Market confirms ace coach's true value (COLUMINIST NOSE STILL OUT OF JOINT OVER CHIEF ILLINIWEK)

Chicago Sun-Times ^ | February 25, 2007 | RICK TELANDER Sun-Times Columnist

[Chi-townChief]

Chief Illiniwek is gone, and many University of Illinois fans are furious?

What am I missing here? This isn't about political correctness. This is about racism, about wanting to watch a white kid dance like an American Indian just because it's part of one's ''school tradition,'' regardless of the pain it inflicts on others.

If Native Americans say they are offended by being portrayed as caricatures -- which they have said, on and on -- then the rest of us are out of the equation.

Anybody remember the American Indian College Fund ads from a couple years ago, the ones that said, ''HAVE YOU EVER SEEN A REAL INDIAN?'' and showed people such as scrub-suited Dr. Lori Arviso Alvord, a Navajo surgeon and associate dean at the Dartmouth School of Medicine?

The point is, you probably haven't seen a real Indian, now that they don't throw tomahawks and chase John Wayne.

It's stunning to me that our state university, the one we all contribute tax money to, took so long and made such a stink about getting rid of something that is gratuitous and demonstrably harmful to many.

Don't bring up the ''Fighting Irish'' argument, either, please.

Any ethnic or racial group can be used as cartoon fodder in the United States, once that group has achieved power, self-respect, dignity and full participation in the workings of this country.

Native Americans may get there someday, perhaps with the help of casino revenues, and when they do, they might say it's fine to bring back mascote Chief Illiniwek for outsiders' enjoyment.

There's something for Illinois boosters to work on.

[Chi-townChief]

"Any ethnic or racial group can be used as cartoon fodder in the United States, once that group has achieved power, self-respect, dignity and full participation in the workings of this country."

Well, that explains it!!

[Balding_Eagle]

I've never understood the obsession with Indians as mascots.

They lost, remember.

Who wants losers as mascots?

[Mr. Brightside]

If Native Americans say they are offended by being portrayed as caricatures -- which they have said, on and on -- then the rest of us are out of the equation

And I, and Irish American, am offended by Notre Dame's mascot.

But do you think they will change it for me?

[HereInTheHeartland]

"This is about racism, about wanting to watch a white kid dance like an American Indian just because it's part of one's ''school tradition,'' regardless of the pain it inflicts on others."

There are no limits to idiocy in this mostly great nation.

The Oklahoma State Cowboys need to get rid of their mascot. They usually have a "white" kid as mascot.
This must certainly offend someone. There were black cowboys in the Old West, I would guess some Asians also. And what about Mexican cowboys?

The Michigan State Spartan must certainly offend Iranian Americans (the Persians).
And how do we know that it's not just a "white" guy in the Spartan costume and not a true Greek of Spartan heritage?

These are very important issues for our nation.

[kjo]

I am offended by this guy's column. He says American Indians are offended by the Illini mascot thus it needs to be ended. Well, his lack of specifics about how many Indians and who they are offends me.

By his own standard, he should be fired.

[buckalfa]

So when is PETA going to demand that Lions, Tigers and Bears or other fauna stop being used as mascot names?

Will vegans be offended by the use of Buckeyes, although
that is a dumb poisonous nut ?

How about layed off textile workers. Will they be offended
by Presbyterian College's mascot name-- the Blue Hose ?

Will those who enjoy Polka music be offended by Poca High
School in WV being known as the Dots ?

[muawiyah]

This Rick Telander is just another vile racists who seeks to remove from public memory every vestige and sign of the people formerly dominant in the occupation of the land.

[muawiyah]

I'd like to add that "Telander" appears to be a Norse name ~ that is Swedish ~ which probably means Rick grew up learning this Norse tradition about eradicating every sign of the aborigines at his own mother's knees.

There are even Swedes who's churches have abolished any special celebration of Christmas lest someone bring out Santa Claus, the very image of Little Red Man, the chief ancient god of the aborigines of that part of the world.

As I said, the guy's a racist ~ and this little war is not about PC. It's far more serious.

[Rummyfan]

Hey Telander - how come FSU got to keep their Seminole chief but Chief Illiniwek had to go? It's all about NCAA money! I swear today's sports writers are more liberal and PC than those on the news and political front!

[oldplayer]

This stuff makes me crazy.

"If Native Americans say they are offended . . .." WHAT, Native Americans?

