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Hateful chatter behind the veil (Wives of Toronto's `accused` terrorists)
The Globe and Mail ^ | Thursday, June 29, 2006 | OMAR EL AKKAD AND GREG MCARTHUR

Posted on 06/29/2006 4:47:27 AM PDT by fanfan

Hateful chatter behind the veil

Key suspects' wives held radical views, Web postings reveal

MISSISSAUGA — When it came time to write up the premarital agreement between Zakaria Amara and Nada Farooq, Ms. Farooq briefly considered adding a clause that would allow her to ask for a divorce.

She said that Mr. Amara (now accused of being a leader of the alleged terror plot that led to the arrests of 17 Muslim men early this month) had to aspire to take part in jihad.

"[And] if he ever refuses a clear opportunity to leave for jihad, then i want the choice of divorce," she wrote in one of more than 6,000 Internet postings uncovered by The Globe and Mail.

Wives of four of the central figures arrested last month were among the most active on the website, sharing, among other things, their passion for holy war, disgust at virtually every aspect of non-Muslim society and a hatred of Canada. The posts were made on personal blogs belonging to both Mr. Amara and Ms. Farooq, as well as a semi-private forum founded by Ms. Farooq where dozens of teens in the Meadowvale Secondary School area chatted. The vast majority of the posts were made over a period of about 20 months, mostly in 2004, and the majority of those were made by the group's female members.

The tightly knit group of women who chatted with each other includes Mariya (the wife of alleged leader Fahim Ahmad), Nada (the wife of Mr. Amara, the alleged right-hand man) Nada's sister Rana (wife of suspect Ahmad Ghany), as well as Cheryfa MacAulay Jamal (the Muslim convert from Cape Breton, N.S. who married the oldest suspect, 43-year-old Qayyum Abdul Jamal). The women's husbands are part of a core group of seven charged with the most severe crimes -- plotting to detonate truck bombs against the Toronto Stock Exchange, a Canadian Forces target, and the Toronto offices of the Canadian Security Intelligence Service.

The women were bound by the same social, political and ideological aims. They organized "sisters-only" swimming days and held fundraisers for the notorious al-Qaeda-linked Khadr family. With the exception of the occasional Urdu or Arabic word or phrase, their posts are exclusively in English.

After their husbands were arrested, most of the women refused to tell their stories to the media; reached at her home in Mississauga, Ms. Farooq would not comment on her posts.

But in the years leading up to the arrests, they shared their stories with one another.

She knows it freaks her husband out just thinking about it, but 18-year-old Nada Farooq doesn't care: She wants a baby. It is mid-April, 2004, and the two have been married for less than a year. In the end, the jihad clause was not included in a prenuptial agreement.

Like many students at Meadowvale Secondary School, Zakaria Amara is busy worrying about final exams and what, if any, university to go to. But Ms. Farooq -- the Karachi-born daughter of a pharmacist who now hands out prescription medicine to soldiers at the Canadian Forces Base in Wainwright, Alta. -- has already done a fair bit of daydreaming about what it would be like to have a child. She even has a name picked. If she has a boy, she wants to name him Khattab, after the commander of the mujahedeen in Chechnya who battled Moscow until he was assassinated in 2002.

"And i pray to Allah my sons follow his footsteps Ameeen [Amen]," she writes at the on-line forum she founded for Muslim teens in Mississauga's Meadowvale area. Her avatar -- an on-line symbol used to indicate personality -- is a picture of the Koran and a rifle.

(All postings in this story have been rendered as they appeared on-line.)

There is nothing casual about Ms. Farooq's interpretation of Islam. She reiterates the belief that jihad is the "sixth pillar" of the religion, and her on-line postings are decidedly interested in the violent kind. In the forum titled "Terrorism and killing civilians," she writes a detailed point-by-point explanation of why the Taliban is destined to emerge victorious in Afghanistan.

Virtually every other government on the planet, however, she only has disdain for.

"All muslim politicians are corrupt," she writes. "There's no one out there willing to rule the country by the laws of Allah, rather they fight to rule the country by the laws of democracy." She criticizes Muslims in places such as Dubai for spending money on elaborate buildings while Iraqis are being killed.

Ms. Farooq's criticism is often directed first at other Muslims. When another poster writes about how he finds homosexuality disgusting, Nada replies by pointing out that there are even gay Muslims. She then posts a photo of a rally held by Al-Fatiha, a Canadian support group for gay Muslims. "Look at these pathetic people," she writes. "They should all be sent to Saudi, where these sickos are executed or crushed by a wall, in public."

The majority of Muslims Ms. Farooq does admire are ones currently at war, and she reserves her most vitriolic comments for the people they are at war with.

In a thread started by Mr. Fahim's wife, Mariya, marking the death of Hamas leader Abdel-Aziz al-Rantissi after an Israeli missile strike, Ms. Farooq unleashes her fury: "May Allah crush these jews, bring them down to their kneees, humuliate them. Ya Allah make their women widows and their children orphans." The statement is so jarring that another poster complains it's not right for Muslims to wish such things on other people. Ms. Farooq's sister Rana is also in favour of violent resistance, posting often graphic photos of female militants and suicide bombers.

But while her heart may be in the battlefields and holy cities, Nada Farooq finds herself physically in Canada, a country the Karachi-born teen moved to after spending her childhood in Saudi Arabia. Her name is properly pronounced "Needa," and when she came to Canada as a child, some of the kids at her school teased her by calling her "Needa Shower." She'd often come home in tears.

The Farooqs, a Pakistani family, came to Canada in 1997 because they didn't like the idea of raising their children in the conservative society of Saudi Arabia, where foreign-born children don't have access to the same education as nationals, said Nada's father, Mohammad Umer Farooq.

When a Globe reporter contacted Nada's father at his home in Wainwright, and described some of his daughter's Internet postings, Mr. Farooq said he was "curious" and "concerned."

His daughter never expressed such opinions to him, he said, though he noted that he's worked in Alberta for the past five years and only makes it home to Mississauga a few weeks every year. He headed west because the pharmacist training hours required in Alberta were much lower.

His daughter has always been more religious than he and his wife, he said, and it was a faith that she developed in Canada, not Saudi Arabia. He described himself as 30 per cent religious and his daughter as 100 per cent.

"Occasionally. I pray. She prays five times."

While his daughter has used her Internet forum to lament the end of the Taliban, Mr. Farooq is a firm supporter of Canada's mission in Afghanistan. Many of the soldiers he serves at CFB Wainwright will eventually be joining the mission.

"They are there for the betterment of the people. They are there for the development of Afghanistan."

While she forms a close circle of Muslim friends, Ms. Farooq is never comfortable with life in Canada. She posts that her mother is often lonely because her father spends large portions of his time at work. She talks about going to the University of Toronto in Mississauga as fulfilling her parents' dreams rather than her own.

Ms. Farooq's hatred for the country is palpable. She hardly ever calls Canada by its name, rather repeatedly referring to it as "this filthy country." It's a sentiment shared by many of her friends, one of whom states that the laws of the country are irrelevant because they are not the laws of God.

In late April of 2004, a poster asks the forum members to share their impressions of what makes Canada unique. Nada's answer is straightforward.

"Who cares? We hate Canada."

In Cheryfa MacAulay Jamal's mind, every Muslim is another potential victim.

As a 44-year-old member of an on-line forum inhabited almost exclusively by teenagers, Ms. Jamal fits snugly into the role of maternal figure, and the advice she dispenses reflects her firm belief that the forces of evil are out to get every member of her adopted religion. She encourages Muslim youths to learn about herbal medicine and first aid lest they ever find themselves in a Muslim country under embargo, unable to receive proper medicine. Even in Canada, she says, one can never become complacent.

"You don't know that the Muslims in Canada will never be rounded up and put into internment camps like the Japanese were in WWII!" she writes in one 2004 post. This is a time when Muslims "are being systematically cleansed from the earth," she adds.

If she's looking for an example of such oppression, Ms. Jamal finds it in the Khadrs, the Canadian family whose patriarch, Ahmed Said Khadr, was killed by Pakistani forces and declared a martyr by al-Qaeda. In June, 2004, Ms. Jamal spearheaded a committee to help Mr. Khadr's widow, Maha. In Ms. Jamal's view, Maha Khadr and her family have committed no crime, only stated their opinion, and it is the duty of the entire Muslim nation to ensure the family's well-being.

Ms. Jamal's zealousness for homegrown Muslim causes is matched only by her rejection of just about everything Canadian. As the June, 2004 federal election draws near, she repeatedly advises Muslim youth to completely avoid the process. Voting, she tells them, inherently violates the sovereignty of God, making it the most egregious sin against Islam.

"Are you accepting a system that separates religion and state?" she asks. "Are you gonna give your pledge of allegiance to a party that puts secular laws above the laws of Allah? Are you gonna worship that which they worship? Are you going to throw away the most important thing that makes you a muslim?"

Ms. Jamal's list of forbidden institutions goes beyond politics. Banking, membership in the United Nations, women's rights and secular law are all aspects of Canadian society she finds unacceptable.

