Posted on 05/13/2007 5:00:34 PM PDT by freedom44
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It was Saudis who funded and led the attacks in 2001, not iran. It is Saudis who are financing madrassas around the world still. It is the Saudis who finance the mosques in America and Britian that teach hate. When do we invade Saudi Arabia?
The French, Dutch, Poles, Greeks all led underground warfare against the Nazis. The Filipinos did the same against the Japanese. Both of those were more repressive and violent than anything on the planet today and the various resistance movements paid dearly for their actions. What is preventing the iranians?
You said — “It was Saudis who funded and led the attacks in 2001, not iran. It is Saudis who are financing madrassas around the world still. It is the Saudis who finance the mosques in America and Britian that teach hate. When do we invade Saudi Arabia?”
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Note that I said — “... they are also the ones who will fund and finance the same types of attacks on the U.S. and its interests (either in this country or overseas) continuously — that we’ve already seen in the form of 9/11 and the WTC ...”
You have to read English a bit better than you are... “will fund” — “same types of attacks” — “that we’ve already seen in the form of 9/11”
I hope you’re reading a bit better now...
In terms of what nationalities are funding various jihadists of the “religio-fanatical-governmental idealogy” of Islam — you’ll find a whole list of them. And that includes Pakistan who is supposed to be our ally in this WOT. However, at the very moment that we are fighting the Taliban in Afghanistan, Pakistan is funding the Taliban (this very day) to go back into Afghanistan and take over the country again, while giving the same group, the Taliban, shelter in Pakistan.
So, you’re going to find a whole bunch of countries doing the very same thing. Thus, you take the biggest ones out first and the most pressing ones out first. Iran is the most pressing one since we’ve already gone into Iraq. It’s clear that the U.S. is not about to let the Iranians get a nuclear weapon to use to threaten its neighbors, and to gain hegemony over the entire Middle East and turn it into a witches cauldron of more “religio-fanatical-governmental idealogy” promoting Islam as the government to take over the world.
Saudi Arabia is definitely on the list of those promoting that kind of fascist idealogy for overthrowing other governments in the world. But, they’re much later on the list, if they continue doing what they’re doing.... Iran is the next one to take out, on the list, in order to stop this religio-fanatical-governmental idealogy called Islam from trying to take over the Western world and nations...
.
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You said — “The French, Dutch, Poles, Greeks all led underground warfare against the Nazis. The Filipinos did the same against the Japanese. Both of those were more repressive and violent than anything on the planet today and the various resistance movements paid dearly for their actions. What is preventing the iranians?”
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Okay, that’s a good example. We declared war on them (the Europeans did first and then we did later, after we were attacked). So, it’s about time to declare war on Iran then, and fund their opposition groups and go to war with them.
It’s like you said, about these groups, which were fighting during wartime. So, let’s get it on and go to war with them. You see..., those other groups *knew* we were committed at that time. They knew we were *in it for the long haul*. And that’s why they did what they did. It’s time that the Iranians *know* we’re also in it for the long haul, just like those groups in World War II knew, too.
As soon as we “get in it for the long haul” and take out those religio-fanatical-governmental idealogists who call themselves Islamists — then we’ll have those same types of groups.
But, as long was we just sit around doing nothing (which we didn’t do in World War II; we got right in there and starting *going for them* against our enemies) — as long we continue to do nothing, you won’t get what you got during World War II. You’ve got to be *fighting the war* just like we were in World War II — and then you’ll get those groups, just like you said...
So, let’s get it on....
Yeah WTC911 just sent me a private message telling me he is going to confront us ‘SHAHIs’
Re: Persian Warriors: Dedicated to President Bush
From wtc911 | 05/14/2007 6:37:29 AM PDT read
You’re breaking my heart Sally. I’ll see you around, every time you post your lies.
I’m going to revisit this part once more. I already answered part of it, but I left out another part that I should address...
You said — “The French, Dutch, Poles, Greeks all led underground warfare against the Nazis. The Filipinos did the same against the Japanese. Both of those were more repressive and violent than anything on the planet today and the various resistance movements paid dearly for their actions. What is preventing the iranians?”
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Now, when you listen to the people “who know” describing what this religio-fanatical-governmental oppressive idealogy of Islam is all about, you’ll find that it’s actually *much worse* than these other two from World War II.
I’ve listened to a lot of speakers who have talked around the U.S. about this fascist idealogy of Islam (and done reading from others) — those who came from “within” that environment. So, they speak from experience. In fact, there is a group of ex-terrorists who have been speaking out in the United States. One of that group is Walid Shoebat. You can find his web site by googling it.
