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Get with the programs, boomers, or lose them (Barf!)
Newday ^ | 12/22/06 | Saul Friedman

Posted on 12/26/2006 3:44:13 PM PST by qam1

Continuing our coverage of the next generation of seniors, this one is for the kids - men and women in their 40s or 50s.

They are our grown children, most of whom have not known privation, economic depression, a world without television or what it was like in a country that was truly at war to save democracy.

In short, it's for a generation with little or no memory of what came before. As my late colleague Lars-Erik Nelson once wrote, few of these people "can imagine why there was ever a need for Social Security, Medicare, the GI Bill, federal wage and hours laws, a federally underwritten welfare program, environmental protection, affirmative action, banking and security regulation, consumer protection and public defenders."

Maybe because this busy, ambitious generation knows little about what life was like before those protective acts of the federal government, there has been only a shrug when these laws have been ignored, weakened or allowed to die. In the past decade or so, the nation seems to have turned again to Calvin Coolidge's nostrum that "the business of America is business."

According to several polls and studies, says AARP's policy director John Rother, many adult Americans younger than 50 have little regard for the federal government and almost no knowledge about its most basic social programs, Social Security and Medicare.

"They are busy with their own lives, and they rarely speak to their parents about their finances to learn how they depend on these programs," Rother told me. "They don't think about these things until they're 64. But they ought to, or these benefits could disappear."

Social Security and Medicare are seen as benefits for "old people" and seem far removed from their lives, says Rother. The men and women of Generation X...........

(Excerpt) Read more at newsday.com ...


TOPICS: Editorial; Government
KEYWORDS: entitlements; genx; getoffthelawn; greedygeezers
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The jest of it for those who don't like excerpts

This guy claims that the younger generations (in this case the late Baby Boomers & Gen-x) are too spoiled and being tricked by the media, so we don't appriciate all these wonderful federal government programs that we are being forced to pay for.

1 posted on 12/26/2006 3:44:16 PM PST by qam1
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To: qam1
it's for a generation with little or no memory of what came before how can you have a memory of something that happened before you were born?
2 posted on 12/26/2006 3:46:11 PM PST by SF Republican
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To: qam1; ItsOurTimeNow; PresbyRev; tortoise; Fraulein; StoneColdGOP; Clemenza; m18436572; ...
Xer Ping

Ping list for the discussion of the politics and social (and sometimes nostalgic) aspects that directly effects Generation Reagan / Generation-X (Those born from 1965-1981) including all the spending previous generations are doing that Gen-X and Y will end up paying for.

Freep mail me to be added or dropped. See my home page for details and previous articles.  

3 posted on 12/26/2006 3:48:08 PM PST by qam1 (There's been a huge party. All plates and the bottles are empty, all that's left is the bill to pay)
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To: qam1
" Social Security, Medicare...federal wage and hours laws, a federally underwritten welfare program...environmental protection, affirmative action, banking and security regulation, consumer protection "

Good news if the next generation is willing to pull the plug on these kind of unconstitutional programs.

4 posted on 12/26/2006 3:48:53 PM PST by BenLurkin ("The entire remedy is with the people." - W. H. Harrison)
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To: SF Republican

I prefer to think of the boomers as the generation that discovered everything and learned nothing. Everything references back upon themselves. (And yes, I am one)


5 posted on 12/26/2006 3:50:32 PM PST by Tijeras_Slim
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To: qam1

"The jest of it..."
You might have meant "the gist of it", but the jest will be on those who depend on the gubmint to take care of them from the cradle to the grave.


6 posted on 12/26/2006 3:54:20 PM PST by dynachrome ("Where am I? Where am I going? Why am I in a handbasket?")
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To: Tijeras_Slim

There are only two kinds of people: those who divide everybody into two groups and those who don't. I can see that you and I are of the former.


7 posted on 12/26/2006 3:55:33 PM PST by Past Your Eyes (Do what you love and the ridicule will follow.)
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To: qam1

The generation that had everything handed to them wants the next generation to keep paying for their gravy train? I'll pass, thanks.


