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To: bobsunshine
"How long did it take for the reconstruction in Germany or Japan and to establish a working democratic government?"

Bad example. Both Germany and Japan were utterly defeated prior to the rebuilding effort. In both Germany and Japan, the ruling ideology/religion was destroyed. There were no significant "insurgent" activities - the Werewolves were a myth. None of these applies to Iraq. Iraq was not devastated by our "polite" war. Iraq has Islam enshrined in its constitution (why did State allow that again?) and there is a significant insurgent effort and not all of that is made up of foreigners.

This is not like post-war Germany or Japan at all.
77 posted on 12/26/2006 9:51:26 AM PST by EnochPowellWasRight
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To: EnochPowellWasRight

That is absolutely correct. In WWII "total-war" was rapaciously waged for total, complete and unconditional surrender. The intent of the tactics and strategies employed was not just to eliminate the means to wage war, but the very fundamental motivation to do so, by instilling a sense of complete despair and war weariness throughout the population, whereby the general populace's very will to continue fundamental efforts in support of war, let alone wage war, was eliminated once their leaders capitulated.

The Germans and Japanese had an operational government within three years after surrenduring (and ratified constitutions shortly thereafter). Reconstruction took much longer thereafter.

The fundamental difference is one of ideologies however. As tenacious as the Nazi and Japanese soldiers were, they nvertheless understood a fundamental and intrinsic value of their own lives. This is not the case with Islam, where Muslims are bred, born and raised to die for their cause, and actually seek death (believing that by so doing they are given an automatic pass into Eternal Paradise). As such collateral damage to their own civilian poplulation means nothing to them whatsoever.

This is a fanaticism that the world hasn't dealt with in decades. Che Guerva in the 1960's was obsessed to initiate nuclear war with the United States. When he was questioned a decade later concerning his rational regarding this, in that Cuba would most certainly have been wiped off of the map in response to such attack by the U.S.A., his response was that the complete and utter annihilation of the United States was the objective, and Cuba's total obliteration was merely collateral damage.

This is what is absoultely missing in Iraq, and Lebanon, and Gaza/West Bank. The last time this strategy was implemented was in North Vietnam with the B-52 strikes of Hanoi. This tactic was instrumental at getting the NV leadership to the negotiating table. Unfortunately the negotiatins undertaken was the extrication of U.S. forces from the theater and not the resolution of the conflict itself.


113 posted on 12/26/2006 11:44:59 AM PST by raygun (Whenever I see U.N. blue helmets I feel like laughing and puking at the same time.)
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To: EnochPowellWasRight

Correct, there were no insurgents, etc. Put we needed to help rebuild Germany and Japan and build a democracy. It wasn't like Iraq is now, but it did take a long time to establish a working government in both countries. Wasn't done in a year or two.


118 posted on 12/26/2006 11:56:29 AM PST by bobsunshine
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To: EnochPowellWasRight
Japan and Germany were also mono-ethnic (ethnic being cultural ethnicity), something that is not the case with Iraq, a country made by the British.

Germany did have a few figurative "hiccups" after World War 2, but not nearly to the extent of Iraq. Japan readily fell in line because their religion was not totally wiped out, but was rather coopted. The emperor ordered the Japanese to obey the American forces, and so they did.

183 posted on 12/27/2006 8:36:19 AM PST by Jedi Master Pikachu ( John 3:16 -- Why there's a Christmas.)
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