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Here's what Gordon Brown is surrendering by signing EU treaty[UK]
Daily Mail ^ | 14 Dec 2007 | Christopher Booker

Posted on 12/16/2007 11:20:57 AM PST by BGHater

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To: Atlantic Bridge

“The EU gives me open boarders, a common currency and the right to vote i.e. in other European countries if I have my residence there.”

But why does the EU have to involve itself in domestic issues of the member states like abortion and immigration?

Why can’t the EU simply be an economic entity that protects against free trade from outside the bloc, why does it have to be a political union?

The over zealous regulations over domestic issues is what makes Americans wonder why Continental Europeans think the EU is a good thing. An economic union makes more sense in the view of Americans.


41 posted on 12/22/2007 1:33:22 PM PST by GOPGuide
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To: hanamizu

I thought the Ukraine had something akin to an “amicus” vote, but not a recognized independent vote. I’ll have to go back to my history books to check on that.


42 posted on 12/22/2007 3:57:25 PM PST by ought-six
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To: ought-six

When I was a kid (in the 50s) we’d sometimes get sets of flags of UN nations. They included the flags of Ukraine and Byelorussia—as I recall, they looked like the USSR flag with some kind of design on the bottom or side. When I asked why “Russia” got three votes and we only got one, the teacher’s reply was something like “because it is so big”. In high school I was told that Stalin insisted on extra votes as a price for the USSR’s joining the UN—he felt that his side would lose every vote. Remember, this happened before most of the ‘third world’ were independent and had seats in the UN.


43 posted on 12/22/2007 4:14:29 PM PST by hanamizu
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To: GOPGuide
Why can’t the EU simply be an economic entity that protects against free trade from outside the bloc, why does it have to be a political union?

Why should the EU restrict itself to economic issues without any need? I have no problem with the fact that my own nation, Germany, will loose many of its responsibilities to Europe. The old national model is somehow outdated. The national boarders do not reflect the internal coherence of the people. I am living in southern Germany. My neighbors in Austria, Switzerland or France are ethnically much closer to me than someone from Berlin i.e.. Half of my family is living in France. Beside of that I speak fluent French, German and a little bit English (Hehe! - Latin does not count here ;) ). People from Alsace-Lorraine are for sure as important for me than the people from the Uckermark, the area in north-east Germany where chancellor Merkel is coming from.

A European Union just reflects the realities. It is rather a problem that some political dinosaurs fail to give up their national power.

The over zealous regulations over domestic issues is what makes Americans wonder why Continental Europeans think the EU is a good thing.

What Americans might not know is that the inconsistent and overdrawn national regulations are usually the problem. My mother i.e. owns a small factory for sanding blocks. She is exporting to all European countries. We saved trunkloads of money after the idiotic national laws for import were replaced by European legislation. Common European rules are a basement for success.

But why does the EU have to involve itself in domestic issues of the member states like abortion and immigration?

Even with such issues like abortion or immigration it does not make any sense to solve them on a national base in Europe.

If abortion i.e. is banned in Germany after a certain point in time (12th week after start of pregnancy), a woman who want to get rid of her baby simply has to catch a train for the Netherlands. They make it anytime (by law until the 22nd week - practically...) and anywhere. This does not make any sense to me.

Isn't it better to kick out illegal immigrants on the boarders of the EU instead of giving them the possibility to utilize the differences of European national laws?

We Europeans need to be better organized than in the past. The ridicolous national concepts are outdated and not sustainable. Therefore we need the European Union. It is indispensable. The points were discussion is badly needed are the future legitimation of the EU (European parliament etc.) and the values that it shall stand for.

44 posted on 12/22/2007 9:07:24 PM PST by Atlantic Bridge (Avoid boring people!)
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To: my_pointy_head_is_sharp
The EU as a direct counterpart to the US:

Nope. Being a political or military superpower is neither effective nor desirable for us Europeans. Why? It would require huge investments into defense if we should enable us to project power. You Americans have to spend billions and bazillions and last but not least thousands of American lives for maintaining your superpower status. Projecting power means lots of conflicts in areas far from our real interest zones. We Europeans can live with a defense that is suitable for our continental needs.

In economical regard the EU is already a superpower. The US has a GDP (purchasing power parity) of $13.06 trillion (2006 est.)and a real growth rate of 2.9% (2006 est.) while the European Union as a whole has a GDP of $13.08 trillion (2006 est.)and a real growth rate of 3.2% (2006 est.) (source: CIA-factbook). That means we already have a slightly bigger economy in Europe than in the US. Nevertheless much has to be done. We have i.e. great differences in per capita income among member states (from $7,000 to $69,000). Therefore you will feel our main efforts rather in our own backyard than in animosity with the US.

P.S.

This American blahblah about Eurabia is quite ridicolous from our side of the big pond. Most muslims in Europe are social underdogs with practically no education. They are simply far too dumb and for sure not enough to build up a "caliphate". 3.7% of the German population are Muslims from Turkey i.e.. If they should try they would loose their welfare check immediately. As far as I know you Americans have also your problems with your minorities. Maybe you remember the L.A. riots in 1992. The damage and the blood toll there was higher than the one in the recent riots in Paris i.e..

45 posted on 12/22/2007 10:11:36 PM PST by Atlantic Bridge (Avoid boring people!)
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