But her deepest outrage, like that of so many Muslims, is time and again sparked by the treatment of her brothers and sisters around the world. In a May, 2004 post titled "Behold Your Enemy!" she posts multiple articles describing the humiliation of Iraqi prisoners at the hands of American soldiers.

"Know what you will face one day," she warns fellow forum members. "Let them call you a terrorist, let them make you look like a savage, but know that THIS is the filth of the earth, the uncivilised destroyer of humanity.

"Know from this day that this is not an Iraqi problem, it is not an Afghani problem, it is not a Palestinian problem, it is not a Somali problem. IT IS YOUR PROBLEM!!!"

Often, the conversation was quite tame. The women post advice on make-up, organizing sisters-only events and finding restaurants that offer truly halal Chinese food. Fahim Ahmad's wife, Mariya, posts a warning to other women not to go watch the brothers play soccer, because it makes them uncomfortable."Yea, and besides, their OUR husbands!" Ms. Jamal concurs. "Go get your own to stare at!"

But inevitably, it would come back to Islam, the very purpose for which Ms. Farooq created the forum in the first place. When it comes to religion, the wives of Mr. Amara, Mr. Jamal, Mr. Ghany and Mr. Ahmad exhibit a commitment to hard-line fundamentalism that rivals and often exceeds that of their husbands.

In May, 2004, the Meadowvale students come across an extremely graphic video showing the beheading of a U.S. hostage in Iraq. Mr. Fahim, posting under the name "Soldier of ALLAH," praises the killers as mujahedeen who will be rewarded in the afterlife. Another poster maintains the beheading was actually carried out by U.S. forces as a ploy to direct anger at the Muslim community. It's this post that inspires Nada to prohibit any further discussion of similar conspiracy theories.

Three posts later, her husband reprints an article claiming the Americans were responsible for the beheading.

But such occasional bickering between newlyweds does not stop Ms. Jamal from seeing the bigger picture. In her 40s, she is more than twice as old as most of the other Muslims on the forum. But like her husband, she believes young Muslims are the only ones capable of standing up against non-Muslim oppression.

For the most part, the wives of the other suspects do not let her down. This is especially true of Ms. Farooq, who deeply believes that education, financial success and other such goals are relatively frivolous because they only help Muslims during their time on Earth, and not in the afterlife. When another forum member disagrees with her view, she describes him as being "too much in this dunya [world]," and not sufficiently concerned with what comes after.

"Those who are sincere in pleasing Allah will go to whatever length to help the true believers," Ms. Farooq writes. "Those who fear Allah more than they fear the CSIS. Those are the ones who will succeed in the hereafter." NEXT: The transformation of

Zakaria Amara

Husbands and wives

CHERYFA AND QAYYUM ABDUL JAMAL

Cheryfa's age: 44

Husband: Qayyum Abdul Jamal, charged with knowingly participating in the activities of a terrorist group, receiving training and intent to cause an explosion

On-line nickname: UmmTayyab ("Mother of Tayyab")

Quote: "You don't know that the Muslims in Canada will never be rounded up and put into internment camps like the Japanese were in WWII!"

RANA AND AHMAD GHANY

Rana's age: 19

Husband: Ahmad Ghany, charged with knowingly participating in the activities of a terrorist group and receiving training

On-line nickname: Al-Mujahidah ("The Jihadist")

Quote: "May Allah curse the jews.. Ameen"

NADA FAROOQ AND ZAKARIA AMARA

Nada's age: 20

Husband: Zakaria Amara, charged with knowingly participating in the activities of a terrorist group, receiving training, providing training or recruiting and intent to cause an explosion

On-line nickname: Admin (the website's administrator)

Quote: "Those who fear Allah more than they fear the CSIS. Those are the ones who will succeed in the hereafter."

MARIYA AND FAHIM AHMAD

Mariya's age: 19

Husband: Fahim Ahmad, charged with knowingly participating in the activities of a terrorist group, importing a firearm, receiving training, providing training or recruiting and intent to cause an explosion

On-line nickname: Zawjatu Faheem ("Wife of Faheem")

Quote: "I heard that some sisters were watching the brothers play soccer last time...just wanted to let you know the brothers dont feel comfortable playing while the sisters are watching, so please, refrain from going there inshallaah and find something that will benefit you."


TOPICS: Canada; Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Foreign Affairs; Front Page News; News/Current Events; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: ahmad; ahmadghany; amara; canada; csis; fahimahmad; ghany; globaljihad; internet; islam; jama; khadr; qayyumabduljama; stockexchange; toronto; toronto18; torontocell; truckbomb; wot
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1 posted on 06/29/2006 4:47:30 AM PDT by fanfan
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To: GMMAC; Pikamax; Former Proud Canadian; Great Dane; Alberta's Child; headsonpikes; Ryle; ...

Canada ping!

Please send me a FReepmail to get on or off this Canada ping list.

2 posted on 06/29/2006 4:49:33 AM PDT by fanfan (I wouldn't be so angry with them if they didn't want to kill me!)
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To: fanfan

Well now, isn't that sweet?


3 posted on 06/29/2006 4:54:09 AM PDT by Coop (No, there are no @!%$&#*! polls on Irey vs. Murtha!)
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To: Coop
Yes, it's obviously a religion of peace./sarc
4 posted on 06/29/2006 4:56:28 AM PDT by fanfan (I wouldn't be so angry with them if they didn't want to kill me!)
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To: All
But Ms. Farooq -- the Karachi-born daughter of a pharmacist who now hands out prescription medicine to soldiers at the Canadian Forces Base in Wainwright, Alta. --

WTF?

5 posted on 06/29/2006 4:59:25 AM PDT by fanfan (I wouldn't be so angry with them if they didn't want to kill me!)
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To: fanfan

Islam is a cult, and these people are just typical cult members.


6 posted on 06/29/2006 5:00:23 AM PDT by livius
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To: fanfan

It stands to reason that anyone who would enjoy walking aroind in a Burka and veils over their faces were insane.


7 posted on 06/29/2006 5:03:03 AM PDT by sgtbono2002 (The fourth estate is a fifth column.)
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To: fanfan
"if he ever refuses a clear opportunity to leave for jihad, then i want the choice of divorce"

I bet she believes in life insurance.

"the wives ...exhibit a commitment to hard-line fundamentalism that rivals and often exceeds that of their husbands.

Behind every good man is a good woman. I guess this is what happens when you marry an evil hateful Muslim nag.

I wonder if they are angling for the "henpecked beyond all reason" defense.

8 posted on 06/29/2006 5:03:25 AM PDT by DannyTN
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To: fanfan
That is scary. Those medicines should have a warning label attached. "Warning: Processed by Canadian hating Muslims"
9 posted on 06/29/2006 5:05:43 AM PDT by DannyTN
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To: fanfan

Is there any chance we can get these women to come to our country to speak at:

The National Organization for Women (NOW)
The American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU)
Liberal Jewish organizations
Liberal feminist organizations
MoveOn.org

...to name a few.

And if their husbands can be teleconferenced in to participate, that would be an added bonus.

One of the problems Westerners have with understanding Islam is the lack of accurate information on how Islam warps the souls of those who dedicate their lives to that religion. The extremists aren't just your usual suspects of sociopaths and mass murdering psychopaths. There are a lot of people who could've been good people if they hadn't been warped by Islam.

Disclaimer: Not all Muslims are warped to the same degree as the extremists, but they aren't all clear of taint. The simple observation that condemnation of terror among Muslims rarely reaches above that of a silent whisper is an indicator that there is a moral divide between our culture and theirs. And if you look at the Muslims who are born and raised in America as a subgroup, they are almost as quiet as Muslims in the Middle East at condemning terrorism, which speaks of a much deeper difference between those of us who follow Christ and those of us who follow Mohammed. This isn't a new phenomena, nor is it isolated to Islam. It is just that Islam can warp the souls of Muslims in our country, almost as much as Muslims living in islamic dictatorships.


10 posted on 06/29/2006 5:06:47 AM PDT by coconutt2000 (NO MORE PEACE FOR OIL!!! DOWN WITH TYRANTS, TERRORISTS, AND TIMIDCRATS!!!! (3-T's For World Peace))
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To: fanfan

Those whores should be home taking care of their men instead of chattering like monkeys on the internet. They deserve a good beating with a rod the size of my thumb. That would get their priorities in order.


11 posted on 06/29/2006 5:08:33 AM PDT by AppyPappy (If you aren't part of the solution, there is good money to be made prolonging the problem.)
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To: fanfan
If she so hates Canada, the kindest thing Canada could do would be to deport her to Pakistan.

If Canadians were cruel, they'd send her to live somewhere with Mennonite pig famers where the only books were the Bible and farming journals, no telephone or internet or tv and no newspapers - just plain people living honest lives of work and service. She'd probably succumb in six months and become a good servant.

12 posted on 06/29/2006 5:12:29 AM PDT by CatoRenasci (Ceterum Censeo Arabiam Esse Delendam -- Forsan et haec olim meminisse iuvabit)
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To: fanfan

A most informative post, indeed. But in the interests of clarity adn accuracy the following needs correction.

The 18 year old female follower of the "Prophet of Peace" said that the following should be done to the Israeli's:
"humuliate them."

