean if we are reading aboutn this on FR, aren't the regime now in Iran reading this?
They will be warned of an inpending attack by Reza Palavi and that's no good.
I notice that in all your hysterics you never refute my assertions that the CIA branded your hero as "pathologically afraid"......or that he ran to Italy and had to be coerced back...or that they had to use his sister to shame him into action....all of this is there in the de-classified CIA docs. Anyone who wants to google "ajax,1953,iran,cia" can read it for himself.
Must be hard when you can't argue the facts.
How the Shah became the Shah seems to be the only facts you're interested in. Besides your subjective name-calling.
But the Important Facts are: The Shah was anti-communist, anti-islamist (before we even knew what the heck that was), pro-education, pro-modernization, and PRO-AMERICAN.
You insult the father of a man who is trying to get rid of the most dangerous regime in the world right now.
Very smart....NOT!
About time.
Interesting though that you back-handedly acknowledge the facts about the shah's ascent to the throne and his character (or lack of it) by declaring them unimportant....facts are always unimportant to propogandists...they just get in the way...
You have a nice day.
Obviously, the facts that the Shah was Anti-communist, Anti-islamist, & Pro-American, get in the way of your anti-Shah propaganda.
And the fact that his son is trying to get rid of our most dangerous enemy at this time, also gets in the way of your anti-Shah propaganda.
Instead of routing for him to be successful in overthrowing the regime, you insult his father and his efforts.
Again, real smart.
"The Shah was no Boy-scout. In fact, he was an a**hole"
I'd love to know on what facts you base this? The MSM acting in concert with Jimmy the Idiot Carter to blacken the man because he refused to pay Carter blackmail/exortion?
How long did you live in Iran - if ever?
Did you watch it grow in less than a generation from a country with only 40 kilometers of paved highway into a prosperous, thriving state? Under the guidance of the late Shah and despite oppositon of the flea-ridden Mullahs, the Soviets and Western oil interests which wanted to monopolize Iran's oil?
Based on what personal knowledge and experience do you speak?
You have the right to spout nonsense but do try to base it on a tiny bit of fact not the MSM or young, idealistic but naive left wing opposition acquaintances you may have had or met at college that you ran into and took their word as gospel.
Or have the pro-Mullah lobbyists like AIC, who pretend to be trying to create friendship between Islamic Iran and America but in reality plug the Mullah line managed to spin you into orbit?
Good grief!
You might want to keep reading thru the thread and respond to wtc911 who thinks the Shah was a "punk"
"Why would they be discussing it publicly? It seems like strategically, they'd not want it known?"
If you read Alan Peters' article of Iran - Justified Final Solution posted on FR and also on http://www.antimullah.com you would realize that someone or something has to replace or provide administrative coherence in the event of a large scale bombing attack which destroys the elite military to a man (insofar as possible) and leaves the ruling Mullahs (and not so ruling ones) at the mercy of the populace.
One of the points is that a government in exile or an NGO has to be prepared to help contain and control the chaos that would follow and step in with aid and comfort as if it were a massive earthquake instead of bombing.
With the hate the populace feels toward the mullahs unleashed by the removal of their military forces "bodyguards", there will not be many Mullahs left alive, so the current regime in any form would no longer be operational.
Because the late-Shah in reality served his people well, but certainly by contrast, was paradise on earth compared to the rule of the Mullahs, it's a natural catalytic umbrella to use initially to restore some semblance of order in a situation where nothing remains as authority or guidance. At least the Monarchy has a multitude of eager followers inside Iran, who like a drowning man would clutch at the royal straw and receive direction till democratic systems could be set up and other decisions - whatever they may be - take place.
"I have no truck with tyrants"
What do you know about running a country? Anything?
Have you even tried running a large corporation? Most CEO's are more of a tyrant inside their organizations than the late Shah was with his country.
But then again, it takes knowledge to reach good analysis and opinions based on reality not emotion or philosophical "perfect world" mind sets. You appear to function on emotion rather than factual basis.
