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To: Aquinasfan
It's the difference between "The Lord of the Flies" and the Constitutional Convention in Philadelphia in 1783.

Man in a state of nature is uncontrolled, violent, and selfish. But in an advanced society, we establish rules and enforcement mechanisms that create a more harmonious environment in which to live. We make it. It's not something that springs out of thin air. It's a construct.

77 posted on 08/03/2007 11:05:42 AM PDT by ClearCase_guy (Progressives like to keep doing the things that didn't work in the past.)
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To: ClearCase_guy
It's the difference between "The Lord of the Flies" and the Constitutional Convention in Philadelphia in 1783. Man in a state of nature is uncontrolled, violent, and selfish.

I disagree. Man, by nature, is more good than bad. Otherwise the human race would have died out a long time ago. Most of the world lives fairly peaceably. This has always been so. Throughout history, conflict has represented the exception, and not the rule.

Man in a state of nature is uncontrolled, violent, and selfish

Can you name a significant society today that could be typically and thoroughly described as such? Or does this represent some imaginary past state of the human race?

But in an advanced society, we establish rules and enforcement mechanisms that create a more harmonious environment in which to live.

Can you name a significant society today where this is not true? Any past society? These things hold true for the most primitive societies that I can think of.

In fact, modern society has morally retrogressed, significantly. No society in human history has killed its unborn on a scale comparable to today. According to Peter Kreeft, when some African primitives were informed of abortion in the West, they were dumbfounded.

We make it. It's not something that springs out of thin air. It's a construct.

I think this is the crux of the issue. Laws don't emerge from nothing. They reflect abiding, eternal principles. Law is the working out of these principles for particular people, places, times and circumstances. "Housing by-law, section 2B," for example, may seem "artificial," but at its root is a principle that is recognized by all people, the notion of private property. All people in all times have recognized that theft is wrong, and implicit in the notion of theft is the notion of private property.

82 posted on 08/03/2007 11:28:51 AM PDT by Aquinasfan (When you find "Sola Scriptura" in the Bible, let me know)
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