8 posted on 12/26/2006 4:00:43 PM PST by WestVirginiaRebel (Common sense will do to liberalism what the atomic bomb did to Nagasaki-Rush Limbaugh)
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To: Past Your Eyes

Thanks, I think.....


9 posted on 12/26/2006 4:02:04 PM PST by Tijeras_Slim
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To: Tijeras_Slim

"I prefer to think of the boomers as the generation that discovered everything and learned nothing"





I think of them as our last educated, patriotic generation.

The teacher's union didn't really gain control until the late 60s, which since then we have seen a dumbing down of America, and more than seven million Americans men enlisted in the military between 1960 and 1975, with another two million serving through the draft.


10 posted on 12/26/2006 4:04:35 PM PST by ansel12 (America, love it ,or at least give up your home citizenship before accepting ours too.)
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To: ansel12

Good points, but the influence seems to be weighted by those who were radicalized and made the "long march" up through government and academia.


11 posted on 12/26/2006 4:06:37 PM PST by Tijeras_Slim
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To: BenLurkin
" Social Security, Medicare...federal wage and hours laws, a federally underwritten welfare program...environmental protection, affirmative action, banking and security regulation, consumer protection "

Federal wages and hours? WTF is that? I get paid on salary, and I work until my work is done. The whole "wages and hours" crap is utter rubbish.

12 posted on 12/26/2006 4:07:22 PM PST by lesser_satan (EKTHELTHIOR!!!)
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To: qam1

Dump social security now. End it today. No more payments.

When you hit age 65, the socialist federal government sends you a check for every penny you paid in. Then you get no more, not a cent. Invest it, go to las vegas, give it away to your favorite charity. It's yours.

How to pay for it? Sell the socialist federal forests. There's 193 million acres the feds have no business owning. Sell the trees first and then the land, as needed. Year after year until everyone who paid into the ponzi scam is paid off.


13 posted on 12/26/2006 4:13:08 PM PST by sergeantdave (Consider that nearly half the people you pass on the street meet Lenin's definition of useful idiot)
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To: Tijeras_Slim

"Good points, but the influence seems to be weighted by those who were radicalized and made the "long march" up through government and academia."





Yes it is, Something related to this, is that it seems to me like the left has been less successful in their grand destructions in the last 30 years than they were in the 40 years before that.

The left is still there and powerful, but they can't pass the nation destroying legislation that they were, from about 1935 to 1975, or maybe 1913 to 1973.


14 posted on 12/26/2006 4:21:06 PM PST by ansel12 (America, love it ,or at least give up your home citizenship before accepting ours too.)
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To: qam1
According to several polls and studies, says AARP's policy director John Rother, many adult Americans younger than 50 have little regard for the federal government and almost no knowledge about its most basic social programs, Social Security and Medicare.

I resemble that remark!!! Awesome!

15 posted on 12/26/2006 4:34:50 PM PST by hispanarepublicana (Funny, but I don't remember pressing 1 for English in 1994.)
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To: qam1
"They are busy with their own lives, and they rarely speak to their parents about their finances to learn how they depend on these programs," Rother told me. "They don't think about these things until they're 64. But they ought to, or these benefits could disappear."

When my grandmother (now deceased) would bring up her SS check (her memory was failing), I told her to think about it in terms of my paying for about half to a third of her check. She was stunned to hear that it was just a legalized Ponzi scheme.

I couched it in terms of money that I could use for my retirement savings being stolen to pay for her retirement because the government spent all her SS payments instead of investing them properly.

I also told her that I'd rather give her the money directly because none would be wasted on bureaucracy before it got to her.

According to several polls and studies, says AARP's policy director John Rother, many adult Americans younger than 50 have little regard for the federal government...

Gee, I wonder why we do?
16 posted on 12/26/2006 4:42:58 PM PST by Lord Basil (stupisticated - Having a refined fantasy view of the world that is typically based on group-think.)
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To: WestVirginiaRebel
The generation that had everything handed to them wants the next generation to keep paying for their gravy train? I'll pass, thanks.

I'm 50. NOTHING has been handed to me. I've been paying huge income taxes and maximum social security for 25+ years. I expect to be working and paying the same way for another 15-20 years. The whining about some imaginary "gravy train" is misdirected. I never expect to be able to retire and recover any part of the money I've been "contributing" since 1973.

