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I'd prefer to import apples than import an abusive labor system.

So the illegals make the long, difficult, voluntary trip to Washington just so the growers can abuse them?

Right. Look, SJ -- there's plenty wrong with illegal immigration. But the work is not "abusive." It's a voluntarily employment agreement, and to the illegals it's pretty good income. It's about as free-market a system as you're likely to see these days.

FYI, after apples and pears are done, many of the illegals take their pay back down to Mexico and then come back again the next year.

FYI, after apples and pears are done, many of the illegals take their pay back down to Mexico and then come back again the next year.

Or move on to grapes and cherries and whatever else is ready to harvest. These crops depend on a large, mobile workforce for just a few weeks, the little towns can't support the workers all year round, but they do need them during harvest.

So the illegals make the long, difficult, voluntary trip to Washington just so the growers can abuse them?... Right. Look, SJ -- there's plenty wrong with illegal immigration. But the work is not "abusive." It's a voluntarily employment agreement, and to the illegals it's pretty good income. It's about as free-market a system as you're likely to see these days....FYI, after apples and pears are done, many of the illegals take their pay back down to Mexico and then come back again the next year.

The system is abusive. Illegals are paid less than legal workers, Americans or H2 holders. Working conditions may or may no meet legal standards. Social costs are paid by the taxpayer. Immigration and tax laws are violated as a matter of doing "business". In my view, the blame lies largely with the employers, and law (non) enforcement, from immigration to the IRS.

BTW, a legal, H2 visa holder can travel to the US, fare usually paid by the employer, work hard, earn money, take it back to Mexico, and come back next year. All in the light of day. And in fact they do, I've posted several articles on operations using H2 workers.

Personally, I'd like to see the program require some level of medical and liability insurance required as well.

It's abusive when you see grown men folded into the back of a pick-up truck with a lid on top of the truck bed, covering the five to eight men packed like sardines in a can when it is 100 degrees outside. Not sure if the men were headed to Washington to pick apples and cherries or if they were headed to some construction site. But what I have seen is abusive and akin to what slaves went through in the bottom of boats in the 1700s and 1800s. It is disgraceful on the part of the folks who transport these people, and it's disgraceful on the part of the folks who wont keep these folks from doing this.

Maybe the "work" is not abusive. How much do these farmers pay????????