In defense of his Confederate pride

St Petersburg Times ^ | October 7, 2007 | Stephanie Garry

[silentreignofheroes]

Not any different than you then,,you do the same..

[Colonel Kangaroo]

What we got instead was the end of true federalism, and an ever-since-increasingly bloated Leviathan on the Potomac.

What do you think the rebs were trying to set up? They tend to get a free pass because they failed and we do not get too see what they were going to develop into. But given the Confederacy's early behavior, had they won we would have a bloated Leviathan in Richmond as well as on the Potomac.

[SonnyBubba]

Sure this guy real name isn’t Clayton Bigsby?
(Funniest Dave Chappelle skit ever)

[SonnyBubba]

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/291638/clayton_bigsby/

[groanup]

Other than the few groups of abolitionists in the New England states the North had no truck with slavery. The modern history books would have us all believe that the South and the North locked horns over it and the heroes won and abolished it. Problem is for the South it (the expansion of slavery to the territories and new states) was one of many reasons to secede. For the North it was a non-issue. The North made war on the South to preserve the union. Period.

[antinomian]

Maybe because they are history books and not fairy tales? Other than the figure that 5% owned slaves I'm not aware of any source that supports any of your other claims.

So try as you might, you cannot find any source anywhere that would convince you that any southerner ever bought a whole family, that any southerner worked in his own field, that any slave ever got to travel off the plantation, that any slave was ever well treated, or that Ohio ever turned away a freed slave?

[x]

Louis Nelson doesn't show up on the Civil War Soldiers and Sailors website where Winbush says he should.

That doesn't mean he didn't exist, but it is a bit of a mystery.

Maybe the website's incomplete, but could it be that Nelson wasn't considered a soldier by the Confederate Army during the war?

There's more here.

BTW, when you were in the service, did you get to bring along your own bodyguard? Sounds like a great deal, especially if you didn't have to pay him.

[antinomian]

As opposed to Illinois, which banned blacks. That would come as a heck of a surprise to the thousands of blacks who lived there. According to the 1860 census, Illinois' free black population of 7628 was larger than the free black population of all but two of the original 7 rebelling states. In fact, Illinois had more free blacks than Florida, Mississippi, Georgia, Alabama, and Texas combined.

Illinois banned free blacks from moving into the state. Free blacks who were already there were severely restricted.

[antinomian]

And yet the 1860 census counted 7628 of them living there, more than the free black populations of Alabama, Mississippi and Georgia combined. Some southern states had laws that forced freed slaves to leave the state or be returned to slavery.

Those laws were not enforced. They were enacted during the period when the northern states were trying to eliminate their own black populations through structures manumission laws.

And the free black numbers in the census are known to be bogus. Free black men listed their wives and children as slaves for legal reasons.

[napscoordinator]

Your post is a hoot! Yes let’s just make slavery look romantic. Please. It was a tragedy and should be told rightly so. The south botched up that part of history. Just deal with it. However, I will give you kudos for making a funny...

[antinomian]

Not a lot, no. I have no doubt that his beliefs are sincere but he keeps spouting the same old southron song-and-dance. It wasn't about slavery. Unilateral secession was constitutional. Lincoln was a dictator. The South paid a disproportionate part of the taxes. Slavery was dying out. No different than any other southron supporter who has drunk the confederate koolaid..

Lincoln said the war was not about slavery.
Lincoln Said secession was legal earlier in his career.
The South did pay a disproportionate part of the taxes.
Slavery was dying out. It had died out everywhere in the west by 1884.

[antinomian]

Other than the few groups of abolitionists in the New England states the North had no truck with slavery. The modern history books would have us all believe that the South and the North locked horns over it and the heroes won and abolished it. Problem is for the South it (the expansion of slavery to the territories and new states) was one of many reasons to secede. For the North it was a non-issue. The North made war on the South to preserve the union. Period.

And what the southerners really wanted with the western territories was a place to get rid of their black population. There was never any real hope of extending the plantation system there. The land there won't support it.

I wouldn't say it was a non-issue for the north. What the republicans wanted was to deport the blacks out of North America altogether, and to keep them in the South until that could be arranged.

[snippy_about_it]

...drunk the confederate koolaid..M

You sir, do not know the history of the Southland and you show that clearly by your comments. The history is out there and I suggest you read some of it.

[Bubba Ho-Tep]

Those laws were not enforced.

Neither were Illinois', apparently.

They were enacted during the period when the northern states were trying to eliminate their own black populations through structures manumission laws.

What are "structures manumission laws"?

And the free black numbers in the census are known to be bogus. Free black men listed their wives and children as slaves for legal reasons.

A) Source?
B) What legal reasons would those be? The not-enforced laws demanding freed blacks leave the state?

[truth_seeker]

“What would you list...??”

Wrong person to ask. Ask a proud Southerner.

I am sure there a plenty of worthy claims, besides slavery.

[antinomian]

Your post is a hoot! Yes let’s just make slavery look romantic. Please. It was a tragedy and should be told rightly so. The south botched up that part of history. Just deal with it. However, I will give you kudos for making a funny...

Well as long as we're talking about just dealing with history...
Let's remember that it was yankees who ran the transatlantic slave trade after 1836 and continued to do so until the 1880's. Let's remember that the biggest port of entry for African-American ancestors is Newport, RI. Let's remember that it was New York bankers who financed the domestic as well as international slave trade. And let's remember that it was Yankee insurance firms who insured all of this valuable property.

The Mayor of New York lives in a mansion that was built by a prominent New York family from profits made founding the Mobile slave market.

[kalee]

“Winbush’s son, a Naval Academy graduate who works for IBM, once suggested Winbush donate his Confederate collection to a museum.”

A museum would bury it in their archives. This doesn’t meet their staqndards for PC-ness.

We were at the Atlanta History Center about 12 years ago and saw them turn a young black man away from an encampment. He had proof his ancestor had been a free black living in LA and he wanted to portray his ancestor. We overheard tyhe discussion he had with the museum people who said he was WRONG, blacks didn;t serve in the Confederacy. We had supper with him at the Johnny Rockets down the road and he gave our children a history lesson they would never get in schools or museums. He had the evidence to back up all his statements.

The young man also said that his ancestors owned slaves. You should have seen the looks on the museum staff’s faces.

[snippy_about_it]

What we got instead was the end of true federalism, and an ever-since-increasingly bloated Leviathan on the Potomac.

Amen to my Yankee friend. LOL. Good to see you Tony. So, when are you coming down to South Carolina to visit?

[Bubba Ho-Tep]

llinois banned free blacks from moving into the state.

And yet their numbers increased by about 40% between 1850 and 1860.