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To: harpseal; TexasCowboy; AAABEST; Travis McGee; Squantos; Shooter 2.5; wku man; SLB; ...
Hey, gang -- it's Friday's Fight Thread!

Click the Gadsden flag for pro-gun resources!

21 posted on 12/21/2007 12:35:24 PM PST by Joe Brower (Sheep have three speeds: "graze", "stampede" and "cower".)
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To: Joe Brower

I gotta go by some popcorn......be back later !


27 posted on 12/21/2007 1:25:45 PM PST by Squantos (Be polite. Be professional. But, have a plan to kill everyone you meet. ©)
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To: Joe Brower

Gun Owners Get Stabbed In The Back
— Veterans Disarmament Act on its way to the President

Gun Owners of America E-Mail Alert
8001 Forbes Place, Suite 102, Springfield, VA 22151
Phone: 703-321-8585 / FAX: 703-321-8408
http://www.gunowners.org/ordergoamem.htm


“To me, this is the best Christmas present I could ever receive” —
Rep. Carolyn McCarthy (D-NY), CBS News, December 20, 2007


Thursday, December 20, 2007

Gun Owners of America and its supporters took a knife in the back
yesterday, as Senator Chuck Schumer (D-NY) out-smarted his
congressional opposition into agreeing on a so-called “compromise” on
HR 2640 — a bill which now goes to the President’s desk.

The bill — known as the Veterans Disarmament Act to its opponents —
is being praised by the National Rifle Association and the Brady
Campaign.

The Brady Bunch crowed “Victory! U.S. Congress Strengthens Brady
Background Check System.” The NRA stated that last minute changes to
the McCarthy bill made a “good bill even better [and that] the end
product is a win for American gun owners.”

But Gun Owners of America has issued public statements decrying this
legislation.

The core of the bill’s problems is section 101(c)(1)(C), which makes
you a “prohibited person” on the basis of a “medical finding of
disability,” so long as a veteran had an “opportunity” for some sort
of “hearing” before some “lawful authority” (other than a court).
Presumably, this “lawful authority” could even be the psychiatrist
himself.

Note that unlike with an accused murderer, the hearing doesn’t have
to occur. The “lawful authority” doesn’t have to be unbiased. The
veteran is not necessarily entitled to an attorney — much less an
attorney financed by the government.

So what do the proponents have to say about this?

ARGUMENT: The Veterans Disarmament Act creates new avenues for
prohibited persons to seek restoration of their gun rights.

ANSWER: What the bill does is to lock in — statutorily — huge
numbers of additional law-abiding Americans who will now be denied
the right to own a firearm.

And then it “graciously” allows these newly disarmed Americans to
spend tens of thousands of dollars for a long-shot chance to regain
the gun rights this very bill takes away from them.

More to the point, what minimal gains were granted by the “right
hand” are taken away by the “left.” Section 105 provides a process
for some Americans diagnosed with so-called mental disabilities to
get their rights restored in the state where they live. But then, in
subsection (a)(2), the bill stipulates that such relief may occur
only if “the person will not be likely to act in a manner dangerous
to public safety and that the GRANTING OF THE RELIEF WOULD NOT BE
CONTRARY TO THE PUBLIC INTEREST.” (Emphasis added.)

Um, doesn’t this language sound similar to those state codes (like
California’s) that have “may issue” concealed carry laws — where
citizens “technically” have the right to carry, but state law only
says that sheriffs MAY ISSUE them a permit to carry? When given such
leeway, those sheriffs usually don’t grant the permits!

Prediction: liberal states — the same states that took these
people’s rights away — will treat almost every person who has been
illegitimately denied as a danger to society and claim that granting
relief would be “contrary to the public interest.”

Let’s make one thing clear: the efforts begun during the Clinton
Presidency to disarm battle-scarred veterans — promoted by the Brady
Anti-Gun Campaign — is illegal and morally reprehensible.

But section 101(c)(1)(C) of HR 2640 would rubber-stamp those illegal
actions. Over 140,000 law-abiding veterans would be statutorily
barred from possessing firearms.

True, they can hire a lawyer and beg the agency that took their
rights away to voluntarily give them back. But the agency doesn’t
have to do anything but sit on its hands. And, after 365 days of
inaction, guess what happens? The newly disarmed veteran can spend
thousands of additional dollars to sue. And, as the plaintiff, the
wrongly disarmed veteran has the burden of proof.

Language proposed by GOA would have automatically restored a
veteran’s gun rights if the agency sat on its hands for a year.
Unfortunately, the GOA amendment was not included.

The Veterans Disarmament Act passed the Senate and the House
yesterday — both times WITHOUT A RECORDED VOTE. That is, the bill
passed by Unanimous Consent, and was then transmitted to the White
House.

Long-time GOA activists will remember that a similar “compromise”
deal helped the original Brady Law get passed. In 1993, there were
only two or three senators on the floor of that chamber who used a
Unanimous Consent agreement (with no recorded vote) to send the Brady
bill to President Clinton — at a time when most legislators had
already left town for their Thanksgiving Break.

Gun owners can go to http://www.gunowners.org/news/nws9402.htm to
read about how this betrayal occurred 14 years ago.

With your help, Gun Owners of America has done a yeoman’s job of
fighting gun control over the years, considering the limited
resources that we have. Together, we were able to buck the Brady
Campaign/NRA coalition in 1999 (after the Columbine massacre) and
were able to defeat the gun control that was proposed in the wake of
that shooting.

Yesterday, we were not so lucky. But we are not going to go away.
GOA wants to repeal the gun-free zones that disarm law-abiding
Americans and repeal the other gun restrictions that are on the
books. That is the answer to Virginia Tech. Unfortunately, the
House and Senate chose the path of imposing more gun control.

