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New rhetoric in SCOTUS abortion ruling (Ginsgerg: Stop calling a 2nd trimester "fetus" a "baby")
Associated Press ^ | 04/19/07 | PETE YOST

Posted on 04/19/2007 9:56:32 AM PDT by presidio9

Ever since Roe v. Wade in 1973, graphic descriptions of abortion have been staples of abortion opponents. Abortion rights advocates have preferred more scientific terms. Neither is by accident.

The Supreme Court adopted the more graphic approach Wednesday as a conservative majority of justices upheld a nationwide ban on a controversial abortion procedure.

"The way in which the fetus will be killed ... is of legitimate concern" to the government, the majority said.

In opinions after Roe v. Wade, the decision saying a woman has a constitutional right to abortion, clinical terminology has been the order of the day at the court.

All that changed in 2000, when Justice Anthony Kennedy described abortion procedures in painstaking detail. He did so as a dissenter in Stenberg v. Carhart, the ruling striking down Nebraska's ban on what opponents call partial-birth abortions.

"Repeated references to sources understandable only to a trained physician may obscure matters for persons not trained in medical terminology," Kennedy wrote in 2000. "Thus it seems necessary at the outset to set forth what may happen during an abortion."

Kennedy then explained abortion procedures in explicit terms that hadn't been seen previously at the court. The break with tradition prompted Justice John Paul Stevens to note in a concurring opinion, "Much ink is spilled today describing the gruesome nature of late-term abortion procedures."

Kennedy returned to form Wednesday when he wrote the decision of the court.

"It is self-evident that a mother who comes to regret her choice to abort must struggle with grief more anguished and sorrow more profound when she learns ... what she once did not know: that she allowed a doctor to pierce the skull and vacuum the fast-developing brain of her unborn child," Kennedy wrote.

In a forceful dissent, Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg suggested that Kennedy's word-choice goes too far.

"Throughout, the opinion refers to obstetrician-gynecologists and surgeons who perform abortions not by the titles of their medical specialties, but by the pejorative label `abortion doctor,'" wrote Ginsburg. "A fetus is described as an 'unborn child,' and as a 'baby;' second-trimester, previability abortions are referred to as 'late-term.'"


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: abortion; partialbirthabortion; prolife; ruthbaderginsburg
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1 posted on 04/19/2007 9:56:33 AM PDT by presidio9
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To: presidio9

Has anyone ever actually seen Ginsberg with anything but a scowl on her face, under any circumstances?

She seems to be a rather miserable human being.


2 posted on 04/19/2007 9:59:54 AM PDT by Badeye (The worst thing in the world is being talked about. The Second worst is not being talked about.)
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To: presidio9

So Ruth, abortion is all about terminology. Does it make you feel all warm and cozy inside to promote killing a “fetus” instead of a “baby”?


3 posted on 04/19/2007 10:00:42 AM PDT by taxesareforever (Never forget Matt Maupin)
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To: presidio9
second-trimester, previability abortions

It interesting that the Court's self-appointed expert justice on medical technology and terminology is unaware that second trimester abortions are previability abortions no longer.

I also wonder: if Ginsburg's granddaughter Clara had been born at 35 weeks of gestation, would Ginsburg have told her friends: "My daughter just gave birth! I'm on my way to vist her and the new fetus!"

4 posted on 04/19/2007 10:02:00 AM PDT by wideawake
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To: cpforlife.org; Coleus; TexasCowboy; Polycarp IV; wagglebee; cgk

Pro-Life Ping


5 posted on 04/19/2007 10:02:05 AM PDT by presidio9 (Suspended for posting an article about Scalia and Arthur Miller arguing at SCOTUS. Seriously.)
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To: presidio9

I’d say that SCOTUS should endeavor to use clear, common language as much as possible, so that the people its ruling affects have a hope of understand them.

Give the following common phrases:
“When is the baby due?”
“What sex is the baby?”
“What are you going to name the baby?”
“The baby just kicked!”
“The baby is pressing on my bladder.”

...then referring to the third trimester viable fetus as a baby is most clear and correct.


6 posted on 04/19/2007 10:03:49 AM PDT by Atlas Sneezed (Your FRiendly FReeper Patent Attorney)
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To: Badeye

I thought I saw Ginsberg sitting behind home plate at the Red Sox - Blue Jays game Tuesday night. But it was Geddy Lee from RUSH. If you look like Ruth Buzzy Ginsberg are you still really a Rock Star?