He points out that there are similarities with the Nazism of World War II, with which idealogy and country (and peoples) we engaged in *all out war*. But, Walid Shoebat points out that this present idealogy of this false religio-governmental system of Islam is much worse — in that it has the “religious twist” (his words). It’s not just the “Fuhrer” saying to do these things (as Hitler did during World War II), but with this evil and despical religio-governmental idealogy, it’s supposedly *God* Himself telling these people to do those things, as outlined in the Koran and spoken by Mohammed, Allah’s supreme prohpet.
I mean, it may be one thing to follow an earthly leader and go into battle — but — with this — you’re “following God” — to set up *his form of government* over all the world.
Thus, this makes it *much worse* of an idealogy than anything we ever saw out of World War II. Any “earthly consequences” makes no difference, and therefore *anything goes* with these crazy-fanatical world-domination types from Islam. And since people are totally expendable, they can afford to keep going and going and and not run out of their people until we run out of our people.
And no, those others of World War II were not much more repressive and/or violent than what we have coming out of the religio-fanatical-governmental oppressive idealogy of Islam. Nothing trumps that, from what I can see...
This is also borne out (the fact that it’s worse than anything else the world has ever brought about), by those many other speakers on the subject of Islam and how we are at war with that evil and false idealogy, from Allah (supposedly a “god” but we see is actually Satan of the Bible), who commands his form of “government” over all the world and all the nations of the world — plus the fact of commanding that every last single Jew in the world be killed.
Yeah..., sure..., if you can find a worse and more evil idealogy that is actually *working itself out* — in the *actual nations* of the world (like Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, Iran, Iraq and a list of others that are being slowly taken over, as we speak), today — I would be interested to know what that worse and more evil idealogy is...
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Gee, you forgot to mention that my mail to you was a reply to your message..."You are a worthless anti-American PIECE OF SHIT! You hate America you worth scum!"
Kind of a different thing, isn't it?
And yes, I will be here with the documented facts every time I see you persians using this American forum fot propoganda.
Of course you and your brethren can get rid of me simply by providing even one post of mine that supports your lies. We know you can't.
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Gee, the survivors of the Bataan Death March or the Rape of Nanking or any one of the dozens of Nazi death camps might disagree with you just a bit on that, but hey...what's 13,000,000 murdered compared to a few beheadings, right?
You said — “Gee, the survivors of the Bataan Death March or the Rape of Nanking or any one of the dozens of Nazi death camps might disagree with you just a bit on that, but hey...what’s 13,000,000 murdered compared to a few beheadings, right?”
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You’re talking about a war that is over and done with (i.e., World War II). This war is just beginning. We’ve been going at it for a number of years, so far and haven’t dented the religio-fanatical-governmental idealogy of Islam one iota. It’s still going strong and it’s still producing jihadists and it’s still supported by a large majority of their 1.2 billion people (or more by now...).
World War II was over in a few years. This one is like the 100-years-war and will be at least that long if not longer. So, the “counting” has just begun...
Oh..., and wait for the next big attack on the U.S., like the one that the authorities say is coming *for sure*. According to what officials have said over the last few years, it’s not a question of “if” but simply “when” the next big attack will be coming. And this one might be the one in which a nuclear weapon gets set off. Then we’ll be upping the count pretty quick....
And that won’t even be the end of it all. There’s a lot more counting to come... so get ready...
Oh, as a followup, I thought I should include just *one* stated goal of the religio-fanatical-governmental idealogy of Islam — for a comparison in “numbers” for you.
The *one* stated goal that these fascists and evil murderers have stated is a goal (and is included in their own core materials that all Muslims must follow, that is from Mohammed and the Koran) — is to kill all the Jews worldwide.
Now, the figure that I’ve picked up for the Jewish population of the world is about 13.3 million (give or take).
So, in answer to your point of “what’s 13,000,000 murdered compared to a few beheadings...” — the answer is that just *one* goal states — 13,000,000 alone — for all the killing that they intend to do. That’s not even beginning to address all the others that will be done from other groups that come under the other heading of “infidel” (the Jews have their *own special category* of “apes and pigs” you see...).
Their own stated goals and the figures that you will arrive at with what they intend to do, will probably drive the figure up to 30,000,000 or more, worldwide, in accomplishing their goals (figuring in all the other groups they are going to do away with). And keep in mind, IRAN (one of the prime culprits here) is getting nuclear weapons to help *facilitate* this goal of killing — not only Jews, but all the other infidels that resist that religio-fanatical-governmental oppressive idealogy of Islam...
