FRENCH NAZI COLLABORATOR - Maurice Papon is dead

Der Spiegel, Wikipedia and others | February 17, 2007 | Newsflash

[Eva]

I am not saying the Earth's climate is not going through a warming phase, I am saying that this phase is not much different than one that ended about 1500 years ago, when the Vikings farmed Greenland and sailed the North seas in small wooden boats. There is very little evidence that anything man does to change his way of life will have much effect on climate change. George Bush does not control the weather. This is not to say that we shouldn't try to be more conservant and respectful of our environment, for the simple reason that it makes life more enjoyable.

As far as melting glaciers are concerned, yes, it is ashame that some glaciers are getting smaller, but others are increasing. It's a natural process. Mount Baker the glacier that is about an hour from our home, set a world record for snow fall a few years ago, 27 feet in one season. It actually made skiing a little difficult, as they had to keep closing the mountain to groom the trails. The snow was almost up to the chair lifts. You should try skiing there sometime, lots of snow, cheap lift tickets, and short lift lines.

As far as suitcase nukes are concerned, Al Qaeda claims to already have them. They claim to have smuggled them in through the Mexican border, but they haven't used them, so who knows? There is a lot of Russian nuclear fuel floating around the world. Life is uncertain and the Islamists are barbarians. It would be best to develop our own sources of energy and alternative fuels and become less dependent on the Middle East.

No, Europe has no honor, their leaders are nothing but greedy liars who sign agreements that they have no intention of keeping, just like the former USSR. Europe was never the servant of the US, it was quite the other way around. The US protected and helped Europe rebuild, not once but twice, after it self destructed. Now Europe is behaving like an averse two year old in a rebellious tanrum. No, there is no honor in moral relativity, only arrogance.

[Atlantic Bridge]

I think the Poles' problems stem from Stalin's first partnership.

It is of course correct that the original problem was created through the criminal Molotow-Ribbentrop pact. No doubt that Nazi Germany and Stalin have the main guilt. Nevertheless the Poles fought like tigers on the anglo-american side (and never ever on the side of the Russians) and were sold to Stalin by the United States and England after the war since they were not useful to them anymore. In Europe we call such attitude treason, espechially if we talk about direct betrayal of brothers in arms. If you got another word for it - just let me know.

I am well aware that it is not PC to say this here, but it is simply the truth.

Soldiers might have the right to use a motto like "Semper Fidelis" if they give proof to it on the battlefield. If we talk about politicians they should better use "Semper Infidelis". The best thing is that you do not have to care about the proof. They will betray you sooner or later no matter where they come from. :(

[Atlantic Bridge]

Well - saving energy has not only to do with the climate. Fact is that you Americans allow yourself a squandering lifestyle. Most of your energy is burned to move useless weight, to heat houses with poor insulation in winter and to cool them in summer. Your system is to a large extent ineffective. As a experienced civil engineer and architekt who studied your according building technology with high interest I know exactly what I am talking about. We have far better stuff in good old Europe.

It would be totally wrong to say that you do nothing. I.e. exhaust pipe catalysators in cars were a invention that was first used in the US and you bought more Toyotas and Lexus with Hybrid-technology than we Europeans so far. Nevertheless most of you waste energy to no end. It might be true that a change does not accord to the short term thinking of your industry, but it is in your well understood own interest to make a start if you look on it from a long term viewpoint. Energy that is not burned today -no matter if it comes from the Mexican Gulf or not- can be burned tomorrow. Your children will be thankful one day for a responsible attitude.

We both will not solve the problem if there is global warming through emissions or not. I also heard about the cool and warm phases you are talking about. Nevertheless the changes took much more time in the past and were not that abrupt.

As far as melting glaciers are concerned, yes, it is ashame that some glaciers are getting smaller, but others are increasing. It's a natural process. Mount Baker the glacier that is about an hour from our home, set a world record for snow fall a few years ago, 27 feet in one season. It actually made skiing a little difficult, as they had to keep closing the mountain to groom the trails. The snow was almost up to the chair lifts. You should try skiing there sometime, lots of snow, cheap lift tickets, and short lift lines.

Mount Baker? Isn't that the funny volcano in the Cascades that was smoking in the 70ties? You live in a beautiful area, that is for sure and I would be happy to follow your invitation. :-)

BUT.... ....Snow records or not, Baker is obviously also loosing also its glaciers. In Wikipedia I found the following picture. The same effect like I have it in my beloved Alps:

Easton Glacier (on the south flank) in 2003. The superimposed black line marks how far the glacier was in 1985

Last but not least - talking about honour. It is quite funny to me that you denominate all Europeans in lock, stock and barrel as people without honour. Maybe you should try to find out yourself and take a skiing trip to Switzerland or Austria. Of course you are invited to come to Germany too, but you have to deal with global warming and lower mountains then. We have the warmest winter ever since we check and file temperatures. Bad times for skiing here.

Personally I do not believe that honor is a question of nationality, race or whatever, it is a question of personal integrity. Some people have it, some have it not. This is not different in the US, Iran, France, Germany, Gabun or Equador. Just read my #82 here and ask yourself if your leaders are and were any better than those we have today.

[Axenolith]

People assume, for example, that concentration camps were the same as extermination camps.

Oh please, the only difference is that at "concentration camps" the victims are generally starved or worked to death rather than outright gassed or shot. Probably so the pieces of *hit operating them can construct some psychological barrier to the guilt they'd have for murdering innocents outright.

Regardless of whether or not he knew they were "going to be exterminated", that waste of human skin and atmospheric oxygen should have been killed slowly merely for handing over citizens of HIS country to a conquoring force for shipment to God knew where and what fate...

[Tribune7]

they were not useful to them anymore.

????????

OK, firstly the U.K. got into the war to try and save Poland after a certain country (which shall remain nameless) invaded it without provocation and very much against the wishes of the Brits and all other civilized people. No way, no how was it some kind of dastardly attempt by them to use the Poles as their surrogates

Now, the U.S. got into the European war because a certain country (which shall remain nameless) declared war on us. It really did not have much to do with Poland.

Few here on FR will defend what FDR did at Yalta, especially with 20/20 hindsight,but his administration was filled with communists, he was sick, he trusted Stalin to a degree, there were 400,000 U.S. dead in the war which we in no way sought, and the war did not appear to be ending soon.

So while I won't defend him, I won't accuse him of "treason".