7 posted on 04/19/2007 10:04:43 AM PDT by massgopguy (I owe everything to George Bailey)
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To: presidio9
"The way in which the fetus will be killed ... is of legitimate concern" to the government, the majority said.

The way this is worded by the majority seems to imply there is a right/approved way of killing a fetus.

8 posted on 04/19/2007 10:05:25 AM PDT by IamConservative (Any man who agrees with you on everything, will lie to anyone.)
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To: Badeye
Has anyone ever actually seen Ginsberg with anything but a scowl on her face, under any circumstances?

Those are those times she is falling asleep.

9 posted on 04/19/2007 10:05:30 AM PDT by Always Right
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To: presidio9

Ginsburg is an unviable tissue mass.


10 posted on 04/19/2007 10:06:03 AM PDT by N. Theknow ((Kennedys - Can't drive, can't fly, can't ski, can't skipper a boat - But they know what's best.))
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To: Badeye

“She seems to be a rather miserable human being.”

She’s hated life since Foghorn Leghorn dropped her.


11 posted on 04/19/2007 10:08:31 AM PDT by tumblindice
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To: presidio9

Buzzy didn’t have problem when the Court played “scientist” on the CO2 ruling fiasco.


12 posted on 04/19/2007 10:09:26 AM PDT by VeniVidiVici (Encourage illegal immigration! Maybe you too can be hit and killed by a drunk driver!)
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To: massgopguy

“If you look like Ruth Buzzy Ginsberg are you still really a Rock Star?”

See any member of the Rolling Stones, draw your own conclusion.


13 posted on 04/19/2007 10:09:29 AM PDT by Badeye (The worst thing in the world is being talked about. The Second worst is not being talked about.)
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To: massgopguy

It just occured to me that nobody has ever seen Ruth Bader Ginsburg and Geddy Lee in the same place at the same time.

But then I remembered that Ginsburg wears glasses, and Geddy does not, so they can’t possibly be the same person.


14 posted on 04/19/2007 10:10:03 AM PDT by presidio9 (Suspended for posting an article about Scalia and Arthur Miller arguing at SCOTUS. Seriously.)
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To: IamConservative

“The way this is worded by the majority seems to imply there is a right/approved way of killing a fetus.”

I agree. Additionally, they also imply, by use of the word “killed” that a living organism’s life is terminated.

If a fetus can be “killed” than obviously, it is a living person.


15 posted on 04/19/2007 10:10:14 AM PDT by wolf24 ("It's always easy to rally the stupid.")
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To: Always Right

“Has anyone ever actually seen Ginsberg with anything but a scowl on her face, under any circumstances?”

“Those are those times she is falling asleep.”

Thats gas, my friend.


16 posted on 04/19/2007 10:10:20 AM PDT by Badeye (The worst thing in the world is being talked about. The Second worst is not being talked about.)
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To: Always Right

17 posted on 04/19/2007 10:11:35 AM PDT by dfwgator (The University of Florida - Still Championship U)
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To: Badeye
You asked for it:


18 posted on 04/19/2007 10:13:52 AM PDT by AntiGuv ("..I do things for political expediency.." - Sen. John McCain on FOX News)
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To: presidio9
My FETUS, I mean sister, is a 7th month preemie(Now 50 years old, or so)..
Bader Gingberg's agitprop should be called that by the Chief Justice..
19 posted on 04/19/2007 10:14:13 AM PDT by hosepipe (CAUTION: This propaganda is laced with hyperbole....)
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To: presidio9
Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg suggested that Kennedy's word-choice goes too far

Ginsgerg should know that nobody likes legalese and we're going to keep possession of the language regardless of opinions of how far syntax is bent to the needs of the day.

20 posted on 04/19/2007 10:14:59 AM PDT by RightWhale (3 May '07 3:14 PM)
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To: presidio9

Oh Geddy has some big old frames. I’ve seen RUSH many times.


21 posted on 04/19/2007 10:15:03 AM PDT by massgopguy (I owe everything to George Bailey)
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To: Beelzebubba
My wife and I (she's currently pregnant) put things differently:

“When is the unviable tissue mass due?”
“What sex is the unviable tissue mass?”
“What are you going to name the unviable tissue mass”
“The unviable tissue mass just kicked!”
“The unviable tissue mass is pressing on my bladder.”

I thought that was normal. Was I wrong?

< /sarcasm >

22 posted on 04/19/2007 10:15:13 AM PDT by NittanyLion
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To: presidio9

Republicans who voted for her should be lined up and shot.


