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To: Tenacious 1
The best explanation I have ever heard about the Trinity is based on the three states of matter. Water is a good example because we are all familiar with water at RT (liquid), ice (solid), and steam (gas). These three states of water look different and have different properties, but they are all forms of water and can be converted from one to the other simply by changing the temperature. In a similar way, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are one and the same God, just in different forms. Since I have taught Chemistry for over 20 years, I wish that I could claim credit for thinking of this myself, but I have to give credit to a former Associate Pastor.

BTW, my father was a Presbyterian minister for almost 30 years in NC. He retired in 1975 and died in 1978, but I am sure that he is rolling over in his grave now at what is going on in the PCUSA. The local church member does not always know what is happening in the denomination at large, but I realized that the PCUSA had left me almost 20 years ago when GHW Bush was running against Dukakis. I received a copy of "The Presbyterian Survey" which had both of the platforms of the candidates, as well as the position of the PCUSA on the same issues. The positions of Dukakis and the PCUSA were nearly identical! I decided that, although I had been brought up in that denomination, I could no longer support it. I am now a Methodist, a denomination which receives quite a bit of criticism on this blog, but which is, in the south at least, still pretty conservative. At least, we still have "Onward Christian Soldiers" and "Faith of Our Fathers" in the Methodist hymnal!

63 posted on 06/20/2006 5:59:40 AM PDT by srmorton
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To: srmorton

[The best explanation I have ever heard about the Trinity is based on the three states of matter. Water is a good example because we are all familiar with water at RT (liquid), ice (solid), and steam (gas).]

I am going to use that. I had never heard it.

I am Catholic and have problems with the leadership in my church as well. Like a good conservative, I remain loyal while actively trying to improve that which I am committed to. The Catholic church, like a tower in Italy began to lean as John Paul aged back in the late 80s.

It is interesting to compare and contrast.

To many/most, Allah has matured/evolved into a fire breathing beast that directs his followers to torture and murder those that do not believe in him while securing power and spewing propoganda. To his followers that murder in his name, hundreds of slutty virgins await their arrival in the afterlife.

Christians now have this fuzzy cumbaya image of Christ. I guess we had our violent historical evolutionary understanding (Crusades).


74 posted on 06/20/2006 6:14:40 AM PDT by Tenacious 1 (Not today.)
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To: srmorton
I am now a Methodist, a denomination which receives quite a bit of criticism on this blog, but which is, in the south at least, still pretty conservative. At least, we still have "Onward Christian Soldiers" and "Faith of Our Fathers" in the Methodist hymnal!

It's just a matter of time

Language was the touchiest issue for the Hymnal Revision Committee, and the topic of gender references to God and people was hotly debated. Several hymns and other texts were changed to replace masculine language with more inclusive words.

For Tuell, chairwoman of the text subcommittee, the language issue was important. "I feel like I'm a feminist, and I felt language was important after talking to my own baby boomer daughters and others of their ages, saying some of these texts turned them off. They couldn't see through the theology and the biblical language to the essential language because they kept being bothered by the masculine tone of the hymn. They didn't want to be 'brothers.' They were sisters."

The committee took a middle course with regard to language about humans and God, Marshall said. Composers of new texts were asked not to use the masculine pronouns solely to represent God, she said, while masculine references were left alone in some older, familiar texts. Archaic references to humans, using "thee" instead of "you," for example, all but disappeared.

When reading a text, committee members considered whether it was in harmony with the Bible, had good poetry and was theologically sound. Did it fit the tune? The "cultural look" of a hymn also was important, since the book had to reflect the church's diversity, Tuell said.

122 posted on 06/20/2006 7:44:27 AM PDT by VeniVidiVici (My head hurts.)
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