The jihadi'ette can't spell. What she meant was:
"humullah'iate them".

A Muslim and it's mind - it's a nasty thing.

PS There is something almost pitiful about a small group of Muslims thinking they can destroy America and the Western World. I keep thinking of them as a few Indian war canoes entering the navy yard at NewPort News, Va wearing warpaint and carrying their tomahawks.

PPS American Indians were far too savvy in terms of tactics to have done jihadi nutcase attacks as the Muslims have done.

I just hope President Bush is going to enforce his insightful "If you support a terrorist, you are a terrorist" doctrine. Exceptions for Saudi's and Pali's destroys an elegantly simple doctrine. CAIR also comes to mind.


13 posted on 06/29/2006 5:13:37 AM PDT by GladesGuru (In a society predicated upon Liberty, it is essential to examine principles, - -)
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To: sgtbono2002
After reading this, I can better understand why some sects of Is-slam want to keep their women uneducated and illiterate. These pig-dingbats are already stupid, why let them have independent thoughts and freedom to express them?

When I see a burka at the grocery store, I always remind her that she's in America and she doesn't have to wear that.
Some smile. Usually I get a blank stare. I only do this when no "male relative" is hovering around.
14 posted on 06/29/2006 5:15:32 AM PDT by BarbM
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To: fanfan

A very revealing Bttt.


15 posted on 06/29/2006 5:18:11 AM PDT by DoctorMichael (A wall first. A wall now.)
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To: coconutt2000

Not all Muslims are terrorists.

But most terrorists are Muslims.


16 posted on 06/29/2006 5:20:03 AM PDT by period end of story
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To: fanfan; ariamne; AmericanArchConservative; Fred Nerks; USF; jan in Colorado; TexasCowboy; ...

Good post, fanfan, I'm glad to see that the Canadian MSM tells the whole story.

*****A "No Surprises PROP PING"!*****


17 posted on 06/29/2006 5:22:03 AM PDT by Former Dodger ( "Insanity: Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." --Einstein)
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To: fanfan

This filthy trash must be exterminated like the filthy vermin they are.


18 posted on 06/29/2006 5:23:04 AM PDT by ncountylee (Dead terrorists smell like victory)
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To: CatoRenasci; fanfan

I agree! Heave ho, 'ho!


19 posted on 06/29/2006 5:24:53 AM PDT by Froufrou
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To: fanfan
Interesting how women like Farooq enjoy the benefits of the freedom and prosperity of the West while praying for its demise.

I wonder if she would be happier in a true islamic society where the women can't vote, can't drive, can't go out in public alone and get beaten if they show too much of their face. Perhaps she'd fare better under the taliban, where she would probably be led out onto a stadium field and a bullet put into her brain.
20 posted on 06/29/2006 5:25:58 AM PDT by reagan_fanatic (Man was made in the image of God, not pond scum)
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To: fanfan
The most interesting part of the article to me:

His daughter has always been more religious than he and his wife, he said, and it was a faith that she developed in Canada, not Saudi Arabia.

21 posted on 06/29/2006 5:27:31 AM PDT by dawn53
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To: fanfan

-She knows it freaks her husband out just thinking about it, but 18-year-old Nada Farooq doesn't care: She wants a baby.-

This young hag should NEVER have a child.


22 posted on 06/29/2006 5:37:32 AM PDT by AmericanChef
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To: reagan_fanatic
Give her a couple of years of being barefoot and pregnant, living in a mud hut with no electricity, running water, sanitation, heat from and cooking on, only an open fire whose smoke escapes through a hole in the roof. Where she has to burka up to walk to the local village well and can't otherwise leave the hut without her husband's permission, where they're no doctors, nothing to read and a husband who'll beat her if she doesn't spend every waking minute working as ordered.

After all, it's the society she's hoping for....

23 posted on 06/29/2006 5:40:06 AM PDT by CatoRenasci (Ceterum Censeo Arabiam Esse Delendam -- Forsan et haec olim meminisse iuvabit)
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To: ncountylee
This filthy trash must be exterminated like the filthy vermin they are.


You and I couldn't agree more. And with extreme prejudice
24 posted on 06/29/2006 5:40:16 AM PDT by dagoofyfoot
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To: dawn53
it was a faith that she developed in Canada


This is a direct result of Saudi Arabia exporting their finest muslim clerics. Don't you just want one in your neighborhood?
25 posted on 06/29/2006 5:42:43 AM PDT by dagoofyfoot
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To: Cindy; Donna Lee Nardo
In May, 2004, the Meadowvale students come across an extremely graphic video showing the beheading of a U.S. hostage in Iraq. Mr. Fahim, posting under the name "Soldier of ALLAH," praises the killers as mujahedeen who will be rewarded in the afterlife.

Ping.

26 posted on 06/29/2006 5:44:42 AM PDT by Velveeta
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To: fanfan
Allah and assimilation do not mix. The civilized would would be far better off not allowing these cult members to immigrate here and pollute our countries.
27 posted on 06/29/2006 5:44:50 AM PDT by Gritty (Unlike the birthplace of your grandfather, Islam isn't left behind in the old country-Mark Steyn)
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To: ncountylee

Is that you Michael Savage?


28 posted on 06/29/2006 5:51:59 AM PDT by period end of story
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To: fanfan

death cult


29 posted on 06/29/2006 5:52:45 AM PDT by Proud_USA_Republican (We're going to take things away from you on behalf of the common good. - Hillary Clinton)
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To: fanfan

Perhaps some Arctic natives could teach her the custom of . . . leaving a "useless, eating" aging grandparent alone to graduate from this life in the cold and snow.

What a shameful, pathetic, sad excuse for humanity those women make.

On the other hand, their zeal for their faith puts many Christians to shame. Though we certainly don't need to copy the idiotic mindlessness evil lines of thought and motivation!


30 posted on 06/29/2006 5:52:51 AM PDT by Quix (PRAY AND WORK WHILE THERE'S DAY! Many very dark nights are looming. Thankfully, God is still God!)
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To: livius
Islam is a cult, and these people are just typical cult members

Exactly, how can anyone NOT come to the same conclusion?

31 posted on 06/29/2006 5:56:05 AM PDT by Ronaldus Magnus Reagan
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To: reagan_fanatic
[Interesting how women like Farooq enjoy the benefits of the freedom and prosperity of the West while praying for its demise.

I wonder if she would be happier in a true islamic society where the women can't vote, can't drive, can't go out in public alone and get beaten if they show too much of their face. Perhaps she'd fare better under the taliban, where she would probably be led out onto a stadium field and a bullet put into her brain.]

It's hard to understand or even begin to change the ideology of people so obviously delusional and downright stupid. The article doesn't say which sect of the Muslim religion they belong to, but that doesn't matter in Canada or anywhere else in the West that they hate so much as they enjoy freedom of religion and can worship anywhere and anyhow they choose. It does matter in most hardline Islamic countries; however, and the consequences could range from not being able to go to their Mosque to being killed.

These "conversations" wouldn't even have occurred if these "ladies" resided in a fundamental Islamic state.
32 posted on 06/29/2006 5:56:49 AM PDT by khnyny (Never in the field of human conflict was so much owed by so many to so few.- Winston Churchill)
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To: fanfan
Wives of four of the central figures arrested last month were among the most active on the website, sharing, among other things, their passion for holy war, disgust at virtually every aspect of non-Muslim society and a hatred of Canada.

What can we do to make them like us?

.

.

.

< /s>

33 posted on 06/29/2006 5:58:06 AM PDT by Aquinasfan (When you find "Sola Scriptura" in the Bible, let me know)
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To: Aquinasfan

Submit, and buy a prayer rug.


34 posted on 06/29/2006 5:59:48 AM PDT by period end of story
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To: livius

Islam isn't merely a cult...it's a political conspiracy of rather blatant mission, spelled out rather explicitly through its writings and its bloody history. To disregard the clear secular-domination it seeks to impose at all costs to its adherents is suicidal self-delusion by the practitioners of the "cult" of Multi-Culturalism.


35 posted on 06/29/2006 6:04:33 AM PDT by Paul Ross (We cannot be for lawful ordinances and for an alien conspiracy at one and the same moment.-Cicero)
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To: fanfan
"[And] if he ever refuses a clear opportunity to leave for jihad, then i want the choice of divorce," she wrote in one of more than 6,000 Internet postings uncovered by The Globe and Mail.

Man, oh man! This lady wanted to be a Black Widow in the worst way!

36 posted on 06/29/2006 6:05:58 AM PDT by Paul Ross (We cannot be for lawful ordinances and for an alien conspiracy at one and the same moment.-Cicero)
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To: fanfan

And of course we can see that they moved to a country that they hated, specifically to destroy said country.

Hmmm, but we are supposed to be TOLERANT and NONJUDGEMENTAL for Muslims.

Yeah, as soon as 'good' muslims stand up and shun these loons, I will assume ALL muslims are the same.

