Kilo-type 636 class boat
Posted on 07/10/2006 5:40:08 AM PDT by sukhoi-30mki
U.S. striving to detect diesel submarines
The Navy is concentrating its efforts to find the quiet, difficult-to-detect crafts in Asia and the Pacific region.
Eric Rosenberg Hearst Newspapers
Last update: July 08, 2006 – 11:00 PM
WASHINGTON - The U.S. Navy is stepping up its program for detecting new diesel-powered submarines that are extremely quiet, hard to find and increasingly relied upon by China, Iran and North Korea.
(Excerpt) Read more at startribune.com ...
Kilo-type 636 class boat
Ping!!
Perhaps recent decisions to use "less intense" sonar will help this effort. Or not.
Apparently the Chinese don't want us to find them. I wonder why?
I drive a diesel. I hear diesel 18-wheelers on the highway. These things are noisy. How can a diesel sub be quiet?
I would think the technology would preclude that.
The hope is to only use passive sonar to detect an enemy. It's like using your radar in a fighter plane. If you go active it gives away your position long before you can detect the other guy. You want to use sensors that don't radiate, or at least don't radiate in a manner that puts you at risk. That's why working with an AWACs is so successful for fighters. They know where the bad guys are because the AWACs tells them, but the bad guys can't detect them. Of course, they can detect the AWACs so they know someone is out there, and you have to detail some folks to protect the AWACs, but you get the idea.
From what I understand we should be able to detect these boats just fine when they're operating. The concern is that they'll get into position at a strategic choke point before our forces get within detection range then just sit totally quiet waiting for us to get in range. That requires different capabilities and tactics.
Also, I don't think these are accurately called "diesel submarines." I believe they are diesel/electric submarines. They operate on battery power when submerged and surface (snorkle) to run the diesels to recharge the batteries.
We need some bubble heads to chime in and correct my semi literate notions.
I seem to recall a while back some company sold some quiet propeller technology to the Russians or maybe the Chinese.
We have been working on this since I was a submarine sonar tech in 1987. This has been a problem for a while.
The nuclear subs are noisy enough that we use passive sonar to detect them. The diesels on batteries are so quiet that we have to use active sonar to ping them. This has the save the whales people in a tizzy. Sorry Shamu, but one of my carriers is worth the lot of you.
And one ping only, Vasily.
Mitsubishi (sp?) sold the USSR multi-axis metal lathes which they used to dramatically reduce noise coming from their submarine propellers. They did this during the mid 1980s.
They said they were sorry, though. /s
I'm not a bubble head, but I have a few friends that are.
I believe you are correct that this is more correctly termed a diesel/electric. It would be pretty hard to run a diesel underwater for an extended period of time. The diesel is used for surface running and to charge the batteries.
Subs are very easy to track when they are running the diesel. As you noted, they are very difficult to find when they are sitting still.
And THEY said they were sorry afterwards. /s
ID of diesel subs when they are on the surface, is very difficult because they sound like any other vessel, underwater, they run on electric motors that make very little noise.
diesel-powered submarines that are extremely quiet
Uh, I was under the, educated, impression that anything that moves in the water can be detected by the "bubbleheads". Has the US Navy LOST sonar capability?
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