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1 posted on 08/08/2006 8:03:43 AM PDT by A. Pole
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To: ninenot; sittnick; steve50; Hegemony Cricket; Willie Green; Wolfie; ex-snook; FITZ; arete; ...

Bump


2 posted on 08/08/2006 8:04:25 AM PDT by A. Pole (Saint Augustine: "The truth speaks from the bottom of the heart without the noise of words")
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To: A. Pole
The 1973 Syndrome. What’s wrong with Israel?

-----

Today's Jew and Israeli are different.............. somewhat like today's Democrat.

Bad times ahead for everyone!

3 posted on 08/08/2006 8:07:42 AM PDT by beyond the sea (The truth exists even when ignored.)
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To: A. Pole

I'm reading that Israel has only mobilized 5-10% of its forces against Hezbollah?


4 posted on 08/08/2006 8:09:03 AM PDT by Fenris6 (3 Purple Hearts in 4 months w/o missing a day of work? He's either John Rambo or a Fraud)
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To: A. Pole

Second guessers. Israel will do fine.

That said, a needed wake-up call against the soft underbelly before having to fight a real army.


5 posted on 08/08/2006 8:09:30 AM PDT by MeanWestTexan (Kol Hakavod Lezahal)
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To: A. Pole
It is too early to predict just what changes we will see and who will pick up the pieces...

Benjamin Netanyahu.

7 posted on 08/08/2006 8:10:49 AM PDT by Rummyfan
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To: A. Pole

Outstanding article. Thanks for posting.


10 posted on 08/08/2006 8:11:25 AM PDT by EternalHope (Boycott everything French forever. Including their vassal nations.)
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To: A. Pole
A remarkably stupid article. Counter Terrorist operations are not the same as a conventional military fight. Comparing the 6 day war or the 1973 war to this fight in Lebanon is an absurd comparison of Apples to Peanuts. It does not fight in any way shape or form. Counter Terrorist ops work at a totally different pace. It is this idiotic need to try and force a Asymmetrical Warfare problem into the Conventional Warfare format by these "Conservative Military Experts" that renders their analysis completely ridiculous.
11 posted on 08/08/2006 8:11:38 AM PDT by MNJohnnie (A proportionate response would be the indiscriminate slaughter of Western journalists)
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To: A. Pole
"The blindness displayed by those elites toward the future and the recent blindness of the past will no doubt yield political consequences and a reckoning."

As it will in America if the Dhimmicrats take over.

12 posted on 08/08/2006 8:12:27 AM PDT by sageb1 (This is the Final Crusade. There are only 2 sides. Pick one.)
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To: dennisw; Cachelot; Nix 2; veronica; Catspaw; knighthawk; Alouette; Optimist; weikel; Lent; GregB; ..
If you'd like to be on this middle east/political ping list, please FR mail me.

High volume. Articles on Israel can also be found by clicking on the Topic or Keyword Israel. also

2006israelwar or WOT

..................

14 posted on 08/08/2006 8:13:48 AM PDT by SJackson (The Pilgrims—Doing the jobs Native Americans wouldn't do!)
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To: A. Pole

Bibi arising, Bump!


15 posted on 08/08/2006 8:14:42 AM PDT by Uncle Miltie (Islamofascists' tactics are all War Crimes according to the Geneva Convention.)
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To: A. Pole
Those who think we must always do today as we have done before are doomed.

The hezzies defended against a blitz and the IDF has foiled those efforts by deliberately probing and killing.

The object according to Patton is to make that other sombitch die for his country. That's what is unfolding.
16 posted on 08/08/2006 8:15:31 AM PDT by bert (K.E. N.P. Slay Pinch)
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To: A. Pole

Secular Jews believe that it is the IDF rather than the God of Abraham that preserves Israel.

The surprise is - what?

18 posted on 08/08/2006 8:17:01 AM PDT by MrEdd (More cheep than a flock of baby chickens.)
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To: A. Pole

I don't think the problem is the Israeli military,but more a result of the terrorists hiding amongst civilians and using the population as human shields.As a result progress has been understandably slow.


22 posted on 08/08/2006 8:19:27 AM PDT by Thombo2
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To: A. Pole; DelphiUser; Citizen Tom Paine; Vn_survivor_67-68
There is a great deal of misplaced angst in Conservative circles about the the Israeli operations in Lebanon. In the first days of the war, Ralph Peters was all ready moaning, “ISRAEL is losing this war. For a lifelong Israel supporter, that's a painful thing to write “ This week Charles Krauthammer exclaimed Olmert’s “search for victory on the cheap has jeopardized not just the Lebanon operation but America's confidence in Israel as well” To quote Lady Thatcher, “This is no time to go wobbly” Conservatives!

The problem with these admiribable men’s analyses is they are trying to force a Conventional Warfare paradigm onto an Asymmetrical warfare problem. That simply will not work.

Start with our Revolution, Napoleon in Spain, Spain in South American, the US in Vietnam, Various European powers all over the world, the Nazis in Eastern Europe, the French then the Americans in Vietnam, the Russians in Afghanistan. A Conventional Warfare doctrine applied to an Asymmetrical problem always ends in the eventual bloody defeat for the Conventional Force.