I am Choctaw Indian (NOT "Native American") and do not find the Illinois mascot offensive. I have said it on and on. But this Chicago columnist apparently doesn't want to hear from me or "value" my feelings.

Forget fighting over mascots. There are a lot of current more serious issues facing American Indians, ranging from illiteracy to alcoholism to gambling addiction, that should be addressed. Unfortunately, these issues cannot be dealt with so glibly. Addressing such issues takes hard work and will not yield the instant "feel good" smugness that liberals so seek.

Oldplayer
Oklahoma Choctaw

[Paladin2]

NCAA needs to take the Indian out of Indianapolis, Indiana

[fish hawk]

Okay, this makes two of us. I am also an American Indian and I am not offended. In fact I had this great idea for the Illiniwek fans. Everyone get one of those cheap little kids head dresses, you know, you had one as a child, with all different colored feathers on a headband, and have thousands wearing them show up at the games. LOL that should offend someone but there is nothing they can do about it. If I had the time and money I would personally buy a truck load of these and pass them out for free at the main gate of the stadium.

[Verginius Rufus]

When is Telander going to move to Cleveland and start campaigning to force the MLB team to change its name? And its patently offensive logo? How can he stand to live in the same country which permits that?

Maybe he only attends Cubs games and doesn't know about the Cleveland Indians.

[oldplayer]

FishHawk,

Those little war-bonnets are SO WRONG on many levels as a fashion statement, BUT, I'd wear one tomorrow just to piss off a sanctimonious liberal! (Thank God Choctaws had more sense than to wear those!)

How about some Papago woven hats, or some of the grass hats my Yurok and Hoopa friends wear with their regalia?

Liberals are so big on symbolism and pronouncements, but aren't big on working to actually help resolve a problem. This whole mascot deal is perfect for them!

Oldplayer
Oklahoma Choctaw

[fish hawk]

My whole idea with the "cheap" political incorrect bonnets was to make the whole thing look ridiculous. By the way, I am Yurok.

[oldplayer]

Yurok!?

I've insulted my Yurok friends plenty of times, both intentionally and unintentionally! LOL !! Had I known, I could have included you.

You guys have one of the prettiest places on earth in the Hoopa Valley and along the river to the sea. Too bad the San Francisconians and Pelosicrats find it politically incorrect to stop Japan-Taiwan-Peru-Mexico-inc. from overfishing your salmon fishery. Heaven forbid that fish prices go up in the eateries of the elite or that we try to enforce international agreements that might benefit Yuroks, Hoopas and Kiraks!

Just my opinion. If it was as simple as mascots, they'd be all over it!

Oldplayer

[fish hawk]

On top of it all my mother's brother Timm Williams was Prince Lightfoot, the mascot of the Stanford Indians for over twenty years and was removed as such many years ago. Of course the left coast got PC way before anyone else. I have his "Indian" costume and it was offered to Stanford for their museum as a piece of past history and they didn't want anything to do with it. Talk about over reacting, they want to deny an actual piece of their own history for PC.

[Elsie]

Talk about over reacting, they want to deny an actual piece of their own history for PC.

What do you expect?

The entire state of VIRGINIA is going to 'apologise' for it's past history of Slavery!!

http://www.topix.net/forum/city/chester-va/TEOTJFB1B5J06IFJ0

[oldplayer]

Fish Hawk,

Funny, the last Little Red (Indian themed mascot) at the University of Oklahoma is now one of the most respected Indian attorneys in the state of Oklahoma. He is successful in about every way. He doesn't seemed particularly damaged. I work with him often.

My mother and her two sisters were each in turn "Indian Princess" at the University of Oklahoma in the '40's. There were crowned at half-time at the homecoming game each year. I have a cherished framed picture of my mom (yes, a Choctaw wearing the required feathered plains-style headdress) from that homecoming. She and her sisters were all very proud and honored.

To her dying day, she thought this PC stuff was totally ridiculous and wrote the administration regularly about maintaining the traditions. It was to no avail in the ivory halls. Apparently, all Indian voices are not equal.

Oldplayer

[Qout]

Yeah, and let's take the Illini out of Illinois too. Why should we continue to name the land after the natives who once lived there? The University is trying to honor the original inhabitants of the land. If they'd rather be forgotten, forget them. Take out the six letters ILLINI and we'd be left with OS, the state just west of A. Of course, Iowa wouldn't have any letters left, so we'd have to give them a brand new name. How about calling them the State of Corn? Vegetables can't be offended.