Genesis, take two

The Globe and Mail ^ | Nov 2, 2007 | Ann McIlroy

[49th]

The chicken egg has been prepped for surgery – a pea-size hole cut in the shell and covered with sticky tape. And now Hans Larsson, a McGill University researcher, removes it from the incubator, places it under a microscope and prepares to operate.

He gently peels off the tape and teases back the membranes that line the shell with tweezers. Through the eyepiece, he can see the tiny dot of a heart, steadily beating. He can also see the bud where he implants a milky bead doused in a protein. He hopes it will coax the embryo to grow a big tail. A dinosaur-like tail.

paleontologist, Prof. Larsson spends a significant portion of his time doing traditional dinosaur hunting, digging fossils as far afield as the Arctic and Africa with jackhammers and pickaxes. But he has long been frustrated with the limitations of studying old bones and what they reveal about the mysteries of evolution.

It was by examining ancient skeletons that paleontologists learned that modern birds, including chickens, descended from dinosaurs and that their relatives include such fierce predators as Tyrannosaurus rex. What fossils don't reveal, though, is how exactly such dramatic anatomical changes first arose. How did teeth the size of bananas turn into beaks? Or mighty tails become wimpy, feathered stumps?

For answers, Prof. Larsson has turned to the burgeoning field of evo-devo – or evolutionary developmental biology – a radical new approach to understanding the past.

It is based on the astonishing discovery that modern animals, including humans, share many of the same body-building genes and that some of these genes have been around for millions of years.

[Coyoteman]

Interesting. Good article.

[freekitty]

So he is growing a giant chicken?

[49th]

somewhat... he’s making chicken embryos express latent genetic traits like dinosaur-like tails. The embryos are all terminated before they would hatch, though the scientist does admit at one point that if he could figure out how to make a chicken embryo develop into a dinosaur (which is apparently theoretically possible, which is what the article is essentially about) he’d probably want to allow one to hatch, at least once.

[freekitty]

I just thought I would inject a little humor.

[Liberty1970]

How did teeth the size of bananas turn into beaks?

There are smart evolutionists, and then there are the not so smart ones. Let's just say this is the first time I've seen an evolutionist claim that beak tissue is descended from teeth.

[BlueDragon]

So he is growing a giant chicken?

Aah, from reading the article a little more closely, it says

He hopes it will coax the embryo to grow a big tail. A dinosaur-like tail.

Now why a guy would want a chicken with a big 'ol giant lizard tail, I have no idea...except;

Maybe they'd be easier to manage than alligators?

If this works, one could open up really bitchin' fried "alligator" tail/fried chicken stand.

It could work(!), as long as one didn't forget to also offer up good biscuits, beans, and coleslaw, too.

[BlueDragon]

don’t forget the honey butter!

[freekitty]

Now you’re talking.

[TigersEye]

More white meat!!!

[LiteKeeper]

YEC INTREP

[DaveLoneRanger]

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I'm not sure if this scientist is playing cook or "pin the tail on the chicken" but overall, this is a disturbing "advancement" in scientific meddling.

Humans share almost 99 per cent of their genes with chimpanzees

It's shocking that inaccuracies like this continue to seep through contemporary and mainstream science articles.

[phrogphlyer]

The third drumstick?

[DaveLoneRanger]

Are you telling me you approve of this mad-scientist meddling?

[TigersEye]

BIG drumstick! Fire up the barbie.

[phrogphlyer]

I’m not sure I want to eat chicken butt.

[RightWhale]

A chicken with a 30 foot tail would be worth paying 50 cents to see at a gas station along Route 66.

[TigersEye]

I prefer pig or cow butt myself but I’m not that picky.

[phrogphlyer]

“Frankenchicken”

[Sola Veritas]

“It’s shocking that inaccuracies like this continue to seep through contemporary and mainstream science articles.”

It is worse when it is done at a university level. I remember taking an intro zoology (freshman level) course while a university student back in the late 70s. The instructor was still using Haeckel’s(sp?) recapitualization theory as “proof” of evolution. Even at that time the theory had long been abandoned. Of course, that recapitualization was shown to be false didn’t invalidate evolution, but it was disturbing that it was still being used as evidence to support evolutionary theory.