We could motivate them by leveling their ports, oil production and nuke ambitions. Less money might make them less comfortable.
From www.danielpipes.org |
by Daniel Pipes
January 10, 2006
Thanks to the president of Iran, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, a new word has entered the political vocabulary: mahdaviat.
Not surprisingly, it's a technical religious term. Mahdaviat derives from mahdi, Arabic for "rightly-guided one," a major figure in Islamic eschatology. He is, explains the Encyclopaedia of Islam, "the restorer of religion and justice who will rule before the end of the world." The concept originated in the earliest years of Islam and, over time, became particularly identified with the Shi?ite branch. Whereas "it never became an essential part of Sunni religious doctrine," continues the encyclopedia, "Belief in the coming of the Mahdi of the Family of the Prophet became a central aspect of the faith in radical Shi?ism," where it is also known as the return of the Twelfth Imam.
Mahdaviat means "belief in and efforts to prepare for the Mahdi."
In a fine piece of reporting, Scott Peterson of the Christian Science Monitor shows the centrality of mahdaviat in Mr. Ahmadinejad's outlook and explores its implications for his policies.
As mayor of Tehran, for example, Mr. Ahmadinejad appears to have in 2004 secretly instructed the city council to build a grand avenue to prepare for the Mahdi. A year later, as president, he allocated $17 million for a blue-tiled mosque closely associated with mahdaviat in Jamkaran, south of the capital. He has instigated the building of a direct Tehran-Jamkaran railroad line. He had a list of his proposed cabinet members dropped into a well adjacent to the Jamkaran mosque, it is said, to benefit from its purported divine connection.
He often raises the topic, and not just to Muslims. When addressing the United Nations in September, Mr. Ahmadinejad flummoxed his audience of world political leaders by concluding his address with a prayer for the Mahdi's appearance: "O mighty Lord, I pray to you to hasten the emergence of your last repository, the Promised One, that perfect and pure human being, the one that will fill this world with justice and peace."
On returning to Iran from New York, Mr. Ahmadinejad recalled the effect of his U.N. speech:
one of our group told me that when I started to say "In the name of God the almighty and merciful," he saw a light around me, and I was placed inside this aura. I felt it myself. I felt the atmosphere suddenly change, and for those 27 or 28 minutes, the leaders of the world did not blink. ? And they were rapt. It seemed as if a hand was holding them there and had opened their eyes to receive the message from the Islamic republic.
What Mr. Peterson calls the "presidential obsession" with mahdaviat leads Mr. Ahmadinejad to "a certitude that leaves little room for compromise. From redressing the gulf between rich and poor in Iran, to challenging America and Israel and enhancing Iran's power with nuclear programs, every issue is designed to lay the foundation for the Mahdi's return."
"Mahdaviat is a code for [Iran's Islamic] revolution, and is the spirit of the revolution," says the head of an institute dedicated to studying and speeding the Mahdi's appearance. "This kind of mentality makes you very strong," the political editor of Resalat newspaper, Amir Mohebian, observed. "If I think the Mahdi will come in two, three, or four years, why should I be soft? Now is the time to stand strong, to be hard." Some Iranians, reports PBS, "worry that their new president has no fear of international turmoil, may think it's just a sign from God."
Mahdaviat has direct and ominous implications for the U.S.-Iran confrontation, says an Ahmadinejad supporter, Hamidreza Taraghi of Iran's hard-line Islamic Coalition Society. It implies seeing Washington as the rival to Tehran and even as a false Mahdi. For Mr. Ahmadinejad, the top priority is to challenge America, and specifically to create a powerful model state based on "Islamic democracy" by which to oppose it. Mr. Taraghi predicts trouble ahead unless Americans fundamentally change their ways.
I'd reverse that formulation. The most dangerous leaders in modern history are those (such as Hitler) equipped with a totalitarian ideology and a mystical belief in their own mission. Mahmoud Ahmadinejad fulfills both these criteria, as revealed by his U.N. comments. That combined with his expected nuclear arsenal make him an adversary who must be stopped, and urgently.
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Jan. 14, 2006 update: Anton La Guardia concludes in a similar article in London's Daily Telegraph, "'Divine mission' driving Iran's new leader," the sneaking suspicion among Western officials that "Iran's president actually relishes a clash with the West in the conviction that it would rekindle the spirit of the Islamic revolution and - who knows - speed up the arrival of the Hidden Imam." (In Twelver Shi'ite doctrine, the Hidden Imam returns just before the appearance of the mahdi.)
