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To: tgambill
Hopple, what are your facts...

Right now the only fact I'm dealing with is your inability or unwillingness to answer my question as to how Pearl Harbor was a setup.

17 posted on 09/30/2006 8:20:18 AM PDT by Hoplite
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To: Hoplite

Well actually, I will answer on Monday, or maybe tomorrow. We are closing shop now, and this is the way the Dark Continent internet.

I will have two answers for you on the mass grave issue and if you want to....the WWII "setup"'s quite interesting. You will find that I'm never unable or unwilling to answer....know why? Because, I'm always open to learning something new if I'm wrong, teaching those teachable if I'm right, and always, "willing" if she is single and good looking.....lololol....:))

19 posted on 09/30/2006 8:24:50 AM PDT by tgambill (I would like to comment.....)
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To: Hoplite
I'm dealing with is your inability or unwillingness to answer my question as to how Pearl Harbor was a setup.

He never claimed such. Talk about the mother of all strawman posts. If that's all you've got left, stick a fork in you, you're done.

21 posted on 09/30/2006 9:11:55 AM PDT by dirtboy (This tagline has been photoshopped)
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To: Hoplite

I tried to keep it short, as I know your attention span can be measured in milliseconds......:)) I'll also spare you what the history books say and tell you the real story.

There is no doubt or disagreement that Hitler played a major role in causing WWII. You can talk about his background, his book, the Nazi party, and so forth. However, for all this to happen takes money and material support. Hitler was not a millionaire back then, and Germany was having some trouble economically. So, how did he get the Nazi party off and running. Well, I found out by a little “dab” of research that a chemical cartel named I.G. Farben. In a particular book about this cartel the following was quoted, “without I.G. Farben’s immense production facilities, it’s far reaching research, varied technical experience and overall concentration of economic power, Germany would not have been in a position to start its aggressive war in September, 1939”. Well, let’s follow the money trail. How did Farbin become so wealthy? Yes, their money and wealth came from Wall Street, USA. Quote from a source, “Without the capital supplied from Wall Street, there would not have been I.G. Farbin, no Adolf Hitler and no WWII” or words to that effect. I.G. Farbin came to being in 1924 with business with different cartels, 800 million consolidated funds, basically a J.P. Morgan production….J.P. Morgan? Sound familiar? It should, check them out.

Now, what other benefits did I.G. Farbin have to give the Nazi Party? Yes, Zyklon B, the gas used by Auschwitz, Bitterfeld, Agfa, lduwigshafen, Buchenwald, Hoechst and a few others…. These boys also produced Chlorine gas used during WWI. Here is a bit of trivia…..remember Henry Ford. I found out that he merged his German assets with those of Farbin. The year was around 1928. Something else came around also…..hydrogenation, gasoline from coal. Oh, here comes a household name. In the fall of 1927, “Standard Oil”……did research for the development of this process for Germany to prepare for WWII. I’m leaving a lot out, but you got the gist so far.

Now, did you know that the truth; aside from the 1932 pre-election propaganda; was that Herbert Hoover did not support the business world. Surprise!! He also saw significant problems with the government controlling the business world. This becomes a key issue for the next generations to follow…..Oh, I know what you are thinking. FDR was portraying that he was for the little guy; well, remember, it’s election time. In reality, FDR was a creation of Wall Street. The big guys in “Wall Street” wanted FDR, but he was portrayed as being for the little guy, Hoover was for the little guy but the media ran him for the pro-big business. Deep pockets there, wouldn’t you say? Roosevelt defeated the incumbent Hoover. FDR now could start his move, called the “NEW DEAL” which was heading toward a Fascist State. A man named Whitaker Chambers; who had defected from the American Communist Party, made a comment about the New Deal. “A genuine revolution, whose deepest purpose was not simply reform within existing traditions but a basic change in the social, and above all, the power relationship within the nation”.

Now we are just getting warmed up. I do bet you know of this incredible scheme that was actually cooked up in from July 1932 to November 1933. This true to life plan involved a very colorful character named Major General Smedley Butler of the USMC. He was approached by certain wealthy capitalist from the United States to lead a revolution to overthrow the government and establish an American Fascist dictatorship. He was even tempted by this offer. Three gentlemen, representing a body of planners, proposed to General Butler a plan to seize the White House with a private Army of 500,000 very disgruntled veterans, hold FDR prisoner, get rid of him if he refused to serve as their puppet in a dictatorship they were going to control. Do a search on Butler and discover what he said about war and what he knew already. He asserted that the military really served the role as a collection agency for big bankers. This was actually confirmed in 1934 by the Senate munitions Investigating committee. Smedley Butler has won two Congressional Medals of Honor, and had been involved in many campaigns. This committee confirmed that, remember this word; “Standard Oil”, along with United Fruit, the sugar trust, the big banks, had been behind most of the operations he had lead. Do another search to find the McCormack-Dickstein Committee that investigated Butler’s charges. They confirmed his allegations. Also, if you are interested, I have a link to Jules Archer, author of, “The Plot to Seize the White House”. I even have my own personal copy. You can’t find anymore of them, or its’ very hard. I got lucky.

