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Echoes of the 19th century's forgotten conflict
World Defense Review ^ | May 13, 2006 | W. Thomas Smith Jr.

Posted on 05/14/2006 6:52:43 PM PDT by SuzyQ2

In early 1846, Pres. James K. Polk dispatched an expeditionary force to the border hoping to provoke hostilities. It worked. In April, Mexico declared war. The American Army won two back-to-back victories. The U.S. formally declared war in May, and – after a series of very bloody battles – Mexico was defeated in 1848. America's victory resulted in the vast acquisition of new U.S. territories stretching to the Pacific: A bone of contention for some Mexicans (and other Hispanics) in the current immigration reform debate.

(Excerpt) Read more at worlddefensereview.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Editorial; Extended News; Foreign Affairs; Government; Mexico; News/Current Events; US: Arizona; US: California; US: Colorado; US: Nevada; US: New Mexico; US: South Carolina; US: Texas; US: Utah; US: Wyoming
KEYWORDS: 1846; americanhistory; army; civil; destiny; hispanic; jamespolk; manifest; presidents; war

1 posted on 05/14/2006 6:52:46 PM PDT by SuzyQ2
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To: SuzyQ2

Let 'em weep. We won it, fair and square, by conquest. It's ours now. They should get over it and move on.


2 posted on 05/14/2006 6:58:52 PM PDT by ConorMacNessa (HM/2 USN - 3rd Bn. Fifth Marines RVN 1969 - St. Michael the Archangel, defend us in battle!)
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To: Warthogtjm
They hold up signs saying they are reclaiming it. And some racial supremacists are "demanding" that white people go back to Europe.

Funny how they see speaking a European tongue (Spanish) as a part of their "cultural" identity and yet they deny their own European bloodline.
3 posted on 05/14/2006 7:03:30 PM PDT by weegee (Slowly but surely and deliberately, converativism is being made a thoughtcrime.)
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To: weegee

What stuns me is how readily the victors in this cultural war are willing to lay down their arms.


4 posted on 05/14/2006 7:10:48 PM PDT by ConorMacNessa (HM/2 USN - 3rd Bn. Fifth Marines RVN 1969 - St. Michael the Archangel, defend us in battle!)
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To: Warthogtjm

I was unaware they declared war first


5 posted on 05/14/2006 7:11:39 PM PDT by When do we get liberated? (( Multi-culturism has to go for a dirt nap.))
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To: SuzyQ2
NONE of these current illegal immigrants entering the USA were from this territory. If they were, they'd already be Americans. Plus, all light skinned mexicans, are invaders of mexico themselves, and haven't the right, based on what they tell Americans, to even call themselves mexicans. they are Spannish, and therefore should go back to spain if they are too cowardly to fix the country (Mexico) they turned into a crap hole.

The "indiginous" Mexicans can also turn around and head back from where they came from, South America.

6 posted on 05/14/2006 7:16:32 PM PDT by Nathan Zachary
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To: When do we get liberated?

Are you referring to the Mexican War or the invasion we now face?


7 posted on 05/14/2006 7:16:32 PM PDT by ConorMacNessa (HM/2 USN - 3rd Bn. Fifth Marines RVN 1969 - St. Michael the Archangel, defend us in battle!)
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To: Warthogtjm

I fear that a good portion of the illegal masses that are here are quietly arming themselves in preparation for the takeover.
At the range last weekend, there were several (10-12) of them there with brand new assault rifles (looked like AR-15s maybe) trying to sight them in.... Don't know how they got them, but they had em. It was almost comical to watch if it wasn't so serious. I couldn't understand a word of what they were saying in spanish, but they were having a real tough time hitting a targets 25 yards away...just spraying bullets everywhere. We had to leave in fear of being shot.
As bad as I hate to say it folks, I fear there is going to be blood in our streets before this issue is brought to a head.
We've literally been invaded and our government had allowed it to happen. The question is: Do we, as a nation of people founded on law, have the guts to stand up for what is ours, our culture and our way of life, or do we just bow down to our task masters and quietly hand over all that this nation has stood for to a foreign invading force? But what do I know, I'm just another stupid, tax-paying gringo.


8 posted on 05/14/2006 7:26:07 PM PDT by lgjhn
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To: weegee

Alot of "white" peple also come from south America. White isn't an exclusive European phenomenom. "White" people are "aborigionals" in many places, including south America.

It seems the "whites are responsible for everything" racist slurs have been spread by the Democrat party and has cought on well beyond our borders.