So our appeal to you is this — please help us to grow this coming
year. Please help us to get more members and activists. If you add
$10 to your membership renewal this year, we can reach new gun owners
in the mail and tell them about GOA.

Please urge your friends to join GOA... and, at the very least, make
sure they sign up for our free e-mail alerts so that we can mobilize
more gun owners than ever before!


47 posted on 12/21/2007 2:43:20 PM PST by blackie (Be Well~Be Armed~Be Safe~Molon Labe!)
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To: Joe Brower

Joe, this is from OFF an Oregon gun rights organization:

HR 2640, The NRA’s Latest “Victory.”
“We commend the United States Congress for its action today to strengthen the Brady background check system.”

Those were the words of Paul Helmke the President of the Brady gun ban group. The action to which he was referring, as you no doubt know, was the passage of HR 2640, in lighting moves with no debate and no recorded votes.

Both the US Senate and the US House passed this bill on December 19th under “unanimous consent” agreements. That means it was not even discussed. In order for this to happen, the leadership of both parties had to agree to allow it.

We are not surprised politicians would push more gun control with no accountability. But what is greatly troubling is that the National Rifle Association was the primary force behind this latest attack on gun rights.

The NRA’s spin machine is operating at full capacity praising the passage of a bill written by the most anti-gun members of Congress.

The bill expands and extends the failed Brady background check system, a gun registration scheme which has cost thousands of qualified people the ability to purchase a firearm.

It is amazing the NRA would revive a bill that was going nowhere just to give more power to the people who are denying legitimate purchases now.

You will recall the NRA supported the original Brady Bill because they approved of background checks for gun buys. That a “pro-gun” organization could support prior restraint of a right is bad enough, but now, years after this system has been in place, the NRA joins forces with an organization that has raised millions to strip Americans of their Second Amendment right in order to expand this dangerous law.

The NRA has insisted that this bill, rammed though when they hoped no one was watching, is going to benefit gun owners. On their website, the NRA uses the following quote to prove what a great deal this is for gun owners:
“Provides that if a person applies for relief from disabilities and the agency fails to act on the application within a year­for any reason, including lack of funds­the applicant can seek immediate review of his application in federal court.”

A year? A person who applies for relief has to wait a year before they can demand that some action be taken? That’s a mighty long time to wait for the right to have a firearm ...especially if you need one. Oh, and then they get to go to court, to “seek” review. At their own expense of course.

Aside from the fact that the enemies of gun rights are crowing about this “victory” the biggest problem,(lost in NRA’s extensive justification for what CBS News called the first major new gun control bill in more than a decade,) is a simple reality the NRA refuses to acknowledge.

This bill turns over more power and more information to the very agencies which have used existing law to deny the rights of Americans or make it impossibly expensive to exercise those rights.

In Oregon, countless qualified buyers are denied purchases because of the intentional obstruction of government agencies who maintain these records. But it is even worse than that.

The original Brady Bill allowed for an end to the mandatory waiting periods when the availability of records allowed for an “instant” background check. We have long since passed that point, but for far too many people the background check is anything but “instant” stretching to weeks and months for many. How can the NRA and its apologists believe that the abysmal record keeping (or the outright obstruction of some agencies) is going to improve by handing these bureaucracies more power and personal information?

The NRA, in an article entitled “Clearing The Air On The Instant Check Bill “ said the following:

“In the late 1990s, gun buyers often experienced ridiculous delays while NICS sorted through cases of mistaken identity or incomplete police records. Many purchasers were wrongly denied and forced to go through a cumbersome appeals process. At the same time, state officials testified before Congress about woefully incomplete records they provide to NICS—a problem confirmed in recent reports by the U.S. Department of Justice”

Well someone needs to alert these guardians of our gun rights, that nothing’s changed. And now we are well passed the 1990’s. Gun owners are still being delayed and denied and still face cumbersome appeals processes. If you are delayed without cause, it’s your tough luck. The so called “safeguards” built into the law are meaningless and ignored. Sure, the law says if you don’t get an approval within three days, a firearms transfer may take place, but just try it.

Now NRA wants to solve the problems they created with Brady by giving us more of the same. They are telling us that the government bureaucrats will now be using accurate records, we should all be thankful and this is a great step forward.

In the world of gun rights, “good intentions” don’t cut it . As poorly kept and abused as the records of criminal behavior are, at least crimes are generally easy to quantify. “Mental illness” is far less black and white. You will recall the Bush efforts to screen the entire US population for “mental illness.”

The NRA has joined forces with politicians and organizations who have declared their intention to end gun ownership in this country. They have rammed through legislation that requires that more records be handed over to people who have proven they cannot be trusted with them. They have asked that gun owners believe that the same people who defunded the process to allow people to get their gun rights back under the current law won’t defund the lengthy process to get your rights back under this new law.

If you believe that more records in the hands of more government operators is a good idea, you may want to think about the first act of the Clintons when they took over the White House. The FBI record scandal proved beyond any doubt how unscrupulous and criminal political operatives can bypass the law to ruin people’s lives.

In an alert title “Outrage of the Week” the NRA has invited readers to share their “weekly outrage.”
They say “If you see something that you feel would be a good candidate for the “Outrage of the Week!” section, please send it to: freedomsvoice@nrahq.org.”

We think the sneaky passage of NRA/Schumer/McCarthy bill more than qualifies.

Copyright © 2000 - 2007, Oregon Firearms Federation. All Rights Reserved.


108 posted on 12/22/2007 12:14:47 PM PST by blackie (Be Well~Be Armed~Be Safe~Molon Labe!)
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