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To: TitansAFC

I gave a link to the article that says that; how we're going to get stuff going back to 1989 about what a mayor said about abortion is something better researchers than I will have to check out.

I'm not sure if you're suggesting that the National Review reporter who stated that Giuliani was pro life in 1989 according to press reports is lying and if that's the case, why don't you e-mail the reporter who wrote the story and ask for back-up.


22 posted on 02/09/2007 8:42:10 AM PST by Peach (The Clintons pardoned more terrorists than they captured or killed.)
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To: Peach

---"I'm not sure if you're suggesting that the National Review reporter who stated that Giuliani was pro life in 1989 according to press reports is lying..."---

Yes, I'm saying he's lying and that he's a liar.

Clear enough?


26 posted on 02/09/2007 8:46:54 AM PST by TitansAFC (Pacifism is not peace; pacifists are not peacemakers.)
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To: Peach
I'm not sure if you're suggesting that the National Review reporter who stated that Giuliani was pro life in 1989 according to press reports is lying and if that's the case, why don't you e-mail the reporter who wrote the story and ask for back-up.

From the horse's mouth:

“I’m pro-choice. I’m pro-gay rights,” Giuliani said. He was then asked whether he supports a ban on what critics call partial-birth abortions. “No, I have not supported that, and I don’t see my position on that changing,” he responded.
Source: CNN.com, “Inside Politics” Dec 2, 1999

That quote was in 99. The report on NR was from 89. 89 was 18 years ago. People can sometimes change in that amount of time.
97 posted on 02/09/2007 10:40:58 AM PST by JamesP81 (Eph 6:12)
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To: Peach; ElkGroveDan; EternalVigilance; sittnick; ninenot; bornacatholic
Peach: I am going to do something rare here. I am going to give you and Rudy some slack or even limited backing here.

I was still in Connecticut in 1989. I don't think anyone will question my bona fides as a pro-lifer since I represented (way back when I practiced law) 1100 pro-lifers arrested in abortion mill "rescues" or sit-ins.

You are right when you say that Rudy ran as a pro-lifer the first time in his first race in 1989. He lost to Dinkins who was a standard issue NYC abortion worshiper. Then Dinkins proceeded to absolutely obliterate himself politically by mishandling the Crown Heights riots against Orthodox and Chassidic Jews by black rioters enraged over the accidental death of two young black kids when a rabbis' funeral car was broadsided by a drunk driver and shoved into the kids.

Giuliani ran again in 1993 and was supported by a LOT of New York Democrats and liberals fed up with the near criminal ineptness of Dinkins. He ran as a pro-abort that time and in 1997 (undoubtedly because he had to and not because he had really converted on the subject). Having been brought around on abortion, he then embraced lavender "rights" and even appeared in a ballet tutu on stage at a lavender fundraiser complete with phony facial (MarilynMonroelike) birthmark and about three pounds of powder and rouge. The photo is forever enshrined in cyberspace and may well haunt him forever. Hear her Satanic Majesty taunting Rudy that even the Arkansas Antichrist never went THAT FAR.

All that having been said, Rudy did an absolutely magnificent job as to 9/11. I don't think that any other mayor from anywhere (other than maybe former NYC Mayor Ed Koch) would have done anywhere near as well.

Call me Pollyanna but I think that Rudy may well be privately pro-life but he will not likely be publicly pro-life. Given a checkered marital history, he may be honestly favorable to freedom for lavenders to be lavenders as the Church in which he grew up was very hostile to divorce and remarriage. Query whether he has EVER been married in the contemplation of the Catholic Church since his first marriage was forbidden by being to his first cousin and even the priest who witnessed was a first cousin of both. His second marriage was to a non-Catholic divorced woman likely without an annulment of her first marriage. If he is presently married to Judith Nathan in the eyes of the state, he may not be in the eyes of the Church unless she was not married previously or only invalidly "married" previously in Church terms. If either of those situations prevails, Rudy can marry Judy and straighten out the Church problems. OR, they can obtain the relevant annulment(s) and marry in the Church. Apologies to non-Catholics for discussing these tedious details.

Suppose that Rudy hears from his deceased mom in a dream that he has been wrong on abortion. He told Hannity the other night that he thinks abortion is a bad thing and he would counsel women not to have them. Suppose that Rudy can convince social conservatives that he really, really, really will only appoint pro-life judges and justices and defines pro-life to their satisfaction. Suppose further that he continues to oppose "gay marriage", serve traditional Italian meals at White House functions, hold an annual San Gennaro Festival on the White House Lawn (with Bernie Kerik providing security) featuring a bocci tournament televised live.

As conservatives (social, guns, fiscal, military, foreign policy, antiregulatory, and/or whatever), we have very little to choose from in the way of electable, policy purist conservatives. Neither Tancredo nor Hunter have a ghost's chance in hell although Hunter is a very good guy. That likely is the case with the excellent Sam Brownback as well. Mitt Romney has an awful lot of news footage out there promising to be a social revolutionary on abortion and lavenders whatever he may say now. It is more credible in our day and age (unfortunately for this Catholic) that Rudy thought he could be Catholic and pro-abort than that Mitt thought he could be Mormon and pro-abort. I see Mitt as Secretary of Commerce or Treasury. In truth, I probably see Rudy as Attorney General (with pledge not to help abortion or lavender "marriage" in any way).

Mike Huckabee is NOT going to be president or nominee. Maybe he will be Secretary of HHS. Hagel is not going to be president. The GOP does not nominate war resisters even if they are otherwise pro-life.

I think we will wind up nominating McCain who has been pro-war, pro-life, ? on lavenders, a POW, and generlly has a good voting record, though not perfect. Rudy is more liberal than McCain. Right now, it looks like Rudy may be the second choice of primary voters. I would like Gingrich but a lot of people would not.

So long as Rudy is bound and chained on the social issues (babies, guns, marriages, judges, at least), he just might win the nomination and the election.

I do hesitate to post this stuff this early because so verrrrrry much can happen between now and 11/2008. I do hope that people will calm down with the non-negotiable demand style of politics and be both principled enough and shrewd enough to get the best deal for the conservative movement and therefore for our country. We have litte room to indulge ourselves in the insistent search for absolute perfection.

I suspect that I will cast my primary vote for Sam Brownback and that he will not be nominated. I certainly cannot vote for Barack Obama or Her Satanic Majesty. Nor can I vote third party and facilitate the election of either. I have instructed my wife not to allow the words "He had a perfect voting record" to be put on my tombstone if she is making the decision. I expect to vote Republican and to urge others to do so.

Who knows? Rudy might turn out to be an outstanding president. Then again, maybe not, but I sure as heck know that the Demonrat won't be even an acceptable president.

We have 21 months to go and I am prepared to eat these words if convinced that I should do so.

115 posted on 02/09/2007 11:32:32 AM PST by BlackElk (Dean of Discipline of the Tomas de Torquemada Gentlemen's Club)
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