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To: TKDietz

They’re allowing their people more and more freedom, becoming a little more democratic.

I will respectfully disagree with you. They are still beating people to death for their religeous beliefs, there are no real property rights, and they limit internet access. The ruling class has no intention of giving up power and they are willing to do anything to keep it. Maybe a miracle could occur and we could have a different discussion ten years from now, but there needs to be meaningful change before we can safely consider them to be anything but sworn enemies.


59 posted on 04/03/2007 6:50:55 PM PDT by freedomfiter2 (Duncan Hunter '08 Pro family, pro life, pro second Amendment, not a control freak.)
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To: freedomfiter2
China is not our sworn enemy. China is a business parter. We don’t have any reason at all to have any beef with the Chinese people. The Chinese government leaves much to be desired, but it has come a long way since Chairman Mao. Communism was doomed from the start, and slowly but surely it’s going to fall by the wayside in China. The government cannot own everything and control every aspect of the lives of the populace. What’s helping a lot in in the demise of communism in China now is economic success and trading relationships with Western nations. You mentioned property rights. The Chinese legislature just passed a bill recognizing property rights, both real and personal property. Even before that, business was thriving in China. People are getting rich, and new middle class is cropping up. Property rights or not, somehow they were buying houses and cars, etc. The old guard, the die hard socialists, are appalled by the new property rights legislation, but the old guard is on their way out. Younger Chinese up and comers grew up seeing financial successes in places like Hong Kong, South Korea and Taiwan, and have seen and taken part in the same mini revolution in their own country in recent years. The Chinese government, while they are still a totalitarian and oppressive regime, is backing off some and allowing a greater degree of freedom than the Chinese people have seen in many decades. I believe that trend is likely to continue, if we let it continue.

If we take the view that China is our enemy and try to isolate them and cut them off from trade with the Western world, we’re only going to create conditions where the old ways of the communists thrive. That is not in our interests. Instead we should put a little more faith in the Chinese people. We should hope for China that they have continued economic success, and that they continue to grow their relationships with the West. The Chinese people, including many of those in the government, will recognize more and more how communism is not compatible with success in this world, and increasingly they will abandon their old ways. In time I think we’ll see China resembling much more the quasi socialist democratic countries in Europe than the China of the Chairman Mao era.

Think about it. Are we going to invade China, crush them militarily and bring about a regime change that way? That’s not going to happen. Do we really stand anything to gain by engaging them in a “Cold War,” trying to thwart them at every turn while they do the same to us? Do we want to play the arms race game with them? I don’t see any benefit in any of that for us. Communism will fail there because it is an impossible “utopian” system that cannot work anywhere for the long haul. I think the Chinese people are finally starting to see the end of that long dark tunnel they’ve been in, and I wish them the best in that regard.

81 posted on 04/04/2007 11:45:38 AM PDT by TKDietz (")
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To: freedomfiter2
The ruling class has no intention of giving up power and they are willing to do anything to keep it. Maybe a miracle could occur and we could have a different discussion ten years from now, but there needs to be meaningful change before we can safely consider them to be anything but sworn enemies.

Agreed.

Notice how they are beefing up their internal stomping out of dissent just prior to the Olympics under the guise of "security."

The Olympics will be a travesty. Might as well be held at one of their Laogai...

93 posted on 04/04/2007 2:52:08 PM PDT by Paul Ross (Ronald Reagan-1987:"We are always willing to be trade partners but never trade patsies.")
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