17 posted on 12/26/2006 5:08:47 PM PST by Myrddin
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To: Lord Basil
My mom turns 79 next week. She lives on the survivors benefit from my dad's Navy retirement, social security and investment income that my dad set aside before he passed on. She was extolling the virtues of the social security checks and medicare. I was quietly bristling as I know exactly how that money is supplied. My taxes far exceed what is disbursed to my mother each month.
18 posted on 12/26/2006 5:15:35 PM PST by Myrddin
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To: BenLurkin
Good news if the next generation is willing to pull the plug on these kind of unconstitutional programs.

Especially when they get a load of that 88% tax rate.

Our generation will phase these programs out. the only question is whether we'll rationally privatize them now or slamm on the breaks in panic three decades down the road.

19 posted on 12/26/2006 6:32:24 PM PST by Mr. Silverback (The people walking in darkness have seen a great light...Merry Christmas!)
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To: ansel12
I think of them as our last educated, patriotic generation.

You are wrong, especially since you bring up the military service of the Boomers. The kids going into the military today are smarter, better educated and better soldiers than any we've ever had, and they are patriotic as all get out.

There's nothing wrong with lauding the sacrifice of those brave Boomer men, but most of today's soldiers went through those same public schools and still are, in the words of R. Lee "Gunny" Ermey, "ready to eat their own guts for this country."

20 posted on 12/26/2006 6:41:28 PM PST by Mr. Silverback (The people walking in darkness have seen a great light...Merry Christmas!)
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To: qam1
many adult Americans younger than 50 have little regard for the federal government and almost no knowledge about its most basic social programs, Social Security and Medicare.

Just when you think the situation is hopeless, along comes a little ray of light.........

21 posted on 12/26/2006 6:44:47 PM PST by elkfersupper
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To: qam1

The irony is, that it is the Boomer generation who will wipe out Social Security, and who are already flexing their political muscles in that regard. That is yet another thing this year's election was about - it was a preemptive first strike by those who are getting ready to raid the pantry during their elder years.

So, the quasi Communistic FDR generation guy who wrote this article is completely deluded.


22 posted on 12/26/2006 6:55:12 PM PST by GOP_1900AD (Stomping on "PC," destroying the Left, and smoking out faux "conservatives" - Take Back The GOP!)
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To: qam1

The thing that pisses me off about people like Saul Friedman is their arrogant attitude that everybody before the pre-boomer generation were great patriots who appreciated every little thing they got and didn't need Jesus Christ because they never committed a sin in their lives.This is bull,the roaring twenties had plenty of over the top "spoiled" people who lived fast lives and cared as little as lot a lot of people today do.Yes they fought WWII but before Pearl Harbor didn't want to touch it with a ten foot pole,and by the way unlike the ALL VOLUNTEER military of today a lot of those people went ONLY when they were drafted.Our society is becoming increasingly liberal but there are a lot decent Americans still living in this country !!!


23 posted on 12/26/2006 7:07:43 PM PST by Obie Wan
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To: Myrddin

Why do every one of you hard working Boomers think we're talking about you when we complain about greedy geezers? By definition we're not talking about you.


24 posted on 12/26/2006 7:19:37 PM PST by Mr. Silverback (The people walking in darkness have seen a great light...Merry Christmas!)
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To: qam1

I wonder why my generation doesn't have a snappy little name? Boomers, X-ers...I want a name and a stereotype, dammit.


25 posted on 12/26/2006 7:21:55 PM PST by LongElegantLegs (...a urethral syringe used to treat syphilis with mercury.)
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To: Myrddin
I was quietly bristling as I know exactly how that money is supplied.

So tell her. These people will never find the clue bag if we don't educate them. Ask them how deep in debt she wants her grandkids and great grandkids to be.

26 posted on 12/26/2006 7:22:45 PM PST by Mr. Silverback (The people walking in darkness have seen a great light...Merry Christmas!)
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To: Mr. Silverback

"You are wrong, especially since you bring up the military service of the Boomers. The kids going into the military today are smarter, better educated and better soldiers than any we've ever had, and they are patriotic as all get out."