In my insurance agency, we had an American woman, married to an Arabic Muslim man come into our (Christian owned office). She started going off on Isreal and how EVIL they were, blah blah blah. My very Christian boss stood up and came over and said he didn't have to sell insurance to anyone and he appreciated her right to religion, but he wasn't tolerating her bashing Isreal and would she please, kindly, take her business elsewhere. I feared car bombs after that (LOL), but was proud of him and stood behind him.


37 posted on 06/29/2006 6:09:45 AM PDT by sandbar
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: Quix

>>>On the other hand, their zeal for their faith puts many Christians to shame.>>>

So in your world fanatacism and 'zeal for faith' is not the same thing?

For that matter, let's envy those who followed Jim Jones and their "zeal for faith". Sheesh.


38 posted on 06/29/2006 6:22:37 AM PDT by sandbar
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To: fanfan
Desperate Housewives!


39 posted on 06/29/2006 6:26:52 AM PDT by silverleaf (Fasten your seat belts- it's going to be a BUMPY ride.)
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To: fanfan

It would seem you have some vipers at your breast.


40 posted on 06/29/2006 6:37:41 AM PDT by McGavin999 (If the intelligence agencies can't find the leakers how can we expect them to find terrorists?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Paul Ross
Islam isn't merely a cult...it's a political conspiracy of rather blatant mission, spelled out rather explicitly through its writings and its bloody history. To disregard the clear secular-domination it seeks to impose at all costs to its adherents is suicidal self-delusion by the practitioners of the "cult" of Multi-Culturalism.

Very well stated. The Multi-Culturalism cult will kill us too.

41 posted on 06/29/2006 6:39:35 AM PDT by ncountylee (Dead terrorists smell like victory)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 35 | View Replies]

To: fanfan

My reaction exactly. With that kind of an attitude, I would never let her anywhere NEAR a military base, let alone handing out things that the forces consume.


42 posted on 06/29/2006 6:56:34 AM PDT by Purrcival (The latest attempt to get Rush arrested has FAILED!)
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To: fanfan

Excellent post. Too bad the US press won't reprint this.


43 posted on 06/29/2006 6:59:26 AM PDT by aimhigh
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To: fanfan; All
Note this interesting web page...and then note something else...the name of the daughter of the millionaire father here....Nada Unus... a maiden name before becoming Farooq? Maybe its a common name, but then maybe its a connection....

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Militant Islam Monitor > Articles > American born son of Ethan Allen furniture tycoon Farooq Kathwari, was killed fighting Jihad in Afghanistan

American born son of Ethan Allen furniture tycoon Farooq Kathwari, was killed fighting Jihad in Afghanistan

Farooq Kathwari was speaker at radical Islamist ISNA conference in 2004
May 7, 2005

MIM: The fact that Farooq Kathwari, the multi millionaire owner of the Ethan Allen furniture company , son Irfan (aka Imran), was killed fighting Jihad against the Russians in Afghanistan should serve as another cautionary tale that every Muslim is suceptible to radical Islam.

Farooq Kathwari recently spoke at a radical Islamist events in the US and his enormous wealth has no doubt made him a donor and guest to be courted by these groups.

Farooq Kathwari came from a priviledged Kashmiri family , attended New York University, worked on Wall Street, and made a fortune as a businessman. That his 19 year old son Imran would leave America to be killed fighting as a Muhajadeen in Afghanistan, shows that even a Muslim from a modern, 'Westernised' background can become a Jihadi and begs the question of how many more Imran Kathwari's may be tempted to become Jihadis).

(The recent trials and convictions of wealthy and educated American born Phd Ali Al Tamimi, (who earned a 3 figure salary working for the US Department of Transport) and was jailed for Jihad recruitment, and Abu Ali, (whose father works for the Saudi Embassy) was accused of training with Al Qaeda and plotting to kill president Bush shows that Farooq Kathwari was an early manifestation of an alarming trend.)

In his blog "Are Muslim Americans victimised?" named Farooq Kathwari as one of the the most sucessful Muslim businessmen in America.

"...Business tycoons of note in the Muslim-American community include Bijan (high-end men's clothing), Rashid A. Chaudhry (personal care products), Ayhan Hakimoglu (armaments), Yusef Haroon (consulting and managerial services), Mansoor Ijaz (investment management), Farooq Kathwari (furniture), Nemir Kirdar (venture capital), and Safi Qureshey (computers). The wealthiest Muslim American appears to be a software engineer of Turkish origins, Kenan Sahin, who in 1999 netted $1.45 billion when he sold his company, Kenan Systems, to Lucent Technologies. Muslim Americans proudly say that theirs is "the richest Muslim society on earth," and they are right. .."http://www.danielpipes.org/article/358

MIM: Besides making the list the richest Muslims in America Farooq Kathwari was also a featured speaker at the Islamic Society of North America 2004 conference which included some of the most radical Islamist leaders and groups in America. ISNA is one of the largest Wahhabist/Saudi funded umbrella groups which owns most of the mosques in America. The ISNA voter recruitment efforts are directed at consolidating Muslim political power in America to further the Islamist objective of turning the United States of America into a 'United States of Allah'.

"...The speakers included Muhammad Nur Abdullah, Dawud Warnsby, Farooq Kathwari, Zaid Shakir, Altaf Husain, Nada Unus, Shazia Siddiqi, Amir Al-Islam, Abdul Hakim Murad (T.J. Winters), Umar Faruq Abd-Allah, Mokhtar Maghraoui, Shugufta Yasmeen, Habibe Husain,Rami Nashishibi, Thomas Simons Jr., Ingrid Mattson, Hamza Yusuf, Suhaib Webb, Abdalla Idris Ali, Abdul Rashied Omar, Feisal M. Abdur Rauf, Ekram Beshir, Suhaib Webb, Kenya Numan, Ihsan Bagby, Suhail Ghannouchi, Hadia Mubarak, Salam Al-Maryati, Omar Ahmad and Agha Saeed.

Moderator were Azhar Azeez, Louay Safi, Ingrid Mattson, Syed Imtiaz Ahmad, Kamran Memon and Kareem Irfan.

Ten top Muslim American organizations Sunday evening set up 'The American Muslim Taskforce (AMT)', but declined to make an endorsement for a single candidate in the U.S. presidential elections, appealing to the community to unite, register to vote, and fully participate in the November polls.

The ten organizations are: AMA, CAIR, ICNA, ISNA, MENA, MAS, MPAC, MSA National, Islamic Hope and UMA. The previous task force of the Muslim Americans had endorsed George Bush in the 2000 elections, which decision was, however, opposed by the African-Americans, who vote for Democrats. http://www.pakistantimes.net/2004/09/08/specialreport.htm

---------------------------------------

MIM: Farooq Kathwari's brother wrote an entire article about Irfan Kathari's death in Jihad entitled: "My Nephew the Freedom Fighter". The article gives a valuable insight into how wealthy American born Muslims can get involved in Jihad, (the juxtaposition of a long haired Irfan Kathwari shooting hoops in driveway of the family farm where his father's BMW is parked and listening to Metallica, to his last picture in traditional Muslim garb in Afghanistan and a note reaffirming his'love for Allah". Kathawari's father was also a high ranking official in Kashmir, which shows that the family, many of whom still live there, and continue their involvement in the political life of the region. The writer of the article Rafiq Kathwari, has said that after 35 years, he still feels as the same about the struggle in Kashmir.http://www.featurewell.com/?Doc=Signin.cfm&AID=2080

MY NEPHEW, THE FREEDOM FIGHTER
by Rafiq Kathwari , 1313 words
All rights available.
Essays: The author, an American born in Kashmir, remembers his cousin, who is "buried in a mass grave somewhere in the minefields of Afghanistan." Full story...

"...My family has a longstanding tradition of activism in Kashmir. My father was once a Finance Minister in Pakistan-controlled Kashmir. We had migrated there in 1949 after India and Pakistan fought their first war over Kashmir. My mother wrote letters to world leaders pleading with them not to forget the plight of broken families separated by an artificial cease fire line, which in Kashmir is called the Line of Control. We returned to Indian-occupied Kashmir in 1960, after 11 years. There, Irfan's father and I were jailed for several months by Indian authorities for our student activism. That was the family tradition that influenced my nephew Irfan..."

"... Freedom for Kashmir was near, or so it seemed. Those events impacted Irfan differently then they did me or my brother. Irfan spent his waking hours that summer at the local mosque, sometimes returning home late at night... Iraq invaded Kuwait in August, and a few months later when smart bombs fell in Baghdad, Irfan wanted to enroll at King Faisal U in Islamabad..." A few weeks later, Irfan wrote that he and a handful of his new classmates had crossed the Pakistan-Afghanistan border in a Toyota pick up several times without being stopped. A photo shows him wearing the long shirt, the kameez, and loose pants, the shalwar; he is stroking his curly beard. There is no Kalashnikov on his shoulder. "Love of Allah," he wrote in another letter, "is the only love I have ever known." On one such trip, Allah's foot soldier seemingly cast the first stone. The enemy released an arc across the sky. In their backyard in America, his mom was pruning roses under a gunmetal sky, the day the call came. My nephew is buried in a mass grave in the desolation of Afghanistan. My brother and sister-in- law, who believe that their son was killed in a freak accident fighting the Soviets, are, of course, entitled to find solace in any idea that helps them come to terms with their sorrow..."

