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To: Atlantic Bridge
"The politicians in Germany and France desperately waited for a chance to leave their old servant role playing in transatlantic relations behind and such behavior of Americans and Guantanamo gave them the cause and possibility to do it."

Yes, they decided long ago they'd much rather be whores for Russian natural gas (Schroeder) and pan-Arab terrorism (Chirac). Such people are scum, I don't care what country they are from or how many people support them, they deserve only contempt. Actually, I seem to recall that both Chirac and Schroeder ended up rather widely despised in their own societies, too.

If enough Europeans cannot grasp their own security vulnerabilities, or if they think they are better off kissing up to Putin and to Islamic terrorists, I don't think there's a lot Americans can do about it. I don't doubt the accuracy of your description of changes in outlook among many/most Europeans in recent years, but I do disagree that it is primarily America's fault or problem. What you describe is the outlook of whiny immature adolescents, which is what much of European politics has been for a very long time. Sure, it's easy to take shots at Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld, and plenty of people do so on this side of the Atlantic, too. But you describe the mentality of immature 12 year olds who seem incapable of a rational analysis of genuine threats and vulnerabilities, who think it's better to take potshots at America and snuggle up to Russia than to consider what the European security situation will look like when/if Iran has nuclear weapons and missiles capable of easily reaching all of Europe. If 'sophisticated' Europeans think their security situation is improved by Iranian nukes and no ballistic missile defense, then there's just one word for such an outlook: stupidity.
18 posted on 11/01/2007 5:17:11 AM PDT by Enchante (Democrat terror-fighting motto: "BLEAT - CHEAT - RETREAT - DEFEAT")
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To: Enchante; Atlantic Bridge

Enchante,
I found Atlantic Bridge’s comments very interesting and I very much appreciate his sharing of the European perspective. His observations seem to confirm my view that for sometime Europe has wished to insulate themselves from reality with a blanket of socialism, pacifism and America bashing. The situation worsened rapidly after the immediate threat of the USSR disappeared. Over the short run, it’s much more comfortable to be against America than to dirty ones hands dealing with the world’s real problems.

RedDog#1


26 posted on 11/01/2007 5:49:28 AM PDT by Red Dog #1
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