23 posted on 04/19/2007 10:15:26 AM PDT by AZRepublican ("The degree in which a measure is necessary can never be a test of the legal right to adopt it.")
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To: presidio9

That is how Superman maintained his secret identity.


24 posted on 04/19/2007 10:15:34 AM PDT by pennboricua
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To: presidio9

 

 

25 posted on 04/19/2007 10:15:54 AM PDT by Incorrigible (If I lead, follow me; If I pause, push me; If I retreat, kill me.)
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To: AntiGuv

Last time I saw teeth that ugly, the Brits were visiting...(chuckle)


26 posted on 04/19/2007 10:16:23 AM PDT by Badeye (The worst thing in the world is being talked about. The Second worst is not being talked about.)
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To: Beelzebubba

There you go again, confusing the liberals with facts! /sarcasm


27 posted on 04/19/2007 10:16:49 AM PDT by TommyDale ("Rudy can win the War on Terror!" Perhaps, but for whose side?)
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To: taxesareforever

The next time a pro life lawyer argues in front of RBG he/she should ask the learned jurist what “her” understanding of a fetus is.


28 posted on 04/19/2007 10:17:00 AM PDT by xkaydet65
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To: presidio9

OK Ruthie- enlighten us- when does a fetus become a baby?

If a fetus is pulled or expelled out of the womb during an abortion (excuse the pejorative term) ... and draws breath or tries to as they do in mid 2d trimester and beyond- does it become a “baby”? Or does it retain the term “fetus” because it was not chosen by the “mother” (another potentially pejorative term if it violates the principle of maternal choice) to be a “baby”?

I think we taxpayers who pay for these abortions deserve the details.


29 posted on 04/19/2007 10:18:18 AM PDT by silverleaf (Fasten your seat belts- it's going to be a BUMPY ride.)
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To: wideawake
...unaware that second trimester abortions are previability abortions no longer.

Three years ago, my youngest was expecting her first. She started having problems, and had uremic poisoning.

It got to the point that another day would probably kill her.

The baby was three months early, and it was so critical that he was born Cesarean section on Christmas day.

He had to be in the ICU for three weeks, but both did fine.

The solution to a late term problem that endangers the mother's life is to deliver the baby.

There have been further advances in the last three years.

30 posted on 04/19/2007 10:18:30 AM PDT by Dan(9698)
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To: presidio9
A fetus is described as an 'unborn child,' and as a 'baby;'

Sorry Ruth high-and-mighty Ginsburg...but the truth hurts doesn't it?

The fact that you have ruled in favor of this gruesome, barbaric, middle ages and/or Nazi-like horror for years is something you simply cannot allow your own mind to accept...but it is nonetheless true.

31 posted on 04/19/2007 10:19:01 AM PDT by Jeff Head (Freedom is not free...never has been, never will be (www.dragonsfuryseries.com))
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To: presidio9

At the end of the day, I don’t give a crap what that inhuman freak Ruth thinks.

WE WON THE DAY!

You and your murderous buddies LOST Ruth. Take that and eat it raw!


32 posted on 04/19/2007 10:19:02 AM PDT by Danae (Anail nathrach, orth' bhais's bethad, do chel denmha)
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To: presidio9
... wrote Ginsburg. "A fetus is described as an 'unborn child,' and as a 'baby'

Well now, we can't have that can we? Imagine the gall of someone referring to an unborn child as ... well ... an unborn child.

Thanks, Ms. Ginsburg, for admitting that the whole pro-death superstructure in America rests on the carefully crafted use of deceptive, sanitized, obscurantist terminology.

33 posted on 04/19/2007 10:19:35 AM PDT by Oliver Optic
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To: potlatch; PhilDragoo; ntnychik; MeekOneGOP; dixiechick2000; Grampa Dave; Interesting Times; ...


34 posted on 04/19/2007 10:20:30 AM PDT by devolve ( ........upload images free & fast at tinypic.com or Photobucket or Imagecave)
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To: silverleaf

It seems pretty apparent that (at least to the Dhimmis) they aren’t humans until ruthie SAYS they’re humans.


35 posted on 04/19/2007 10:20:34 AM PDT by rockrr (Never argue with a man who buys ammo in bulk...)
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To: AntiGuv

What an evil woman!


36 posted on 04/19/2007 10:20:44 AM PDT by DungeonMaster (Render therefore to Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and to God the things that are God's.)
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To: IamConservative

The fact they said... how the “fetus” was “killed” should mean that at least they consider it alive. You can’t “kill” tissue.

I thought it was very provoking they admitted that in official documentation.