MIM:The interviewer refers to Imran Kathwari's death while fighting Jihad in Chechyna as his having been the youthful pursuit of a 'romantic notion' and glosses over the death without questioning what could have motivated the son of one of America's wealthiest business tycoons, from an 'assimilated' Muslim background, to become a Muhajideen fighter in Afghanistan.

----------------------

2001 Business Week

At Ethan Allen, Selling Furniture and Tolerance

CEO Farooq Kathwari has revitalized the company, while leading a campaign to bring peace to Kashmir


http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/01_43/b3754076.htm

Grief, comfort, gratitude, patriotism. That was the language of most chief executives' messages in newspapers around the country after the violence of Sept. 11. But M. Farooq Kathwari, the head of furniture retailer Ethan Allen Interiors Inc. ( ), a Muslim who left Kashmir some 35 years ago and now an American citizen trying to bring peace to that troubled place, wrote of something else. Deep sadness, yes. But also of the need to "foster unity among people of different faiths." As community leaders have stated in the days since the Twin Towers fell, Kathwari says: "The terrorists win if the search for justice turns to vengeance."

Kathwari, 57, knows something of how grief and anger work on people. His eldest son was killed in Afghanistan in 1992: Imran, a 19-year-old college student born and raised in America, was drawn there by romantic notions of the fight against the Russians (and by that time, the regime they backed), says Kathwari. Imran went despite the family's opposition. He died in a mortar attack, in one of the last battles for the capital, Kabul. "My son is lying in rubble in Afghanistan," Kathwari says.

A death like that could make a parent bitter for life. And Kathwari was for a while. But eventually he decided to get involved, not in Afghanistan but in Kashmir, as a diplomat of sorts. At least 35,000 Kashmiris have died or disappeared since 1989, when their renewed call for more autonomy, if not independence, from India, sparked a rebellion that Pakistan supports. Kathwari, once a student activist in Kashmir, brought together a group of predominantly American politicians, academics, and former diplomats in 1996 to suggest ways to end the civil strife. Kathwari, talking publicly about his work there for the first time, says: "I wanted to try to save parents from the agony of losing a child. And Kashmir helps me maintain perspective."

What makes Kathwari's experience so interesting is the way in which it has influenced his leadership at Ethan Allen, that most traditional of American retail icons. He's as demanding as any CEO. But colleagues also talk about his sense of justice and humility. As Sandra Lamenza, vice-president and general manager of the retail division, puts it: "Ego is not tolerated. You can't throw power around."

Kathwari, who grew up in a privileged, politically active family, left Kashmir in 1965 to obtain an MBA at New York University. After a few years on Wall Street, he began importing handicrafts from Kashmir. In 1980, Kathwari sold his company to Ethan Allen, an early client, and five years later he was promoted to president.

Since then he has changed almost everything about Ethan Allen: the furniture, the design of its 300-plus stores, its relationship with dealers, and the senior management, almost all of whom retired between 1988 and 1990. Ethan Allen used to sell traditional furniture, some of which hadn't been updated in 40 years, in stores that even employees say looked like colonial museums. "Ethan Allen was a trusted, dusty brand in danger of going the way of the Oldsmobile," says Simon Williams, chairman of brand consultant Sterling Group in New York. Kathwari and his designers made over its Valley Forge look to suit modern tastes and they now launch new collections more frequently. They have also remodeled most stores and relocated half to prime retail space.

At the same time, Kathwari took on the independent dealers who sold most of Ethan Allen's furniture. Breaking with industry protocol, he told them to sell only the company's merchandise at one price to be set in the Danbury (Conn.) headquarters. He also required them all to buy the furniture at the same price; before, the bigger dealers received a discount. Several of them confronted Kathwari in 1986, saying: "Do you think you are Robin Hood? You're giving to smaller dealers at [our] expense." To Kathwari it was an issue of fairness, and that was that. Two dealers walked out.

A MESSAGE. Now the transformation is almost complete. To fend off a hostile bid in 1989, Kathwari led a $350 million buyout; that gave him a 10% stake in the company and more operational control. Kathwari took Ethan Allen public again in 1993. At most stores, sales have tripled since 1985, and the company's profit margins are the highest of any furniture manufacturer. But of course, no business is immune to the slowing economy and the likelihood of protracted military action. Profits for the fiscal year that ended on June 30 were $84 million, down 7% from a year ago. Sales were $904 million, up 5.6%. As late as June the stock price was holding up well, at about $38. Now it's trading around $30. To reduce costs, Kathwari closed three U.S. factories this year and he is moving some production to Southeast Asia. He still expects sales to grow 5% in 2001. Though that may be optimistic these days, the company does have a strong enough balance sheet to weather a recession.

Kathwari talks often about establishing "a moral precedent" at Ethan Allen. When Corey Whitely, vice-president of retail operations, won the company's Golden Kite achievement award in 2000, Kathwari said he should think of it as recognition that he fulfilled his responsibilities with modesty. And when the company bought a plant in Virginia ten months ago, he told Charlie Farfaglia, vice-president of human resources, to recognize the employees' service with the old company when determining benefits. Kathwari also speaks of religious tolerance, when speaking of it seems appropriate. At a Christmas dinner he hosted, he read from the Koran about the birth of Jesus. After Sept. 11, the staff agreed Ethan Allen should put a public message in a few newspapers. "They know of my loss. They know I believe injustice is a sin," he says. Kathwari wrote the note himself.

Kathwari is intimately involved, some would say overly, in running the company. That doesn't work to everyone's benefit. After years of operating without a chief financial officer--the company has a controller--Kathwari decided last year to hire William Beisswanger from Ernst & Young LLP. He left after nine months. Beisswanger would only say that "Farooq is very hands-on. I didn't think it was the right place for me." Kathwari has since hired someone else.

Any difficulties with the turnaround pale alongside Kathwari's efforts to bring peace to Kashmir. The Kashmir Study Group is an independent effort, initially welcomed by no one and still criticized by some as out of touch. But over the past five years, Kathwari has largely persuaded Indian and Pakistani officials that he is serious, fair, and worth their time. "He and his project are highly respected by both sides as well as the U.S. government," says a Bush Administration official.

The group's report, released in early 2000, offers a supple approach to sovereignty, giving Kashmiris (a majority of whom are Muslim) the right to rule themselves within India or Pakistan. That is a controversial notion among Indians who want to retain control, and some of them view Kathwari with suspicion. "They've asked the leaders to imagine a settlement that's fair to both. It's very helpful just to get people thinking about that," says Frank C. Wisner, a former ambassador to India who is now a director at Ethan Allen. Last year Kathwari met with Pakistan's ruler, President Pervez Musharraf, and Indian officials close to Prime Minister Atal Behari Vajpayee; he was one of many urging them to talk. The two met in the Indian city of Agra in July and are considering another summit. The violence continues: A car bomb exploded near the state legislature Oct. 1, killing at least 40 people. Now, though, there may be more pressure to bring peace to Kashmir, says Kathwari, because then "those fighting jihad there would lose an important base."

Kathwari insists that his work in Kashmir didn't distract him from Ethan Allen, and the board doesn't seem worried. "It helps give him a sense of value beyond the furniture business," says Edward H. Meyer, a director and head of Grey Global Group Inc., an advertising agency in New York. Who can argue with that?

Corrections and Clarifications
In "Selling Furniture and Tolerance" (People, Oct. 22) about Ethan Allen Interiors Inc. CEO M. Farooq Kathwari, the name of Kathwari's late son should have been Irfan. BusinessWeek apologizes for the error

See link for scanned page of original article with pictures from Businessweek

http://www.adnan.org/kathwari1.php

http://www.adnan.org/kathwari2.php

MIM:This entry on Google groups reveals that Kathwari is known as a "sucessionist leader' based in America and that he used the Ethan Allen company as a front to meet with a Kashmiri official to discuss what was said to be timber for furniture manufacture. As the writer of the artcle points out - the region in question is does not permit use of forests for timber and the meeting was for political reasons. In a discussion of an article entitled "Letter from a Shaheed" comments were posted which stated that it was Farooq Kathwari who motivated his son to quit his medical studies at Harvard to wage Jihad in Afghanistan where he was killed in 1992. (see entry below)

What would be interesting would be to hold a refrendum in
Jammu , Ladakh and the valley and ask each voter which
state they would like to live in , if these states were
carved out of the present Kashmir .
Its almost certain that most of the Muslims of Doda and even
the valley would vote to join Jammu , to stay in India
proper and this would be a kind of indirect refrendum ..
A divisive agenda

Chief Minister Farooq Abdullah's recent conclave with United
States-based secessionist leader Farooq Kathwari is seen as
part of a larger U.S.-sponsored covert dialogue on Jammu and
Kashmir, in which the Vajpayee Government is complicit.