That would interest me, if it had anything to do with my post, I wasn't comparing the boomers to the small number of these generations enlistees and veterans (like my son).

I was saying that the boomer generation was the last well educated generation, and the last one to enlist and serve in such mass numbers.

If this generation's young men would enlist in large enough numbers to fill the small military needs of our present, then we would not be forced to accept the first time enlistments of boomer grandmothers.


27 posted on 12/26/2006 7:27:34 PM PST by ansel12 (America, love it ,or at least give up your home citizenship before accepting ours too.)
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To: Obie Wan
unlike the ALL VOLUNTEER military of today a lot of those people went ONLY when they were drafted.

Actually, the main reason there was a draft in WWII was because they needed to organize the entry of men into the armed forces. Virtually everyone wanted to go, they couldn't take them all at once and why create a new system when you've already got one ready? So, they took in a percentage of volunteers (mostly those who wanted to volunteer for special duty, like paratroops) and the rest were told to wait for their number to come up.

Happened that way with my grandfather. He was an art school student and treid to enlist during the week after Pearl. He was told to wait for his number, and it was called in '42. He went ashore at Anzio and fought in Italy his whole time.

28 posted on 12/26/2006 7:29:00 PM PST by Mr. Silverback (The people walking in darkness have seen a great light...Merry Christmas!)
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To: LongElegantLegs
I wonder why my generation doesn't have a snappy little name? Boomers, X-ers...I want a name and a stereotype, dammit.

You are one of these

Arthurian 1433-1460
Humanist 1461-1482
Picaresque 1512-1540
Elizabethan 1541-1565
Sentimental 1566-1587
Puritan (Righteous)1588-1614
Cavalier 1615-1647
Glorious 1648-1673
Enlightenment 1674-1700
Awakening 1701-1723
Liberty 1724-1741
Republican 1742-1766
Compromise 1767-1791
Transcendental 1792-1821
Gilded 1822-1842
Progressive 1843-1859
Missionary 1860-1882
Lost 1883-1904
G.I. (Builder, Gimmie, Greatest, WWII) 1905-1927
Silent 1928-1945
Baby Boomers (Me, Worst) 1946-1964 (Sometimes Later 1957-1964 Boomers are called Generation Jones)
Generation X (Baby Busters, Reagan) 1965-1981
Generation Y (Millennials, Echo Boom) 1982-1996
Generation Z (Cyber, New Adaptive,?) 1997-2020?

29 posted on 12/26/2006 7:34:14 PM PST by qam1 (There's been a huge party. All plates and the bottles are empty, all that's left is the bill to pay)
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To: Obie Wan
Our society is NOT becoming increasingly liberal--only the weird old baby-boomers are because they are in power right now:

The men and women of Generation X and the youngest of the boomers tell survey takers they have little faith these programs will be there when they need them. They have more faith in the private sector than the federal government.

Gen X is more conservative!

30 posted on 12/26/2006 7:38:13 PM PST by Cogadh na Sith (There's an open road from the cradle to the tomb.)
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To: ansel12
Lat time I checked, the word "patriotism" did not denote numbers, but commitment.

If this generation's young men would enlist in large enough numbers to fill the small military needs of our present, then we would not be forced to accept the first time enlistments of boomer grandmothers.

Publicity stunt BS. Not that her service isn't noble and valuable, but if you really think we're falling so short on recruiting that we have to go out and find Grandma's, you're smoking something.

BTW, before the next time you lecture an X-er who served in the volunteer military about the vaunted patriotism of the Boomers, you might want to consider the reasons that many of those young Boomer men volunteered. A man who joined up served less time (2 years vs. 3, IIRC) and was far more likely to get into a technical specialty and learn a trade. Also, if one preferred a certain service it was best to volunteer rather than taking a chance. This was especially true of the Air Force and Navy, which received far fewer draftees than the Army and Marines.

In other words, many of these men signed up for the same reason that X-er and Gen Y men haven't signed up: To avoid an unpleasant term in the military and serve their own wishes.

