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An Historical Perspective on a Muslim Being Sworn into Congress on the Koran
Wallbuilders.com ^ | January, 2007 | David Barton

Posted on 01/19/2007 6:35:59 PM PST by cf_river_rat

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To: Sherman Logan
Mr. Barton is not the most reliable of sources.

David Barton is a very careful historian. Just because he is a Christian does not disqualify him.

Can you document your assertions?

41 posted on 01/19/2007 9:29:35 PM PST by LiteKeeper (Beware the secularization of America; the Islamization of Eurabia)
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To: LiteKeeper
I have no idea whether David Barton is a reliable historian, but he certainly has his critics. For example, the liberal Baptist Joint Committee on Public Affairs has put forth a detailed critique of Barton's "America's Godly Heritage". His source for the assertion that John Randolph of Roanoke was a Muslim also appears to be a biography of Randolph that is less reliable than Henry Adams' biography (although Barton seems to cite letters included in that autobiography instead of the tome itself - without looking at a copy, it would be impossible to know).
42 posted on 01/19/2007 9:44:34 PM PST by conservative in nyc
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To: conservative in nyc

One of the things that distinguishes David Barton is the incredible number of original documents, books, letters, etc., he has in his library. He is very careful in his research and writing.


43 posted on 01/19/2007 10:17:51 PM PST by LiteKeeper (Beware the secularization of America; the Islamization of Eurabia)
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To: cf_river_rat

Don't know the guy, but I've read other stuff he's written. While I often agree with his general views, he has shown a strong tendency, IMHO, to misuse and spin facts in a way that is more common among leftists than righties.


44 posted on 01/20/2007 11:16:47 AM PST by Sherman Logan
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To: Sherman Logan
I thought it odd the source he used that I linked in my #31 above is a leftist website.

I'm beginning to share your sentiments, but I'd like to hear his side of this debate. Too bad he seems to have taken steps to isolate himself from the general public.

45 posted on 01/20/2007 12:43:31 PM PST by cf_river_rat (Just another defender of the faith)
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To: Cicero

http://www.sunnah.org/history/islamamr.htm

Has a few interesting vignettes about documented muslim slaves.
I doubt there is any reliable info on percentages, it didn't matter so no records were kept.


46 posted on 01/20/2007 2:39:52 PM PST by mrsmith
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To: conservative in nyc

Interesting. That might well be it. Because he was in the tradition of the Encyclopedists and Deists, who hated and despised the Church, he rooted for the Muslims who conquered Constantinople, without ever having been one himself.

Voltaire said, "Ecrase l'infame," which is pretty much the same attitude.

Then if the business about Francis Scott Keye has any basis, perhaps he managed to persuade him that he was wrong to root for the Muslims, because they were a far worse alternative.


47 posted on 01/20/2007 2:51:41 PM PST by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
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To: Cicero
perhaps he managed to persuade him that he was wrong to root for the Muslims, because they were a far worse alternative.

At the time, I doubt anybody in the West viewed Islam as any sort of an alternative, better or worse.

Islam was very near its low point in its contest with western civ, and the whole idea of western/white guilt hadn't even been developed yet.

48 posted on 01/21/2007 10:02:15 AM PST by Sherman Logan
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To: cf_river_rat

Barton is full of crap. There is NO evidence that John Randolph was ever a muslim. I searched Russell Kirk's outstanding biography of him seeking to verify this, and there is nothing to support Barton's claims.


49 posted on 02/01/2007 2:18:19 PM PST by lqclamar
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To: LiteKeeper
David Barton is a very careful historian. Just because he is a Christian does not disqualify him.

He was very sloppy in this particular article. There is ZERO evidence that Randolph was ever a muslim.

Everyone here should read Russell Kirk's outstanding biography of Randolph. Kirk was a devoutly Christian conservative historian, and knew what he was talking about. Kirk also had scholarly credentials and degrees by his name, which Barton does not have.

50 posted on 02/01/2007 2:22:08 PM PST by lqclamar
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To: VOA
Don't worry - it's not true about Randolph. Barton is full of crap on this one.

He based his claim about Randolph on a misquoted letter from 1818 where Randolph described his conversion from agnosticism to Christianity to a friend. There is a single paragraph in the letter where Randolph writes that he was fascinated by the muslim Turks as a child and at one time considered their most famous sultan, Mahomet II, a hero. He NEVER says anything about having been a muslim, and he goes on to describe his childhood fascination with islam as "absurd." The rest of the letter is about how he used to be an agnostic but found Christianity.

51 posted on 02/01/2007 2:26:08 PM PST by lqclamar
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