May 11, 2006 update: Jackson Diehl provides more information on this topic in "In Iran, Apocalypse vs. Reform," which I excerpt below:
QOM, Iran?In a dusty brown village outside this Shiite holy city, a once-humble yellow-brick mosque is undergoing a furious expansion. Cranes hover over two soaring concrete minarets and the pointed arches of a vast new enclosure. Buses pour into a freshly asphalted parking lot to deliver waves of pilgrims.
The expansion is driven by an apocalyptic vision: that Shiite Islam's long-hidden 12th Imam, or Mahdi, will soon emerge?possibly at the mosque of Jamkaran?to inaugurate the end of the world. The man who provided $20 million to prepare the shrine for that moment, Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, has reportedly told his cabinet that he expects the Mahdi to arrive within the next two years. Mehdi Karrubi, a rival cleric, has reported that Ahmadinejad ordered that his government's platform be deposited in a well at Jamkaran where the faithful leave messages for the hidden imam.
Such gestures are one reason some Iranian clerics quietly say they are worried about a leader who has become the foremost public advocate of Iran's nuclear program. "Some of us can understand why you in the West would be concerned," a young mullah here told me last week. "We, too, wonder about the intentions of those who are controlling this nuclear work."
Qom is a place where the possible ends of Iran's slowly crumbling Islamic regime can be glimpsed?both the catastrophic and the potentially benign. There is the rising, officially nurtured last-days cult at Jamkaran, and the extremist rants of Ahmadinejad's own spiritual adviser, Ayatollah Taqi Mesbah-Yazdi, who recently suggested that future elections were superfluous because a true Islamic government had arisen.
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From www.danielpipes.org |
Regards,
Star Traveler
Perhaps you should check my profile and posting history before you start teaching me about the global threat from islam.
Tilman was stabbed 156 times, Necati 99 times and Ugur’s stabs were too numerous to count. They were disemboweled, and their intestines sliced up in front of their eyes. They were emasculated and watched as those body parts were destroyed. Fingers were chopped off, their noses and mouths and anuses were sliced open. Possibly the worst part was watching as their brothers were likewise tortured. Finally, their throats were sliced from ear to ear, heads practically decapitated.
See the rest of the report, below...
Reported by Darlene N. Bocek (24 April 2007)
Dear friends,
This past week has been filled with much sorrow. Many of you have heard by now of our devastating loss here in an event that took place in Malatya, a Turkish province 300 miles northeast of Antioch, the city where believers were first called Christians (Acts 11:26).
On Wednesday morning, April 18, 2007, 46 year old German missionary and father of three Tilman Geske prepared to go to his office, kissing his wife goodbye taking a moment to hug his son and give him the priceless memory, “Goodbye, son. I love you.” Tilman rented an office space from Zirve Publishing where he was preparing notes for the new Turkish Study Bible. Zirve was also the location of the Malatya Evangelist Church office. A ministry of the church, Zirve prints and distributes Christian literature to Malatya and nearby cities in Eastern Turkey. In another area of town, 35 year old Pastor Necati Aydin, father of two, said goodbye to his wife, leaving for the office as well. They had a morning Bible Study and prayer meeting that some other believers in town would also be attending. Ugur Yuksel likewise made his way to the Bible study. None of these three men knew that what awaited them at the Bible study was the ultimate testing and application of their faith, which would conclude with their entrance into glory to receive their crown of righteousness from Christ and honor from all the saints awaiting them in the Lord’s presence.
On the other side of town, ten young men all under 20 years old put into place final arrangements for their ultimate act of faith, living out their love for Allah and hatred of infidels who they felt undermined Islam. On Resurrection Sunday, five of these men had been to a by-invitation-only evangelistic service that Pastor Necati and his men had arranged at a hotel conference room in the city. The men were known to the believers as “seekers.” No one knows what happened in the hearts of those men as they listened to the gospel. Were they touched by the Holy Spirit? Were they convicted of sin? Did they hear the gospel in their heart of hearts? Today we only have the beginning of their story.
These young men, one of whom is the son of a mayor in the Province of Malatya, are part of a tarikat, or a group of “faithful believers” in Islam.
Tarikat membership is highly respected here; it’s like a fraternity membership. In fact, it is said that no one can get into public office without membership in a tarikat. These young men all lived in the same dorm, all preparing for university entrance exams.
The young men got guns, bread knives, ropes and towels ready for their final act of service to Allah. They knew there would be a lot of blood. They arrived in time for the Bible Study, around 10 o’clock.
