Thompson: Leave 'No Child Left Behind' behind

Baltimore Sun ^ | 9/13/2007 | Mark Silva

[A_perfect_lady]

I've said it before, and I'll say it again, it's not really a racial thing, it's an economic thing - schools in the worst neighborhoods are going to do worse than schools in the richer neighborhoods.

These are kids who are all in the same school that I'm talking about. Within our school, the Asian kids are at 60% proficiency, the white kids are at 50%, and the black and Latino kids are at about 22%.

Far as I can see, it's cultural. I teach ESL, and when I say "Take out a piece of paper and a pencil," the Asian kids do it, the white kids do it, and the others, by and large, ignore me.

[Tennessean4Bush]

Those factors can be addressed and even controlled at a local or state level.

So, at a local or state level you are seeing the teacher union problems successfully addressed?

You want I should split hairs? Oy!

I am not asking anyone to split hairs, merely to modulate their rhetoric. Again, out of my list the NCLB would not even make my top five, nor would it make yours, I presume.

Is the federal government getting involved in public schools a great idea that I support? No. Is it worthy of "single, worst" thing to happen? Nah, not even in the top 10.

[redgirlinabluestate]

Demanding that certain basic standards be met is a good thing. While Romney is generally supportive of Bush on this (as was Fred), he is pushing for more local control of those standards as well. The best of both worlds.

Governor Romney: "We all want to be successful based on our rhetoric, not actual, measurable results, and I'm afraid that in the world marketplace, our kids are only going to be successful based on their performance, and that requires measurement. I think the president was right to insist on measurement. I think the measurements themselves have a long way to be perfected, and a lot of room for improvement."

Romney called for "greater state flexibility in the (student) testing process."

[pnh102]

The piece of recent government legislation which has had the worst effect on public schools is the NCLB act.

I said in recent memory.

[Paige]

Now for the FAIR TAX

[Paige]

SO did a LOT OF OTHERS....now they see how WRONG THEY were. GET A GRIP!

[George W. Bush]

Romney called for "greater state flexibility in the (student) testing process."

Fred scores a little better than Mitt on this in my book. The difference isn't great but I don't want someone to "fix" it, I want it eliminated. Next best solution is to whittle away at it.

I am a longtime education activist. Bond drives, school board, regional education board member, testimony before state board and alliance with conservative state board members, etc. Here at FR, a foe of NCLB under Xlinton and under Bush.

This is a good litmus issue in many respects. How a candidate stands on this issue means a lot to homeschoolers and conservative education activists. Years back at FR, this issue was held to be of fundamental importance in blocking the advance of socialist policy. It still is but many FReepers are so focused on the war in Iraq that they ignore the advance of socialism at home.

One of the reasons I support Ron Paul foremost is because he and Hyde defeated this under Xlinton. If one of these candidates want to stand out from the GOP pack, they need to show me that they don't favor yet another expansion of these unconstitutional programs that intrude into local government and education.

I'll keep watching the candidates but this is a very important issue to me personally because it is such a bellwether on how a candidate stands on so many other issues. If we can't win these smaller issues on state and local control, we have no hope of turning back the tide of socialism.

[RockinRight]

No he won’t. Most teachers oppose it because they think they need yet MORE money, not less as Fred is (indirectly) suggesting.

[grellis]

You presume wrong, actually. NCLB is most definitely in my top five. Number one with a bullet, as a matter of fact. My children attend public schools--an urban public school, in fact, in a failing school district. NCLB's goal was to address the problems in districts such as ours, and what it has done is hasten the demise of our district much faster than all of your other factors combined.

And yes, to a certain extent the teacher union problems are being addressed here, both at a local and state level. Is everyone happy with the way things are going? Of course not. I shudder to think, however, how difficult it would be to address union-related problems if it had to be done on a national level, rather than a state level.

If you want to call it hyperbole, go right ahead--but that has more to do with the circumstances of your school districts, not mine. Here in Lansing, NCLB has been disasterous.

[grellis]

I wasn’t actually trying to quote you, just reinterperating what you stated with my own thoughts about the horrid NCLB.

[redgirlinabluestate]

That's fine. It just seems that you are giving Fred a pass on what he actually did in the senate compared to what he is saying now. Not unusual around here.

[pnh102]

I'm still amazed that so many Republicans thought that expanding the federal government's role in local matters was a good thing

Sadly, W has been one of the worst presidents ever when it comes to expanding government, both in terms of size as well as spending. I always look back the first 6 years of his presidency as a grand opportunity to reshape the country in a conservative image. And we may never get that back again.

[George W. Bush]

It just seems that you are giving Fred a pass on what he actually did in the senate compared to what he is saying now. Not unusual around here.

Mitt sounds like he wants to "fix it". It can't be fixed. It is fundamentally wrong-headed. And he should know that.

Fred's position is slightly better, broadly hinting that it's failed and is not a primary federal responsibility. We'll see if Fred paints this position more strongly in future statements.

I still favor abolition and support Ron Paul. For what it's worth, if/when he is defeated in the primary, this issue will loom large on who I pick to vote for in the primaries. That's just how it is.

If Mitt wants more votes on this issue, he needs to earn them by paying attention to it and making stronger statements.

[tiki]

This has nothing to do with money for classroom teachers, maybe the NEA and teachers of every stripe hate it with a passion.

[af_vet_rr]

Far as I can see, it's cultural. I teach ESL, and when I say "Take out a piece of paper and a pencil," the Asian kids do it, the white kids do it, and the others, by and large, ignore me.

Maybe it's a combination of both cultural and socio-economic - if your parents went through high school, and on into college, they are going to make more money than somebody who may not have finished HS and who definitely didn't go to college. Your parents are going to realize the value of an education, whereas somebody who dropped out in high school may not care too much about education, and that attitude carries over to the kids.

[redgirlinabluestate]

Granted, it’s an important issue, but the war, the border/illegal immigration, tort reform, taxes and the marriage amendment are more pressing — and Mitt is right on all those issues.

[A_perfect_lady]

I don’t know what it is, but the Latino parents, educated or not, seem quite concerned. The ones who come to parent night are obviously hoping their children get more out of life than they ever did. Their children, however, seem over-indulged. I don’t know how many parents I’ve told (ever so gently) that perhaps they shouldn’t buy a PSP for a child who flatly refuses to do a lick of work either at school or at home.

[SQUID]

Oy veh!

[asparagus]

Let’s throw millions of dollars into a project. Then, before we have enough data to conclude whether its a success we abandon the project and spend millions more on a different project. See any similarities here to Iraq?

[Tennessean4Bush]

NCLB is most definitely in my top five

Oh, well, to each his own. It strains credulity, in my opinion. But, you are entitled to your opinion and I cannot possibly tell you how NCLB has affected your hometown. Good luck to you and happy posting.