PRAVEEN SWAMI

JOIN the dots on the graph charting the future of Jammu and
Kashmir, and it is hard to miss the shape staring back from
the page. On March 8, Chief Minister Farooq Abdullah and a
group of his top Cabinet colleagues held a closed-door
secret meeting with Farooq Kathwari, a U.S.-based
secessionist leader. The meeting, held at the Secretariat in
Jammu, appears to be just part of a larger U.S.-sponsored
covert dialogue on Jammu and Kashmir. Indeed, there is
growing evidence that the Bharatiya Janata Party-l ed
coalition government in New Delhi is complicit in this
dialogue, which could lead to a violent communal sundering
of the State.

Kathwari heads the Kashmir Study Group (KSG), an influential
New York-based think tank which has been advocating the
creation of an independent state carved out of the
Muslim-majority areas of Jammu and Kashmir. The owner of
Ethan Allen, an upmarket furn iture concern which includes
the White House among its clients, Kathwari's associates in
the KSG have included influential Indian establishment
figures, notably former Foreign Secretary S.K. Singh and
retired Vice-Admiral N.K. Nair. Kathwari was blacklis ted by
successive Indian governments and on one occasion was even
denied permission to visit the country to meet a seriously
ill relative. Shortly after the BJP-led coalition took power
in 1998, however, he was granted a visa.

It is still unclear at whose initiative the visa was
granted. But Kathwari arrived in New Delhi in March 1999,
carrying a series of proposals for the creation of an
independent Kashmiri state. Called Kashmir: A Way Forward,
the proposals were the outcome of the KSG's deliberations.
On this first visit, he met what one senior intelligence
official describes as a "who's who of the BJP
establishment". Kathwari also appears to have visited Jammu
and Srinagar, staying at the home of a top National Con
ference politician. Frontline has so far been unable to
establish whether he met Abdullah on that occasion.

Public disclosure of Kathwari's proposals provoked a minor
storm. Both S.K. Singh and N.K. Nair disassociated
themselves from its recommendations. Nonetheless, Kathwari
seemed encouraged enough to push ahead with a new version of
Kashmir: A Way Forwar d. Last September, a fresh version of
the document was finalised after, its preface records,
receiving reactions from "government officials in India and
Pakistan". The new document was even more disturbing than
the first. At least one KSG member, the University of South
Carolina's Robert Wirsing, refused even to participate in
the discussions. But the BJP, it now appears, was not wholly
unhappy with the direction Kathwari was proceeding in.

Kashmir: A Way Forward outlines five proposals for the
creation of either one or two new states, which would
together constitute what is described in somewhat opaque
fashion as a "sovereign entity but one without an
international personality". "Th e new entity," the KSG
report says, "would have its own secular, democratic
constitution, as well as its own citizenship, flag and a
legislature which would legislate on all matters other than
defence and foreign affairs... India and Pakistan would be
re sponsible for the defence of the Kashmiri entity, which
would itself maintain police and gendarme forces for
internal law and order purposes. India and Pakistan would be
expected to work out financial arrangements for the Kashmiri
entity, which could inc lude a currency of its own."

Four of five possible Kashmiri entities the KSG discusses
involve two separate states on either side of the Line of
Control (LoC), and territorial exchanges between India and
Pakistan. But the fifth Kashmiri entity outlined in Kashmir:
A Way Forward - of a single state on the Indian side of the
LoC - is the most interesting of the KSG proposals. Premised
on the assumption that Pakistan would be unwilling to allow
the creation of a new entity on its side of the LoC -
although there is no discussio n of what will happen if
India were to be similarly disinclined - the new state would
come into being after a series of tehsil-level referendums.
All the districts of the Kashmir Valley, the districts of
Kargil and Doda, three northern tehsils of Rajouri and one
tehsil of Udhampur, the KSG believes, would opt to join the
new Kashmiri state.

Kashmir: A Way Forward attempts, somewhat desperately, to
prove that its assumptions are not based on communal
grounds. "All these areas," it argues, "are imbued with
Kashmiriyat, the cultural traditions of the Vale of Kashmir,
and/or interact ext ensively with Kashmiri-speaking people."
But this assumption is patently spurious, for several of
these areas also interact similarly with peoples who do not
speak Kashmiri. There is no explanation, for example, as to
why the linguistic, cultural and tra de links between the
three northern Muslim-majority tehsils of Rajouri district
and the three southern Hindu-majority tehsils are of any
less significance than those they have with the Kashmir
region.

Nor is it made clear what linguistic affiliation the tehsils
of Karnah and Uri in Kashmir, where just 3.2 per cent and
3.1 per cent of the population were recorded as
Kashmiri-speakers in the 1981 Census, the last carried out
in Jammu and Kashmir, might have with the Valley. Indeed,
these tehsils have recorded some of the highest voter
turnouts in successive elections from 1996, suggesting that
their residents have little sympathy for Kashmir
Valley-centred secessionist politics. Similarly, while
Ramban and Bhaderwah tehsils in Doda are not
Kashmiri-speaking and principally trade with Jammu, the KSG
proposals make the a priori assumption that they would vote
to join the new state.

OFFICIALS in Jammu and Kashmir seemed uncertain of just what
Kathwari and Abdullah discussed during their meeting. State
Chief Secretary Ashok Jaitley told Frontline that the
meeting had indeed been held, but said that he was unaware
of just what was discussed. "What I can tell you is that the
initiative for the meeting was not ours," he said, "and that
the highest quarters were consulted before it was held."
Others said Kathwari had requested the meeting to discuss a
potential timber business in the State. Neither the Jammu
and Kashmir Directorate of Public Relations, which handles
media interaction with the Chief Minister, nor Abdullah's
personal staff, responded to queries from Frontline.

Even leaving aside the minor point that following Supreme
Court orders, felling forests is illegal in Jammu and
Kashmir it seems implausible that the content of Kathwari's
dialogue with Abdullah centred on raw material for Ethan
Allen. The National Confe rence's proposals for Jammu and
Kashmir's future have striking similarities with those that
the KSG is touting. The controversial report of the Regional
Autonomy Committee (RAC), which was tabled in the Jammu and
Kashmir Assembly last year (Frontline , July 30, 1999) and
is in the process of being implemented, bears similarities
with the KSG proposals. Muslim-majority Rajouri and Poonch
are scheduled to be cut away from the Jammu region and
recast as a new Pir Panjal province. The single districts of
Buddhist-majority Leh and Muslim-majority Kargil too will be
sundered from each other and become new provinces.

In some cases, the RAC Report and the KSG proposals mirror
each other down to the smallest detail. For example,
Kashmir: A Way Forward refers to the inclusion of a
Gool-Gulabgarh tehsil in the new state. There is, in fact,
no such tehsil. Gool and Gulabgarh were parts of the tehsil
of Mahore, the sole Muslim-majority tehsil of Udhampur
district, until 1999. Gool subsequently became a separate
tehsil. But the proposal for Mahore's sundering from
Udhampur and inclusion in the Chenab province was fi rst
made in the RAC Report. According to the RAC plan, as in the
KSG proposals, Mahore would form part of the Chenab
province, while Udhampur would be incorporated in the
Hindu-majority Jammu province.

Significantly, Abdullah's plans for the future of Jammu and
Kashmir's relationship with India match the KSG's
formulation of a quasi-sovereign state. The report of the
State Autonomy Committee (SAC), which was released in March
1999 and is now under cons ideration by the Centre, would
leave New Delhi with no powers other than the management of
defence, external affairs and communications. Fundamental
rights mentioned in the Constitution, for example, would no
longer apply to Jammu and Kashmir if the SAC has its way.
They will have to be substituted by a separate chapter on
fundamental rights in the Jammu and Kashmir Constitution,
which now contains only Directive Principles. The Supreme
Court's jurisdiction over Jammu and Kashmir will end and the
State Election Commission will conduct polls in the State,
not the Election Commission of India.

While the National Conference's demands for greater autonomy
are in themselves not disturbing, the context in which they
have been made and their character are. For one, the SAC
proposals were pushed through without debate in the Assembly
and a nation-wi de political debate on the issue, promised
by Abdullah, never took place. Meaningful autonomy seems to
be the last of the SAC's concerns. The report does not
contain even one sentence about financial autonomy,
essential ...

What would be interesting would be to hold a refrendum in
Jammu , Ladakh and the valley and ask each voter which
state they would like to live in , if these states were
carved out of the present Kashmir .
Its almost certain that most of the Muslims of Doda and even
the valley would vote to join Jammu , to stay in India
proper and this would be a kind of indirect refrendum ..
A divisive agenda

Chief Minister Farooq Abdullah's recent conclave with United
States-based secessionist leader Farooq Kathwari is seen as
part of a larger U.S.-sponsored covert dialogue on Jammu and
Kashmir, in which the Vajpayee Government is complicit.

PRAVEEN SWAMI

read more »

Aug 5 2000, 3:00 am

2. nusrat rizvi Aug 5 2000, 3:00 am

Farouq Kathwari Pres. of Danbury based Ethan Allan Corp. also did
something
equally stupid in filling his son's head usual Islamic nonsense. As a
result he too took leave from Harvard Medical School to go fight in
Kashmir. He did not know any Urdu or anything else about the conflict
except that it was a fight between good and evil. Good meaning of
course Islam and Hindu were no doubt the evil.
On an excursion in Kashmir his group saw an Indian military truck and
decided to engage it by opening fire. The Indian soldiers returned
fire and a shell fragment from a grenade severed an artery causing him
to bleed to death. His comrades left his body on the scene for the
Indian soldiers to find, where upon they found documents revealing his
identity. American Embassy was informed which arranged his body to be
send back to Connecticut.
At his funeral services a Jewish boy who was a childhood friend got up
and shouted at his parents that "my friend lies in that box today
because YOU filled his head with hatred" No other words were spoken
afterwards.