[Sir Gawain]

Arise chicken!

[metmom]

Jurassic Park?

[metmom]

Humor is lost on some on FR.

[freekitty]

I know. LOL But we can have fun.

[DouglasKC]

Article word count:

Might = 4
Could = 6
If = 9
May = 9
Probably = 1
Likely = 2
Should = 8
Potential = 2
Possible = 3
Possibility = 1
How = 17
Suspect = 1

[DouglasKC]

somewhat... he’s making chicken embryos express latent genetic traits like dinosaur-like tails.

No, he's not. He's trying, but has so far been unsuccessful according to the article.

[Diamond]

[taxesareforever]

How did dinosaurs turn into chickens?

You think the article is interesting I submit this to you. What came first the chicken or the egg?

[Elsie]

My house shares 99% of it’s construction materials with one of Trump’s mansion; too!

[RightWhale]

You has to recapitulate the diagenesis of the theory too.

[dan1123]

Latent genes are going to be the next theory that goes the way of recapitulation.

[razzle]

“Interesting. Good article.”

Total BS (paleontologists learned that modern birds, including chickens, descended from dinosaurs) they wish it were true, but wishing is not science.

[49th]

They figured this one out last year. It was the egg.

http://www.cnn.com/2006/TECH/science/05/26/chicken.egg/

[taxesareforever]

Therefore the first bird that evolved into what we would call a chicken, probably in prehistoric times, must have first existed as an embryo inside an egg.

Where did the egg come from?

[curiosity]

But if scientists can make chickens look like dinosaurs, what other creatures might they build? What variations on the human form are possible?

Shudder. Sounds like someone wants to make the Island of Dr. Moreau a reality.

[taxesareforever]

Thought so. No answer says it all. Go back to DC.

[Alter Kaker]

Where did the egg come from?

A Red Junglefowl somewhere in South Asia, possibly Gallus gallus spadiceus. Does that answer your question?

[taxesareforever]

A Red Junglefowl somewhere in South Asia, possibly Gallus gallus spadiceus. Does that answer your question?

Where did the Red Junglefowl come from?

[Alter Kaker]

Where did the Red Junglefowl come from?

Ah, now that's a different question. All extant junglefowl are descended from primitive junglefowl which emerged as the genus Gallus in Eastern Europe in the Pleistocene; they're all members of the pheasant family.

We can go back up the evolutionary ladder to prokaryotes if you'd like, but I think I've answer your "chicken and egg" question.

[taxesareforever]

but I think I've answer your "chicken and egg" question.

So easy to state that the egg came from the junglefowl but it gets extremely difficult (impossible) to backtrack that egg all the way back to....to....what?

[Alter Kaker]

So easy to state that the egg came from the junglefowl but it gets extremely difficult (impossible) to backtrack that egg all the way back to....to....what?

I'm not sure what your point is. You taking issue with common descent? The junglefowl, like all organisms everywhere on earth, descends from a phylogenetic tree going back nearly 4 billion years.

[B-Chan]

[Constantine XIII]

I like where you're going with this!

[Constantine XIII]

What’s that supposed to mean? :p

[taxesareforever]

The junglefowl, like all organisms everywhere on earth, descends from a phylogenetic tree going back nearly 4 billion years.

Okay. Now we got the egg coming from a junglefowl which came from a tree. Where did the tree come from?

[Alter Kaker]

Now we got the egg coming from a junglefowl which came from a tree.

It's a metaphorical tree.

Where did the tree come from?

The tree is a function of speciation and extinction.

[freekitty]

LOL

[DouglasKC]

It means that the article is very long on speculation, supposition and opinion and very short on scientific achievement or progress.

[Caesar Soze]

Okay. Now we got the egg coming from a junglefowl which came from a tree. Where did the tree come from?

It came from the Tree of Life website, of course. Here is their page on genus Gallus, just in case you really do want to trace it back to the prokaryotes. And here is a page written from an Intelligent Design perspective, if you'd rather read that. I endeavor to present both sides of an argument when real debate exists.

[taxesareforever]

The tree is a function of speciation and extinction.

So, the tree became an egg and then went extinct? Still doesn't explain where the tree came from.