31 posted on 12/26/2006 7:38:49 PM PST by Mr. Silverback (The people walking in darkness have seen a great light...Merry Christmas!)
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To: qam1
Generation Y (Millennials, Echo Boom) 1982-1996
A little lame, but I'll take it. Thanks. :-)
32 posted on 12/26/2006 7:39:45 PM PST by LongElegantLegs (...a urethral syringe used to treat syphilis with mercury.)
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To: ansel12
If this generation's young men would enlist in large enough numbers to fill the small military needs of our present, then we would not be forced to accept the first time enlistments of boomer grandmothers.

We are a much, much smaller generation than the boomers.

We could never enlist in the raw numbers of the largest generation in history, but we have a higher enlistment rate.

33 posted on 12/26/2006 7:41:45 PM PST by Cogadh na Sith (There's an open road from the cradle to the tomb.)
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To: qam1
"...or these benefits could disappear"

Good. We don't want them you stupid gits. You can have your silly handouts, but we aren't going to follow in your slimy footsteps. We are free men not slaves.

34 posted on 12/26/2006 7:42:05 PM PST by JasonC
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To: qam1

I'm much much younger than one of these "kids" as they describe. I wish I could opt out of social security entirely. Hell, I would even be willing to 'eat' what I've paid in so far just to be rid of it!


35 posted on 12/26/2006 7:42:44 PM PST by KoRn
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To: Mr. Silverback

Hold the bus,after Pearl Harbor they wanted to fight,before Pearl Harbor not a chance in hell. After 9\11 there were a lot of young and not so young Americans who wanted to go defend their country and unlike the WWII generation,these kids were NOT educated and schooled in the values of America. On the contrary most of them have grown up in a society ruled by the mainstream media and an education system that continuosly preaches how BAD our country and our system is to the rest of the world !!!


36 posted on 12/26/2006 7:45:49 PM PST by Obie Wan
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To: Cogadh na Sith

I hope your right !!!


37 posted on 12/26/2006 7:48:25 PM PST by Obie Wan
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To: Cogadh na Sith

"We could never enlist in the raw numbers of the largest generation in history, but we have a higher enlistment rate."




What are the rates?


38 posted on 12/26/2006 7:50:04 PM PST by ansel12 (America, love it ,or at least give up your home citizenship before accepting ours too.)
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To: Obie Wan
I will type this slowly so you can understand it:

I know there was a draft before the war started. What I am saying is that they didn't need it to recruit after Pearl Harbor but kept it in place to streamline the manpower. You were saying that the Greatest Generation was drafted. Have your cake or eat it, please.

39 posted on 12/26/2006 7:53:13 PM PST by Mr. Silverback (The people walking in darkness have seen a great light...Merry Christmas!)
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To: qam1

Older baby boomers recently cheated younger baby boomers in legislation on social security. Hippie-minded people get what they want from the government. Many younger baby boomers without university degrees were put out of work during the late 1970s and early 1980s. Not many older ones were.

As for government social programs, most of them are now for breaking families and feeding anti-social efforts (feminism, romanticism,...) instead of feeding the poor--another legacy of older baby boomers.

Younger baby boomers did not lead or often participate in the "cultural revolution" (family busting). Older ones did.


40 posted on 12/26/2006 8:02:02 PM PST by familyop (Essayons)
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To: Mr. Silverback

And I'm going to type this JUST as slow,the article was a-b-o-u-t how the generations starting with boomers were nothing but spoiled brats who appreciated nothing,only your grandfathers generation and those before a-p-p-r-e-c-i-a-t-e-d what the country gave them and that opinion by Saul Friedman and I guess you is b-u-l-l-s-h-i-t-e !!!


41 posted on 12/26/2006 8:03:51 PM PST by Obie Wan
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To: Mr. Silverback

"BTW, before the next time you lecture an X-er who served in the volunteer military about the vaunted patriotism of the Boomers,"




Both your posts do that, a straw dog response. I haven't lectured anyone, much less generation X veterans such as my son that served in the 10th Mt.



" A man who joined up served less time (2 years vs. 3, IIRC) and was far more likely to get into a technical specialty and learn a trade. Also, if one preferred a certain service it was best to volunteer rather than taking a chance. This was especially true of the Air Force and Navy, which received far fewer draftees than the Army and Marines."