9 posted on 05/14/2006 7:27:50 PM PDT by Nathan Zachary
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To: lgjhn
There isn't much you can do except call police if you see illegals with guns, and other illegal things.

You have the right to defend yourself.

You CAN make citizen arrests if you see a crime.

Just don't do anything stupid or our own people will shoot you. Only Americans can be criminals it sems.

10 posted on 05/14/2006 7:33:31 PM PDT by Nathan Zachary
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To: SuzyQ2
This is a very slanted opinion piece.

First, he errors in stating that President Polk sent troops to instigate a war. He reacted to an invasion by the Mexican military. In those days, the United States didn't sit back and take it when the Mexican military crossed into the U.S. and shot at our citizens.

Second, he neglects to mention that even though the U.S. won the war and didn't have to, we PAID Mexico millions of dollars for the land we got. A few years later they sold us more.

In fact, in the second sale, Mexico wanted to sell us more land but Northern states balked at adding more "slave" territory and cut the size of the purchase.
11 posted on 05/14/2006 7:40:28 PM PDT by SUSSA
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To: Nathan Zachary

"There isn't much you can do except call police if you see illegals with guns, and other illegal things.
You have the right to defend yourself.
You CAN make citizen arrests if you see a crime.
Just don't do anything stupid or our own people will shoot you. Only Americans can be criminals it sems."

Appreciate the sound advice. My shooting buddy and I felt it was better to just quietly leave from there, especially given the high number of them present, but he was pretty upset about it and made me stop at the front while he went in and complained about the way they were just "spraying bullets everywhere". As we drove home, the more he thought about it, the angrier he got. Later in the day, he called me and told me that he had called both the Sheriff's Dept and State Police regarding what appeared to be a large group of armed illegals... I highly doubt that any investigation or followup happened.


12 posted on 05/14/2006 7:43:24 PM PDT by lgjhn
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To: SuzyQ2

What they are really upset about is that the US did not annex the entire country of Mexico in 1848, so that they could be living the good life now.


13 posted on 05/14/2006 8:08:58 PM PDT by Between the Lines (Be careful how you live your life, it may be the only gospel anyone reads.)
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To: Between the Lines
That being said, the twerps do have plenty of land & all the natural resources one could ask for, why can't they work with what they've got.

And furthermore, if they can't manage to keep house where they came from they can only make things a mess here!

14 posted on 05/14/2006 8:19:52 PM PDT by norraad ("What light!">Blues Brothers)
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To: SUSSA
Thanks for the good points made.

....... and also after we defeated their army, captured Mexico City, which we should have just kept, we allowed them to sue for peace then sell us the California Territory.

2 weeks later Gold was discovered in Coloma California.
15 posted on 05/14/2006 8:20:59 PM PDT by jcon40
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To: jcon40

Gold was discovered in California 9 days before the Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo. Fortunately James Marshall knew better than to e-mail everyone about his discovery.


16 posted on 05/14/2006 8:24:47 PM PDT by Verginius Rufus
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To: lgjhn

Shrieking doesn't convey understanding. This is barely in the top dozen of our important issues and there is ZERO chance of any civil war breaking out. It is remarkably to watch those calling themselves conservatives going bersherk. This is what it must have been like for sane Southerners to watch their region go insane and attack the Union in 1861.

Supporting President Bush and the GOP is the greatest blow that can be leveled at the forces of Evil which have our nation in the cross hairs. And the eye behind the sight ain't Mexican.


17 posted on 05/14/2006 8:25:14 PM PDT by justshutupandtakeit (If you believe ANYTHING in the Treason Media you are a fool.)
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To: jcon40; SUSSA
2 weeks later Gold was discovered in Coloma California.

Sonetunes you feel like a nut, sometimes...

Excellent posts both. My feeling about the whole illegal immigration problem is that there is a lot of history behind it that most Americans don't know. Mexico is a dysfunctional country (because of its centralized and quasi-socialist economy) that has no jobs for its people - but has an enormous level of resentment and a serious attitude problem.

I hope Bush quits focusing on the symptom (Mexicans fleeing over the border) and starts focusing on the problem (Mexico). If he does so, he''ll probably be about the first president since Polk to take Mexico seriously

18 posted on 05/14/2006 8:29:36 PM PDT by livius
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To: Verginius Rufus

O.K. Thanks


19 posted on 05/14/2006 8:38:10 PM PDT by jcon40
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To: jcon40

Yeah, Polk should have occupied the country and turned it into a colony. We wouldn't have had the repeated incursions and problems we've had with them.