Momin Aug 5 2000, 3:00 am show options
Newsgroups: soc.culture.indian, soc.culture.pakistan, alt.religion.islam, soc.culture.punjab
From: Momin <M...@momin.com
Date: 2000/08/05
Subject: Re: Message of a shaheed .

- nusrat rizvi wrote:
> Farouq Kathwari Pres. of Danbury based Ethan Allan Corp. also did
> something
> equally stupid in filling his son's head usual Islamic nonsense. As a
> result he too took leave from Harvard Medical School to go fight in
> Kashmir. He did not know any Urdu or anything else about the conflict
> except that it was a fight between good and evil. Good meaning of
> course Islam and Hindu were no doubt the evil.
> On an excursion in Kashmir his group saw an Indian military truck and
> decided to engage it by opening fire. The Indian soldiers returned
> fire and a shell fragment from a grenade severed an artery causing him
> to bleed to death. His comrades left his body on the scene for the
> Indian soldiers to find, where upon they found documents revealing his
> identity. American Embassy was informed which arranged his body to be
> send back to Connecticut.
> At his funeral services a Jewish boy who was a childhood friend got up
> and shouted at his parents that "my friend lies in that box today
> because YOU filled his head with hatred" No other words were spoken
> afterwards.

Things haven't changed any. This fucked up kathwari continues to pump
money for ongoing terrorist activities in Kashmir. The irony is that the
stupid Indian eunuchs at the helm are fully aware of it....
Somebody needs to sue Ethan Allan for sponsoring global terrorism...

4. nusrat rizvi Aug 5 2000, 3:00 am
Newsgroups: soc.culture.indian, soc.culture.pakistan, alt.religion.islam, soc.culture.punjab
From: nusrat rizvi <rizvi...@pipeline.com
Date: 2000/08/05
Subject: Re: Message of a shaheed .
On Sat, 05 Aug 2000 11:46:28 GMT, Momin <M...@momin.com> wrote:
>nusrat rizvi wrote:

>> Farouq Kathwari Pres. of Danbury based Ethan Allan Corp. also did
>> something
>> equally stupid in filling his son's head usual Islamic nonsense. As a
>> result he too took leave from Harvard Medical School to go fight in
>> Kashmir. He did not know any Urdu or anything else about the conflict
>> except that it was a fight between good and evil. Good meaning of
>> course Islam and Hindu were no doubt the evil.
>> On an excursion in Kashmir his group saw an Indian military truck and
>> decided to engage it by opening fire. The Indian soldiers returned
>> fire and a shell fragment from a grenade severed an artery causing him
>> to bleed to death. His comrades left his body on the scene for the
>> Indian soldiers to find, where upon they found documents revealing his
>> identity. American Embassy was informed which arranged his body to be
>> send back to Connecticut.
>> At his funeral services a Jewish boy who was a childhood friend got up
>> and shouted at his parents that "my friend lies in that box today
>> because YOU filled his head with hatred" No other words were spoken
>> afterwards.

>Things haven't changed any. This fucked up kathwari continues to pump
>money for ongoing terrorist activities in Kashmir. The irony is that the
>stupid Indian eunuchs at the helm are fully aware of it....
>Somebody needs to sue Ethan Allan for sponsoring global terrorism...

I dont think he uses his corporate funds for his nefarious deeds,
after all its an American Corporation with their boards of directors
who will skin him alive if they found him doing something like that
with their money.

------

http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.pakistan/msg/e600ea9b01b98575?&hl=en&q=farooq+kathwari

A meeting that portends a new Kashmir

JAMMU, March 14

WITH the US President, Mr. Bill Clinton's visit to India and Pakistan
just days away, the dots on the map charting the future of Jammu &
Kashmir are starting to join together into a striking picture.

The Jammu & Kashmir Chief Minister, Dr. Farooq Abdullah, held a
one-to-one closed-door meeting with Mr. Farooq Kathwari, a top
secessionist political figure, in Jammu last week. He subsequently flew
to Srinagar, where he stayed with his father-in-law, Mr. Ghulam Rasool
Khan. The March 8 meeting with Mr. Kathwari suggests that the Union
Government is engaged in a dialogue on plans that would, in effect,
amount to a fresh partition of Jammu & Kashmir, this time on communal
lines.

Mr. Kathwari heads the Kashmir Studies Group (KSG), an influential
think-tank which has been advocating the creation of a quasi-independent
State carved out of the Muslim-majority areas of Jammu & Kashmir. The
owner of Ethan Allen, an upmarket furniture concern which includes the
White House among its clients, Mr. Kathwari's associates in the KSG
include the former Foreign Secretary, Mr. N.K. Singh, and Vice-Admiral
S.K. Nair (retd.). Although the furniture tycoon had been blacklisted by
successive Indian governments, he received a visa last year and visited
several senior establishment figures.

A KSG report circulated among top Indian and Pakistani officials
subsequently detailed proposals for the creation of a new "sovereign
entity but one without an international personality." "The new
entity," the report said, "would have its own secular, democratic
constitution, as well as its own citizenship, flag and a legislature
which would legislate on all matters other than defence and foreign
affairs."

The most significant of five proposals Kashmir: A Way Forward envisages
is a single Kashmiri State on the Indian side of the Line of Control
(LoC). It argues for a series of tehsil-level referendums leading to all
of the Kashmir Valley's districts, along with the district of Doda,
opting to be part of the new entity. The KSG's new entity would also
include the district of Kargil, three northern tehsils from Rajouri, and
a single tehsil of Udhampur. The new State would, in effect, be an
agglomeration of the Muslim-majority tehsils of Jammu & Kashmir.

No one in Jammu seemed to be aware of just what Dr. Abdullah discussed
with Mr. Kathwari during their hour-long interaction. The Chief
Secretary, Mr. Ashok Jaitley, told Business Line that the meeting had
indeed been held, but said that he was unaware of just what had been
discussed. "What I can tell you is that the initiative for the meeting
was not ours," he said, "and that the highest quarters were consulted
before it was held." Neither the Jammu & Kashmir Directorate of Public
Relations, which handles media interaction with the Chief Minister, nor
Dr. Abdullah's personal staff responded to queries.

While officials contacted in New Delhi argued that the Kathwari-Abdullah
meeting had no significance, the facts appear to suggest otherwise. The
KSG's specific suggestions for the powers of the new entity are
remarkably similar to those proposed by Jammu & Kashmir's State Autonomy
Commission (SAC). The SAC's report, now under consideration by the Union
Government, would restore the State's 1953 constitutional status, giving
it power over all subjects barring defence and external affairs.
Significantly, no major Union Government figure has taken issue with the
proposals.

The communal ripping apart of Jammu & Kashmir suggested in the KSG
report has also found expression in the controversial recommendations of
the Jammu & Kashmir Regional Autonomy Commission (RAC). The RAC proposes
to create a series of communally-homogeneous provinces, mirroring the
KSG report's cartographic content down to the last tehsil. More than a
few observers believe that the dialogue now in progress could lead to an
internal partition of Jammu & Kashmir, with the Muslim-majority
provinces gaining quasi-independence, and the Hindu-majority regions
being further integrated in India.

Interestingly, the Pakistani journalist, Mr. Talat Hussain, reported
last year in The Nation that the back-channel negotiators during the
Kargil war, Mr. Niaz Naik and Mr. R.K. Mishra, had discussed what was
described as the "Chenab Plan" for Kashmir. The Chenab Plan which,
according to Mr. Hussain's report, was documented in a Pakistani
proposal, an Indian response, and a second Pakistani proposal, suggested
recognition of the LoC as the border, followed by the grant of autonomy
to Kashmir Valley. Several US establishment figures, too, have argued
that India needs to make concessions in this direction.

The secrecy shrouding such dialogue has fuelled fears that the Bharatiya
Janata Party (BJP)-led Union Government is engaged in an exercise that
could have serious repercussions. The Communist Party of India (Marxist)
MLA, Mr. M.Y. Tarigami, told Business Line that the senior BJP leader,
Mr. K.R. Malkani, had, at a conference last month, told him that a
division of Jammu, Kashmir and Ladakh was, in the long term, inevitable.

MIM: Kathwari brother Rafiq's radical Islamist proclivities are evident in this 'poetry' which was published on the ersatz Al Jazeera website. Rafiq, who boasts of having a Jewish girlfriend and mentor blasts Israel in poem number 1

.Poem number two glorifies the death of his nephew in Afghanistan fighting 'Jihad', who was his Farooq Kathwari's son Imran. http://www.aljazeerah.info/Poetry/2004%20Poems/Palestine,%20Afghanistan,%20Iraq%20By%20Rafiq%20Kathwari.htm

Poem 1

ISRAELI PATROLS KILL

90 DOGS IN ARAB TOWN

The New York Times, April 14, 1995

Mother, I'm living in sin with an Egyptian

Jew raised in Paris. We stroll in Central Park.