The draftee served the shorter time, not the volunteer, and the air force and navy did not draft.
The army and marines have changed their enlistment requirements out of necessity, not because letting 42 year old women in was a publicity stunt.


42 posted on 12/26/2006 8:04:02 PM PST by ansel12 (America, love it ,or at least give up your home citizenship before accepting ours too.)
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To: Mr. Silverback
Being a "boomer" who served in the U.S. Air Force, it was a six year commitment.
43 posted on 12/26/2006 8:06:25 PM PST by afnamvet (It is what it is.)
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To: Mr. Silverback

the only question is whether we'll rationally privatize them now or slamm on the breaks in panic three decades down the road.

Nothing will change anytime soon. Politicians by nature don't have the guts to face up to problems and will continue to avoid a fix until they absolutely have to and even then 90% of their effort will be spent putting blame on the other party.


44 posted on 12/26/2006 8:06:38 PM PST by Joan Kerrey
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To: Obie Wan

For someone named after a jedi master, you're thick.

I was not slamming the generations since WWII, I was just saying that WWII generation did not need a draft to get them to go fight Hitler and Tojo. I have nothing bad to say about the patriotism of Boomers, X-ers or Gen-Y.


45 posted on 12/26/2006 8:10:16 PM PST by Mr. Silverback (The people walking in darkness have seen a great light...Merry Christmas!)
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To: afnamvet

Thank you. I think the 2 years vs. 3 years was for the army and Marines, and excluded those with tech training.


46 posted on 12/26/2006 8:11:41 PM PST by Mr. Silverback (The people walking in darkness have seen a great light...Merry Christmas!)
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To: Mr. Silverback

Thick,do me a favor try to stay on point because whether you meant it or not is irrelevant.The article essentually insulted everybody after the "great generation" and I thought it SUCKED !!!


47 posted on 12/26/2006 8:15:31 PM PST by Obie Wan
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To: qam1
what it was like in a country that was truly at war to save democracy.

Does he mean, like we are now? Because we ARE at war to save our democracy. The fighting just hasn't broken out yet.

48 posted on 12/26/2006 8:16:42 PM PST by NRA2BFree (May you always have love to share, health to spare, and friends that care.)
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To: ansel12
Both your posts do that, a straw dog response. I haven't lectured anyone, much less generation X veterans such as my son that served in the 10th Mt.

I'm glad your son served in such a fine unit (my wife served in the AF Weather detachment at Wheeler-Sack on Fort Drum) but if you didn't mean to lecture or condemn you shouldn't have slammed the current generation for being too unpatriotic to sign up. Have your cake or eat it.

The draftee served the shorter time, not the volunteer, and the air force and navy did not draft.

I may have been remembering that wrong, but my point still stands: Both groups faced a situation where they could decide when and where they would serve and followed their self-interest. Given a choice between serving two years at Uncle Sam's whim or three years on my terms, I'd take the second option, and I have no shortage of patriotism. The groups I speak of are a significant percentage of the Boomer men who volunteered and all of the Gen Y men who aren't volunteering now. That doesn't mean the Boomers are an unpatriotic generation, but it sure as heck doesn't mean they were the last patriotic generation.

The army and marines have changed their enlistment requirements out of necessity, not because letting 42 year old women in was a publicity stunt.

I didn't mean she was let in as a publicity stunt (though I see there was almost no other way for you to interpret my poorly written post) but was saying that this publicity event is a poor thing to draw conclusions from. There are lots of reasons that recruiting is difficult, and there are a lot of reasons beside difficult recruiting that the Army has decided to allow older people in.

You haven't made the case that X-ers and Gen-Y lack patriotism. You certinly can't make that case based on the current state of the armed forces. You will call that last statement another "straw dog" argument, but if you aren't comparing militaries to militaries, your argument falls apart.

49 posted on 12/26/2006 8:32:36 PM PST by Mr. Silverback (The people walking in darkness have seen a great light...Merry Christmas!)
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To: Obie Wan

Um...where did I support the author's slamming of the last three generations, O Enlightened One?


50 posted on 12/26/2006 8:34:51 PM PST by Mr. Silverback (The people walking in darkness have seen a great light...Merry Christmas!)
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