There are other folks that believe that Butler was maybe being set up, and that this incident was actually going to be the means that these big businessmen and FDR was going to use. Butler would lead this private Army to DC, this action would have resulted in FDR declaring a national emergency and imposing martial law and being supported by the American people. Well, that is another story, either way it was planned and would have succeeded, however, Butler, being a Marine in true form, revealed the plot and FDR had to be happy just being a President.

You ask, what does this have to do with the start of WWII. Well, it has everything to do with the start of WWII. The investigation went lame and just disappeared from sight. Among the powers that be, it was decided that the main way to recover and still achieve this goal was to involve the U.S. in a war. Note that in 1927 was the start of Standard Oil supporting Germany by refining the oil necessary to begin WWII.

For the sake of brevity, as this could become a book, FDR was the Assistant Secretary of the Navy in 1915 timeframe. During this time President Wilson had started provoking and demonizing the Japanese, true or not. It’s a fact that the American government at that time knew that we were vulnerable at Pearl Harbor and would be the location to provoke the Japanese. In 1932, the U.S. Navy conducted operations to test the chance that this could happen. It was easy from as close as 60 miles off the shore. You might be interested to note that in the early 1930’s the U.S. Ambassador actually wrote Roosevelt that one hundred American corporations or more had subsidiaries in Germany, DuPonts (remember that name), working in the armament business, I.G. Farben, and Standard Oil. Also, remember these buckeroos…..General Motors company. Interesting history there and Henry Ford. I.T.T. also purchased a large interest in the Focke-Wolfe, maker of airplanes which produced the same planes that were used to fight Americans. Oh, by the way, three members of I.G. Farben, Board of Governors, were tried and convicted as German War Criminals. There were many businesses involved with Germany during this time………It is known that these businesses knew the true nature of Nazism, but for their own purposes aided Hitler, anticipating a war in Europe with the U.S. involved. Quote from a reference: “Material support continued even after the war started, in 1938. Ethy Gasoline Corp., owned partially by General Motors and Standard Oil, asked to build tetra-ethyl plants in Germany, with full support of the U.S. Dept of War. You know of course after the Triparite Agreement was signed by the three axis powers, when Japan Attacked Pearl Harbor this justified us entering the war in Europe.

So, before I lose you, Hoplite; Let’s recap. What was the major source of Hitler’s financial power? I.G. Farben. They had a little known source of its major power Wall Street, USA. I’m going to give you quotes and references that I didn’t say but others did……..

Quote: “Without the capital supplied by Wall Street, there would have been no I.G. Farben in the first place, and almost certainly no Adolf Hitler and WWII. (Historian Anthony Sutton; “Wall Street and the Rise of Hitler”, 76 Press, Seal Beach, Ca. 1976; page 33)

Hoplite we are dealing with unpatriotic capitalist that are powerful people. General Butler turned their cowardly butts in to the government and they still survived. They purposely start wars for financial gain.

Quote: “The members of the council (on Foreign Relations) are persons of much more than average influence in their community. They have used the prestige that their wealth, their social position, and their education have given them to lead their country toward bankruptcy and military debacle. They should look at their hands. There is blood on them-the dried blood of the last war (World War II). (Chicago Tribune editorial, December 9, 1950; Quigley, Carroll “Tragedy and Hope” A History of the World in our Time, The Macmillan Company, New York, 1966, Page 950).

Well, remember, back then…….The American people did not want war. FDR said during the campaign of 1940:

Quote: “I have said this before, and I shall say it again and again and again. Your boys are not going to be sent into any foreign wars”. FDR

However, in 1933, (remember that year in the early part of this post?), FDR wanted to devise a way to get us into another war.

Quote: “Mr Farley wrote that at the second cabinet meeting in 1933, “The new president again turned to the possibility of war with Japan”. Cabinet member James Farley; (Farley, James, “The Roosevelt Years”, NY, McGraw-Hill Books, 1948. Page 39).

I actually have many more pages of quotes and commentary, 10 more quotes actually backing up what I’m talking about here. I will end up with this one…..

It seems that an Admiral Robery Theobold, who was at that time Commander of all destroyers at Pearl Harbor, said after his conclusions:

Quote: “President Roosevelt forced Japan to war and enticed them to initiate hostilities by holding the Pacific Fleet in Hawaiian waters as an invitation to that attack; the plans to use Pearl Harbor as the bait started in June 1940; and Roosevelt, Marshall (Army Chief of Staff) and Stark (Admiral, Chief of Naval Operations), knew about Pearl Harbor 21 hours before the attack.” Theobold, Robert, “The Final Secret of Pearl Harbor”, Devin-Adair Co. Old Greenwich, CT, 1954, pp 184-185, 197)

It also seems that Joseph Grew, was one of the first to discover that Pearl Harbor was the intended target when he corresponded with the Dept of State: January 27, 1940:

Quote: “The Peruvian minister has informed a member of my staff that the had heard from many sources, including a Japanese source, that, in the event of trouble breaking out between the United States and Japan, the Japanese intended to make a surprise attack against Pearl Harbor”…..(Same reference as above. Theobold, Robert)…..

You know the rest of the story….as a matter of fact, I did quite a bit of research and have for a long time. It suffices to say, this theme has been consistent since even the Bolshevik Revolution…for starters. The same players, just their offspring leads the way, by and by……even up to today.

47 posted on 10/05/2006 8:08:15 AM PDT by tgambill (I would like to comment.....)
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