It may be time for a return visit to the Halls of Montezuma, but not be as kind this time.


20 posted on 05/14/2006 8:52:31 PM PDT by SUSSA
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To: SuzyQ2

the pubbies have a problem. their choices like those of the people on flight 73 are between certain death and near certain death.

If they allow the illegals citizenship--the illegal/legals will do what they did after 1986: vote democratic and tip the country to a democratic majority as they have done in california and that because after 1993 in California many mexicans began voting in california to preserve gov bennies--for which the dems excel. There won't be social security benefit for Americans of retirement age from the illegals/legals because they will suck up what ever they put into the economy--as they are now. They won't yield a net gain. ie they won't pay for anyone's social security.

Everyone but everyone who has ever been to any government building that dispenses anything from health care to drivers lisences can't help but notice that the place is swamped with foreigners. Basically the welfare state system set up in the 1960's is being totally gamed by foreigners.

What the president looks like he is about to do will demoralize the republicans bringing on the effects of the 1992 & 1996 elections. There may not even be a third party but when W builds in a reversal of the fortunes of the war of 1848--it creates a kind of passivity in people when they see their leaders commit them to the status of world historical losers.

If Bush decides to put up a wall and expel the illegals then there is a chance to preserve Republican majorities. It would be helpful to promise that the USA will kill the cost of water desalination and transport so as to make it economically possible to turn the deserts 1000 miles from any desert seacoast -- green. (this would increase the habitable size of the USA by a third and double the habitable size of Mexico.)This work is already ongoing and will be accomplished in five years or so--or in about the same time frame that GM promises to have a cost effective fuel cell car. For GM as it is for the GOP its do or die time.

imho its a mistake for the bush's to put worries about fox ahead of worries about the USA. In any case if the USA returned the illegals to Mexico it would be a great boon to their economy because they would suddenly get an influx of skilled labor that they didn't have before (albeit mixed with expensive troublemakers) and a people who would have a good picture of what a successful country looks like and demand the same for their own. Perhaps they would even demand good government.


21 posted on 05/14/2006 8:55:18 PM PDT by ckilmer
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To: SuzyQ2

Let's fight 'em again. This time take the oil fields, round up the Atzlan idiots, march 'em to the nearest Aztec pyramid, and rip their hearts out.


22 posted on 05/14/2006 9:11:52 PM PDT by PzLdr ("The Emperor is not as forgiving as I am" - Darth Vader)
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To: PzLdr

Multiculturalism at its finest :)


23 posted on 05/14/2006 10:43:04 PM PDT by Max in Utah ("Shut up!" he explained.)
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To: ckilmer

"If they allow the illegals citizenship--the illegal/legals will do what they did after 1986: vote democratic and tip the country to a democratic majority as they have done in california and that because after 1993 in California many mexicans began voting in california to preserve gov bennies--for which the dems excel. There won't be social security benefit for Americans of retirement age from the illegals/legals because they will suck up what ever they put into the economy--as they are now. They won't yield a net gain. ie they won't pay for anyone's social security."

HMMMM ... So, just as the amnesty of 1986 gave us Clinton, the amnesty of 2006 may give us ...

CLINTON IN 2012?



24 posted on 05/14/2006 11:02:12 PM PDT by WOSG (Do your duty, be a patriot, support our Troops - VOTE!)
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To: WOSG

2008


25 posted on 05/14/2006 11:23:04 PM PDT by ckilmer
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To: Cacique

bump for later read


26 posted on 05/15/2006 12:14:13 AM PDT by Cacique (quos Deus vult perdere, prius dementat ( Islamia Delenda Est ))
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To: SUSSA; jcon40; livius

In this country (NZ) I don't think anyone ever teaches that episode of US history (it is not directly relevant to British Empire history, and certainly not NZ's), but from what I have seen the hardcore anti-Americanism that permeates over here I would no doubt they would scream "bloody American imperialism!" into the wee hours of the morning.


27 posted on 05/15/2006 3:46:21 AM PDT by NZerFromHK (Leftism is like honey mixed with arsenic: initially it tastes good, but that will end up killing you)
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To: PzLdr
march 'em to the nearest Aztec pyramid, and rip their hearts out.

"Have they hearts? And if hearts they have, be they flesh, or the blackest obsidian?"
28 posted on 05/15/2006 4:42:37 AM PDT by beezdotcom
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