Think of Israel as a boxer punching a sand bag. No matter how hard they hit, they cannot hold their fist to the bag forever. Thus as soon as they pull their fist back the weight of the sand forces the bag back to the same old shape. This time Israel, with the backing of the Bush Administration, is trying to find a way to empty the sand OUT of the bag so that when Israel's fist is removed, the bag does not simply revert to the same old form.

It's not as dramatic or made for TV sexy but it DOES have the virtue of possible achieving a workable longer-term strategic change for Israel. Israel is going for the long game, a solution to a decade long cancer NOT a drama queen ego feeding headline grabbing military blitz.

It would be utterly stupid for Israel to settle for just pruning back Hizbolla when they could possible completely uproots it.

All the various armchair Patton's plans would accomplish is a lot of dead Jews for a short term "Quick fix". Hizbolla would simply bleed the Israelis while pulling back into sanctuary areas in Syria and northern Lebanon. Then when the Israelis could no longer stand the blood and treasure long term occupation was costing them, Hizbolla would simply flow back into the same positions they hold now. And in a few years from now the Israelis would face the same crises in Lebanon

Like the US in Iraq, Israel seems to be trying for a long term FIX that uproots Hizbolla and creates a viable Lebanese Govt that can police its own territory. That is why the Israelis are interested in a NATO force to do in Lebanon what it is currently doing in Afghanistan. The UN has showed it simply is too corrupt and ineffective to manage peacekeeping duties. Israel, and the world, need a force that can keep out the Terrorists while the Lebanese build a viable nation-state that can provide long term stability. Thus the Israel and the US should be looking with interest to the French.

The French are the ideal choice because of their history with Lebanon. They have good troops with lots of peace keeping experience (Its their politics that are messed up, not their military) Being Lefties the Media will pretty much ignore the head cracking they need to do as peace keepers. They do not trigger the knee jerk hysteria British, American or Jewish troops would in the Arabs. For domestic consumption the French can spin this mission as one to protect the Muslims " stopping" the Israelis. France does not have any where near the existing military commitments that the US and Britain do so have the forces available to take this one. With France heading the mission Germany, Spain and the other reluctant nervous nellies among the old Europe nations would have political coverage to get involved. The Israelis get a Neutral Zone and make one front in the WOT someone else's headache. It sends a message to Syria and Iran that the EU is not divided on controlling their terrorists’ proxy forces and adds pressure on Tehran to make a deal on the nuclear issue since they are diplomatically isolated. It would be also be impossible for domestic political reasons for the French to let the mission fail. In face of the success we are having in Afghanistan and Iraq, France needs to prove itself a serious world player. This mission thus would be seen as a test of France's vision of Pan Europeanism.

The $64 billion question is will the French do it?

"Israel's Lost Moment" Washington Post Friday, August 4, 2006; By Charle Krualthammer

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/08/03/AR2006080301258.html

"CAN ISRAEL WIN?" New York Post July 22, 2206. By Ralph Peters

http://www.nypost.com/postopinion/opedcolumnists/can_israel_win__opedcolumnists_ralph_peters.htm

26 posted on 08/08/2006 8:37:32 AM PDT by MNJohnnie (A proportionate response would be the indiscriminate slaughter of Western journalists)
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To: A. Pole
There is nothing wrong with Israel. If anything, to keep world opinion at bay, it's fighting with one arm tied behind its back, as demonstrated by its leaflet drops informing Lebanese civilians (and effectively, the Hezbollah terrorists as well) that the bombs are coming.

Moreover, the current war is asymmetric, unlike the 1973 war, which was fought conventionally by opposing tanks and battalions. Apples and oranges, in short...

27 posted on 08/08/2006 8:38:21 AM PDT by Virginia Ridgerunner ("Si vis pacem para bellum")
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To: A. Pole
Re: 1973
An interesting analogy.
The '73 war is the one the Israeli's don't talk much about because they were caught flat footed and had to sacrifice their best to survive.
28 posted on 08/08/2006 8:41:01 AM PDT by Zathras
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To: A. Pole
Yet...

They live in the Tel Aviv area, and are therefore not directly exposed to the missile attacks in the north

30 posted on 08/08/2006 8:44:15 AM PDT by Ready4Freddy (Hey, look man, I didn't mean to shoot the son of a b!tch. The gun went off. I don't know why.)
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To: A. Pole
I agree. This spells the beginning of the end of the Oslo process. Israelis if anything want the government to be even tougher in prosecuting the war and if it is perceived to fall short of victory, it will pay the price.

((Go Israel, Go! Slap 'Em Down Hezbullies.)

39 posted on 08/08/2006 9:35:07 AM PDT by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives On In My Heart Forever)
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To: A. Pole
What's wrong with Israel?

Hmmm, you win a big war, take a lot of territory and let your enemies live there, arm themselves, and attack you.

Gosh, I have no idea what's wrong.

41 posted on 08/08/2006 10:38:35 AM PDT by Nachum
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To: A. Pole

Relatively easy to beat conventional Arab armies - Western Armies are made to do it.

Terrorism is something different. Western democracies might even be built to lose to it.


42 posted on 08/08/2006 10:54:09 AM PDT by MalikDelosReyes ("'Wise men' often wonder while strong men die.")
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