Again, that's your right of FREE expression but then you are getting, so to speak, what you pay for. :-))
"would welcome the scion of one dictator to replace another".
Are you really comparing the reign of the late Shah with the rule of the Mullahs in the same breath? Is that how you see the two?
That would be like comparing the Queen of England with Pol Pot of Cambodia!
I think I can encapsulate such comments with "the American Right gets it wrong and the Left doesn't get it at all!"
You're right about the Shah. The paradox is that it seems the Shah shouldn't have bothered to modernize Iran. Look what he got for his efforts.
Try to use facts instead of slogans in your comments. Accuracy does help keep a discussion on track.
Piers Anthony's sci-fi series, "Bio of a Space Tyrant" is an interesting story. I actually just got around to rereading it.
At times I think that all of Doctor Zin's work has fallen on deaf ears. Then my mother is sending me pro-freedom articles about Iran. :) The truth cannot be kept silent. As always, BTTT for your insights.
Your hero was no George Washington and came from no "royal" blood-line. He was a puppet who relied on a mini-gestapo to rule.
Prove those CIA documents wrong or accept them.
Come now former law enforcement. Carter refused to sell Iran rubber bullets and crowd control water gun engines. Try controlling a hostile crowd without them and without killing them.
He set up the Guadeloupe meeting to stymie any help for the Monarchy. Read Carter's Illegal demands on the Shah at http://www.antimullah.com and get a better picture of reality at the time.
Both Alan and I were there. Were you? Did you have a hands on role?
Or did you get your information locally from the Mass Media that was instigated to do a character assassination? Or were you influenced by the organized crowds in the USA which tried to prevent him getting medical treatment for his terminal cancer?
The late Shah was dethroned because the Soviets went all out to do so and their Tehran Embassy became the center of operations against the Shah and support base - including some dozen Soviet Urban Guerilla tactics psychologists who did all the tactical planning to put the Marxist-Islamists MEK and Fedayeen in power. The Mullahs stole the revolution from the Soviets and were not the intended recipients of it.
To know more about what you so readily comment, you would need to have seen in from inside the G2 of the Shah and been privy to all the daily tactics the Soviets were doing to depose him and through their Tudeh (Communist party) and MEK surrogates finally get access to warm waters via Iran.
The "people" to whom you refer as the major players were catspaws used to achieve an aim through these players.
Khomeini had to initially include a 10 Touman banknote (roughly a $10 equivalent in buying power) inside every sandwich his organizers provided to the rent a crowds to get them to come into the streets in any numbers. Later fervor took over when the Shah showed weakness in dealing with them.
Specially when Khomeini promised everyone who would follow and support him a free house, free color television, free refrigerator, free automobile and free utilities. PLUS a share in the country's oil revenues!!
Heck! With that as a reward and the lack of sophisitication to realize that this would exceed the annual world budget to produce, you still think people did it on principle? Or because they were fed up?
A very limited few did. The rest were inspired and whipped into frenzy by the Soviet tactics and the masses by the prospect of being paid to sit at home and pick their noses just for existing.
Do check your facts and get real. And remember some 60% of the population were under the age of 25 - idealistic but inexperience and politically actually ignorant. How hard is it to whip up a cross section like that? A tinder box in gunpowder, similar to any University campus let alone an unsophisticated people like those in Iran at the time and similar to what's there now.
You are one of those who knows next to nothing about Iran yet set yourself up as a pundit?? You misquote facts, slant your views and use adjectives about things you know very little about.
You represent a thug with a SAVAK to protect him. That's a far slant from reality. Again, were you there?
And as far as listening to the CIA (though in those days they were real operfatives not corporate career people), does not their slant against Bush, verging on treason and isubordination, and their behind the scenes Bush bashing because they do not like his policies indicate that this might have happened then, too? About a foreigner to whom they had no allegiance?
That they judged by American not Iranian givens and standards and their rules did not suit the locality of the people and operations?
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