They arrived, and apparently the Bible Study began. Reportedly, after Necati read a chapter from the Bible the assault began. The boys tied Ugur, Necati, and Tilman’s hands and feet to chairs and as they videoed their work on their cell phones, they tortured our brothers for almost three hours*
[Details of the torture—
Tilman was stabbed 156 times, Necati 99 times and Ugur’s stabs were too numerous to count. They were disemboweled, and their intestines sliced up in front of their eyes. They were emasculated and watched as those body parts were destroyed. Fingers were chopped off, their noses and mouths and anuses were sliced open. Possibly the worst part was watching as their brothers were likewise tortured. Finally, their throats were sliced from ear to ear, heads practically decapitated.]
About Jerry Golden: Thank you for looking in on the Jerry Golden "Report". I hope that you will find it both informative and a blessing.
Jerry and Connie Golden are Messianic Believers in Yeshua Hamashiah (Jesus Christ); and dual Citizens of both the United States and Israel. Jerry has served in both armed forces. And Connie and Jerry have been married for 30 years. They have lived in Israel for many years and have raised their three youngest children in Jerusalem. Both of their daughters are married and living in the States, and their youngest son Joel is now serving in the IDF Special Forces.
The above f rom Slantright Blog
Regards,
Star Traveler
Perhaps you should check my profile and posting history before you start teaching me about the global threat from islam...
Already saw it a long time ago, long before the first or second post. Obviously you don't see any further than the New York shoreline, and certainly not over into Iran where the major threat of this religio-fanatical-governmental oppressive idealogy of Islam is (one of the places, anyway) posing a major threat which needs to be totally eliminated.
Regards,
Star Traveler
Thank you for your time.
Agreed but no land troops.
The FReeper thread -- Contingencies for nuclear terrorist attack
IRAN will be getting nuclear weapons soon, unless we do something about it beforehand...
Regards,
Star Traveler
??
Those I've met consider the current Iranian government only a nuisance.
They travel back and forth, buy and sell property, and enjoy life here - but I don't see them calling for resistance 'back home'.
Like most folks from that region, political (tribal) turmoil is what they expect and what they are conditioned to deal with.
It would possibly help if they referred to themselves as Iranian rather than as Persian or Armenian.
[It might also help if they could manage to be just a bit less obvious in their attitude toward Jews.]
Just some thoughts.
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OK, please tell me how many Infantry and Armored Divisions this would take and, given the fact that every one that we have is committed somewhere in the world either deployed or re-fitting to be deployed again, where will the estimated 250,000 (minimum) troops come from?
And please don't give me the tired response that 'we have the best military ever, they can do anything'. I work closely with the Army in a few areas and I know how good they are, how dedicated they are and what they can do. One thing the best military ever cannot do is train the troops be in two places at once.
Freedom 44 is absolutely right about WTC911....
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Freedom44 is banned or suspended.
And I'm still waiting for you to accept my challenge and prove your lies...
Thank you for your thoughts. Your observations are legitimate and to the best of my knowledge, accurate. However, the individuals you are referring to have a responsibility to themselves, their families, their countrymen and the world to confront reality; their belligerent government supports terrorism and is systematically developing the means to acquire nuclear weapons. Every time the West turns to these willfully ignorant souls as signs Iran not so bad, or is opening up, the West is burned. By who? By true believers in Tehran. Why? Because the people you are talking about aren't willing to stand up for themselves, much less democracy, much less security...
Never forget that the Iranian people are politically irrelevant to a regime that survives and thrives on petroleum revenue. The economics are clear. The problems stalling positive change in Iran isn't that the people whom you have met only consider the Iranian government a nuisance. The fact that the Government of Iran considers Iranians only a nuisance is the problem! Petroleum revenue disconnects the Iranian government from responsibility to its citizenry. That's why Khomenei's political illusion can thrive with successors in an environment like Iran and Iraq, but only by proxy in Lebanon, and other places...
The signs that Iran is thawing to the West will come from policies the Islamic Republic of Iran implement and allow to function for a reasonable amount of time. That isn't happening. Indeed the opposite is occurring. The IRI has broken and will continue to break every promise it makes to its people and the International community unless it is compelled by force of arms to live up to their promises. The U.S. military presence in the region has softened some inside Iran but hardened others. Think in terms of evolution my friend. When a protectorate retreats, the hard devourer the soft. A positive U.S. influence in Iraq and Afghanistan must be cemented to prevent Tehran's irresponsible government from destroying the lives of millions, including your willfully ignorant friends.
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