Waterboarding Is Torture, Says Ex-Navy Instructor (SERE)

The Washington Post ^ | Nov 9, 2007 | Josh White

[Seruzawa]

Sure are a lot of amrchair heroes around here.

[George W. Bush]

Except water boarding and the water torture used by the Sovs are two completely different things as anyone who bothers to learn a single fact rather then mindlessly cling to knee jerk emotion based Neo isolationists dogmas knows full well

They are the same thing.

Since you're disputing the writer's assertion that waterboarding is torture and he is a military man who has experienced it, can you tell which branch of the military or intel services you served in and how many times you have experienced waterboarding?

Merely reading and parroting the pro-torture ninnies (none of them military men) about the benevolent practice of waterboarding while munching Doritos in front of a computer running Windows Millennium in your mom's basement doesn't count.

Me, I listen to people like this guy who has experienced it and to people like McCain and others in the military who oppose its use. Our military has very little use for this notion of torture and they consider it detrimental to our own armed forces and a danger to our own troops from the fear that we are legitimizing its use.

[safeasthebanks]

I completely agree. I especially see this (leftist) logic used when arguing, wrongly of course, against cap. punishment.

[arderkrag]

Tell me you wouldn’t pull the guy’s parts off to save your kid(s). Or, more importantly, tell *them* you wouldn’t do whatever was necessary to keep them safe.

I have told them. They agree with me. Quite a few conservatives do, as a matter of fact.

[MNJohnnie]

I know, never bother you with the facts. As usual, your mind was all ready made up before the topic was even posted

[scottdeus12]

“Frankly, I’m in favor of the car battery to testicles approach.”

Brutal....

[arderkrag]

Hmmm...maybe try questioning them without causing harm to them?

[casino66]

Google the instructor’s name. I won’t list all of the articles here, but one might find that this guy has an agenda. He seems to be very “progressive”.

[PLMerite]

“Sure are a lot of amrchair heroes around here.”

And *your* answer to my question in Post 112 is?

[scottdeus12]

“Hmmm...maybe try questioning them without causing harm to them?”

Okay, with all due respect FRiend...you ARE kidding, right? I can’t believe I’m having this debate with a Freeper....

[MrB]

OK, describe the “lasting harm” that waterboarding causes.

I think we’ve hit on it.

This is the defining question on your position.

Answer.

[chrisser]

I'm curious. Is it possible to train an individual to control their response rendering this technique ineffective?

As I understand it, there is only a minor physical restriction on breathing - what makes the technique effective is the body's excessive response to the situation. Control your response and you gain effective immunity to this particular act.

[BritExPatInFla]

Meh, What does he know?

[/sarc]

[varyouga]

Here's some real torture that usually ends in death:

As soon as the terrorists stop doing this or blowing people up, we'll be happy to stop interrogating them.

Until then, we'll use whatever is necessary.

Proper water boarding does not allow water to enter the lungs. It simulates drowning and the 'torture' is all psychological. There is almost no chance of injury.

If this 'torture' stops even one innocent person from being killed or injured, it's worth it.

[arderkrag]

No, They’r based on the principles of freedom and standing by your principles even when it makes a war harder to fight. My arguments are not based on emotion, thanks.

[George W. Bush]

The head native officer questioned him for two days.

Not an American officer or enlisted man or intel operative. Vietnamese military policy was their own concern.

For us to have done the same thing would have legitimized torture by the VC against our POWs like John McCain.

No, it's a bad idea. A terrible policy. And it's our soldiers and diplomats and non-uniformed intel operatives who are most likely to pay the price for it.

[gridlock]

Raising the bar to "threatening our common existance as a country" eliminates defending anything short of a massive nuclear attack.

There are a lot of things short of massive nuclear attack that threaten the existance of the country. The British burned the White House in the War of 1812 without nuclear weapons.

But that is beside the point.

The point was that people were advocating the use of torture to prevent the killing of innocent people, rather than for the preservation of the nation. I was just pointing out that if we go down that road, there is going to be a heck of a lot of torturing going on.

Please note that this response does not presuppose that waterboarding is torture.

[arderkrag]

The point is not whether it causes “lasting harm”. It’s whether it causes pain at all.

[MrB]

My understanding is that’s what the R in SERE training is about - Resistance.

However, they say the toughest sumb*tch of Al Qaeda made it a record of 3 minutes or some such.

Yes, it can be resisted, but it is ultimately effective, and no lasting harm is done.

[Joe 6-pack]

"...can you tell which branch of the military or intel services you served in and how many times you have experienced waterboarding?"

I have it on good authority that this sort of thing used to take place at Valley Forge Military Academy among high school age students who took it upon themselves to enforce the honor code...

Some fraternities even use it (or at least used to) in their hazing rituals. I'm not justifying it's use under those circumstances, and it is a terrifying experience, but keep in mind, it's the terrorists who made the conscious decision to ply their trade in terror.