37 posted on 04/19/2007 10:21:49 AM PDT by mypov (Killed being the operative word...)
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To: presidio9

Smile Ruth, your mother didn’t abort you.


38 posted on 04/19/2007 10:21:55 AM PDT by NeoCaveman (Abramoff, Katrina, Foley, and Iraq have made the R label toxic, not conservatism.)
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To: AZRepublican

Confirmed 96-3 in the US Senate. Republicans who voted “Yes” included John McCain.


39 posted on 04/19/2007 10:22:02 AM PDT by presidio9 (Suspended for posting an article about Scalia and Arthur Miller arguing at SCOTUS. Seriously.)
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To: pennboricua
That is how Superman maintained his secret identity.

What the heck are you talking about?

40 posted on 04/19/2007 10:22:36 AM PDT by presidio9 (Suspended for posting an article about Scalia and Arthur Miller arguing at SCOTUS. Seriously.)
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To: presidio9
"A fetus is described as an 'unborn child,' and as a 'baby;' second-trimester, previability abortions are referred to as 'late-term.'"

Out damn spot, out!

41 posted on 04/19/2007 10:26:12 AM PDT by Aquinasfan (When you find "Sola Scriptura" in the Bible, let me know)
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To: Coleus; nickcarraway; narses; Mr. Silverback; Canticle_of_Deborah; TenthAmendmentChampion; ...
Pro-Life PING

Please FreepMail me if you want on or off my Pro-Life Ping List.

42 posted on 04/19/2007 10:26:26 AM PDT by cpforlife.org (A Catholic Respect Life Curriculum is available at KnightsForLife.org)
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To: Beelzebubba

Here, let me make your list a little more Pro-Choice:

“When is the unviable-tissue-mass due?”
“What sex is the parasitic-organism?”
“What are you going to name the fetus?”
“The unviable-product-of-conception just kicked!”
“The disposable-unwanted-pregnancy is pressing on my bladder.”


43 posted on 04/19/2007 10:27:27 AM PDT by Lazamataz (JOIN THE NRA: https://membership.nrahq.org/forms/signup.asp)
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To: presidio9

Here is the complete text of this soul-less hags opinion:

http://www4.law.cornell.edu/supct/html/05-380.ZD.html


44 posted on 04/19/2007 10:27:46 AM PDT by Vn_survivor_67-68
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To: presidio9

Just joking to your post.

“It just occured to me that nobody has ever seen Ruth Bader Ginsburg and Geddy Lee in the same place at the same time.

But then I remembered that Ginsburg wears glasses, and Geddy does not, so they can’t possibly be the same person.”


45 posted on 04/19/2007 10:27:58 AM PDT by pennboricua
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To: presidio9
Oh, no, Big Sister has discovered people writing in Oldspeak, not Newspeak! Doubleplus ungood! Thoughtcrime alert! Send them to the Ministry of Love!
46 posted on 04/19/2007 10:28:24 AM PDT by colorado tanker
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To: Beelzebubba

Every pregnant woman I know has always called the baby “the baby” from almost the day they found out they were pregnant let alone in the second or third trimester.

Even those that weren’t happy to be pregnant.


47 posted on 04/19/2007 10:29:24 AM PDT by dleecomeback07 (Let's Go Pee Yay (The Cubs new young player is named Pie pronounced Pee Yay))
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To: wideawake
I also wonder: if Ginsburg's granddaughter Clara had been born at 35 weeks of gestation, would Ginsburg have told her friends: "My daughter just gave birth! I'm on my way to vist her and the new fetus!"

Which proves that they're all liars. Anyway, why does anyone get an abortion? Because they don't want a fetus? Or because they don't want a baby?

48 posted on 04/19/2007 10:29:36 AM PDT by Aquinasfan (When you find "Sola Scriptura" in the Bible, let me know)
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To: presidio9
Abortion rights advocates have preferred more scientific terms.

That is the stupidest thing I've ever heard. But I suppose it's what you can expect from Ruth Bader Ginsberg and AP.

Abortion lovers are famous for their shifty use of language. They will not admit that a fetus is ALIVE. They will not admit that abortion KILLS a human being in the earliest stages of life. They will not admit that a fetus is HUMAN. They will not even speak the word "abortion" unless they are cornered, because "choice" sounds better. But their so-called "choice" only allows one answer.

49 posted on 04/19/2007 10:30:07 AM PDT by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
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To: Incorrigible

I like that cartoon.


50 posted on 04/19/2007 10:31:22 AM PDT by blitzgig
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