Gaulois, her mutt, off the leash. Lucky he's

not in Hebron, where gods kill dogs for sport.

Poem 2

HISTORY'S MOST PERSECUTED MINORITY

IS INSENSITIVE TO THE ASPIRATIONS

OF WORLD'S MOST DISPOSSESSED TRIBE

I held my sister-in-law's hand

in the back seat of the Volkswagen

while my older brother drove

through red lights to Maimonides.

"Kicking," she said, drawing my hand

over her belly. I lowered my gaze: Her

toes curled on the car floor.

He was born a Scorpio.

For years I watched my nephew

dunk hoops, grow his hair long, flunk

Islam and embrace the NRA,

his dad's rifle on boy's shoulder.

"On Judgment Day," he wrote

"We shall meet again."

Allah's soldier flung a stone

somewhere in Afghanistan

the enemy fired arcs across

a cobalt sky. In their Brooklyn yard

his mom was pruning roses

the day the call came.

Poem 3

ASSIGNMENT

Only Muslim in the workshop,

I went on about the President,

his firm stand on Iraq,

civilization's cradle, bombed

back to the Stone Age for flaunting

weapons sold by capitalist gunrunners.

I am a witness, I must howl, I said.

In every well in Baghdad a Rafiq

is weeping while long black coats (with

gas masks) huddle at the Wailing Wall,

as if prayers could halt smart bombs.

"Rhetoric, not lyric," my peers echoed Yeats.

"Argue with yourself, not others." The teacher,

an adjunct, said "Presidential warhead

rising from its silo was over the top. Nike

stockpiling kneepads, sick. Not ars poetica."

***

Rafiq Kathwaria is a Kashmiri-American poet and author of the award-winning website http://KashmirRetextured.com

------------

http://www.counterpunch.org/kathwari.html

Rafiq Kathwari recounts his own role in Jihad and trivialises 9/11 with an article entitled 'Kashmir Dispute Will Make Ground Zero Seem like a Bonfire.

Kashmir Dispute Will Make Ground Zero Seem Like a Bonfire

By Rafiq Kathwari

When I was a teenager about 35 years ago and in my final year in college in Srinagar, the summer capital of Kashmir, the movie "Battle for Algiers" was a big hit. It captured my imagination as well as that of my classmates, one of whom approached me a few days later and asked if I would commit myself to the liberation of Kashmir. Yes, of course, I said, reading a typed sheet my friend took out from his coat pocket. "Bear Arms against a Sea of Troubles," I remember the title said.

"This is our manifesto," my friend said as I read the aims and objectives, which included blowing up bridges and the local radio and telephone buildings, ambushing army convoys and killing soldiers. The text said nothing about where we would get arms and ammunition, the number of members in the group, how we would organize, who our leader was or when we would execute our plan.

However, I remember the manifesto was long on the why, with each point emphasized in the present tense: Our cause is freedom. India promised us a referendum on our future, but fails to keep its promise. Prime Minster Nehru, the last Englishman to rule India, has kept our popular leader Sheikh Abdullah in jail for over 15 years. To the extent that India denies us our fundamental rights and subverts its own constitution, to that extent, India is not a democracy.

It was great stuff for my impressionable mind. My friend had energized me. If the Algerians could do it, so could Kashmiris. I read the typed manifesto again before signing it with a flourish.

A few weeks later that teenage flirtation landed me for 11 months in Srinagar's Central Jail, where I met 12 of my classmates who had also signed the manifesto. (The college Principal had been somehow alerted to the plan and called the police.) Subsequently, India announced that it had cracked a dangerous gang of terrorists trained in Pakistan. There was no trial. We were just locked up and forgotten, until one beneficent pro-India sycophant in Kashmir was replaced by another, who ordered an amnesty. Soon after, I fled to the future of other continents.

The passage of 35 years hasn't dimmed my memory. My passion for Kashmir's freedom is undiminished, despite the horror of the last ten years during which anywhere from 35,000 to 80,000 mostly civilians have been killed. Maddened by merciless Hinduization of Kashmir's Muslim culture, the lack of career opportunities and India's repeated betrayals during the past 50 years, a rag tag army of young Kashmiri men took on the third largest army in the world.

To obtains arms, those young men crossed the Line of Control that divides Indian from Pakistani- administered Kashmir, rode in buses to Kabul, where armaments supplied by the CIA to the Mujahideen were readily available after the Soviets withdrew from Afghanistan. India calls those Kashmiri youth "cross border terrorists" and blames Pakistan for supporting them. Pakistan, which has competing claims on Kashmir, calls them freedom fighters. Many Kashmiris I know simply say, a plague on all your houses, which, of course, includes my adopted home-I know it's politically incorrect to say it- the United States.

Many young native Kashmiri men who took up arms against a sea of troubles are dead or languishing in India's jails. The fighting now is being mostly done by foreign mercenaries, recruited by the elusive Mr. bin Laden, whose so-called martyrs have changed the tenor of Kashmir's legitimate struggle to that of an Islamic Jihad against Hindu India.

"See, we told you so," India is screaming, "Kashmiris are terrorists." India has fueled Western fears of resurgent Islam, propagandizing the militancy as fundamentalist, which in turn enables India to flout all international codes of conduct in Kashmir. If all Kashmiris are terrorists and must be smoked out of the Himalayas by 500,000 Indian troops stationed there, then let us at the very least agree on a working definition of terrorism which must include both the unofficial and official variety.

But, wait. Let's be honest. Prior to the militancy, India portrayed Kashmir as the model for secularism in India, as the warp of her pluralist democracy. What has propelled Kashmiri society seemingly overnight from a model of secularism to deranged fanaticism?

Under the present ultra right wing regime, Indian society is becoming increasingly intolerant and absolutist. There is a profound disturbance within Mother India. Many Indians I know think of India as a super power next only to the United States. I will believe that when Kashmir, the source of five great rivers, gets a basic sanitation system and an unrestricted flow of electricity the Kashmir valley itself generates.

Kashmiris have been enslaved for generations. The West is finally taking note of the fact that regional conflicts have a global reach. Nothing is remote anymore. It never was. Now we must do whatever is necessary to win the hearts and minds of alienated peoples such as the Kashmiris. Restore their dignity. Fulfill longstanding promises, and watch how swiftly Kashmiris sign a manifesto to honor democracy in a world that has changed literally overnight after nine eleven zero one. Indifference will make Ground Zero seem like a Boy Scout's bonfire gone awry.


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44 posted on 06/29/2006 7:13:59 AM PDT by Paul Ross (We cannot be for lawful ordinances and for an alien conspiracy at one and the same moment.-Cicero)
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To: fanfan
Seriously, Islam sure appears to be a form of mental disorder. It's attendant with strong antisocial, delusional and paranoid aspects. They couldn't decide if a beheading was the act of a brave jihadist or the Americans trying to make Islam look bad? Can't they decide if it's good or bad? In a court of law, if one can not determine the difference between good and bad, that is the definition of criminally insane.
45 posted on 06/29/2006 7:14:55 AM PDT by highlander_UW (I don't know what my future holds, but I know Who holds my future)
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To: CatoRenasci

STOP, I'm gonna have a stomach ache if I don't stop laughing! I was thinking more along the lines of what we heard way back when Gitmo was first installed. Do you remember hearing about the soldiers playing that purple dinosaur Barney's song 24/7?

I love you, you love me, we're a happy family...... (knick knack patty whack tune) That would make me confess anything


46 posted on 06/29/2006 7:17:17 AM PDT by SaintDismas
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To: coconutt2000
Is there any chance we can get these women to come to our country to speak at:

The National Organization for Women (NOW)
Liberal Jewish organizations
Liberal feminist organizations
MoveOn.org

Why? They will get a standing ovation.

47 posted on 06/29/2006 7:17:44 AM PDT by Alouette (Psalms of the Day: 18-22)
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To: reagan_fanatic
I wonder if she would be happier in a true islamic society ... she'd fare better under the taliban, where she would probably be led out onto a stadium field and a bullet put into her brain.

Dunno if she would be happier, but I do know I'd be happier...

48 posted on 06/29/2006 7:21:09 AM PDT by null and void (When you're thinking about beating the odds, consider the outcome of the odds beating you.)
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To: fanfan; Admin Moderator
Mods - Shouldn't this thread be in Breaking News??

A "broad strata" of Canadian society.

"Some are students, some are employed, some are unemployed,"... some are jihadists, some are Jew-haters, some are living on the edge of treason against Canada.

49 posted on 06/29/2006 7:23:54 AM PDT by angkor
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To: Alouette

The point is to get them a standing ovation.

It will seriously detract from the Left's moral positions, and prove that those organizations' alliance is with the enemy rather than with their country.


50 posted on 06/29/2006 7:25:45 AM PDT by coconutt2000 (NO MORE PEACE FOR OIL!!! DOWN WITH TYRANTS, TERRORISTS, AND TIMIDCRATS!!!! (3-T's For World Peace))
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