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To: livius

It’s kind of a shame. Given the advances in mathematics, etc that occurred in the Middle East, it’s a shame that Islam has pretty much squashed the advance of that society.

Just think where they might be had Islam experienced a reformation similar to that of Christianity.


12 posted on 01/04/2008 5:42:34 AM PST by Slapshot68
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To: Slapshot68

yup. It is unlikely that a reform would ever take place in Islam.


19 posted on 01/04/2008 5:52:13 AM PST by brwnsuga (Proud, Black, Conservative!!!)
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To: Slapshot68

Actually, Catholic Christianity was very interested in philosophy and science, and just before Islam invaded Spain, Southern Spain was the one bright spot in the Dark Ages. St. Isidore of Seville published his huge compendium of “all human knowledge,” including the work of Aristotle and Classical scientists and philosophers, only decades before the Muslim invasion.

For various reasons, Southern Spain had not been thoroughly conquered in the barbarian invasions. The invaders were Germanic tribes that were mostly Arian Christians. They were similar to Muslims in their rejection of the Trinity and hence, of created nature, and as they spread across Europe, the effect of Arianism and other variants that followed it destroyed much of European/ME Christian culture and unity, particularly among the Byzantine churches. This in turn was one of the factors that made it much easier for Islam to pick up momentum.

The problem with Islam is that it can’t be “reformed.” Reform means that the essence of something is good and all you have to do is get back to that essence; the problem with Islam is that its essence is evil, and in fact Islamic “reform” movements are actually those that seek to root out any moderation or reason and go back to the purity of the vicious, superstitious theocratic political system dreamed up by Mohammed.


28 posted on 01/04/2008 6:04:18 AM PST by livius
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To: Slapshot68
“Just think where they might be had Islam experienced a reformation similar to that of Christianity.”

Islam is undergoing its reformation NOW! However, that’s not a good thing. A reformation restores the faith to its core values, and islam’s values are evil. The last 400 years of relative peace with these people were an anomaly; they have always been at war with us, and always will be; until either they or we are destroyed.

41 posted on 01/04/2008 6:40:45 AM PST by ROLF of the HILL COUNTRY ( Terrorism is a symptom, ISLAM IS THE DISEASE!)
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To: Slapshot68

Such a reformation would not be possible, as Islam today is the same as the Islam of Mohammed: designed to offer three choices: convert, submit (dhimmitude) or die. The only reformation is conversion, which is a death sentence.


47 posted on 01/04/2008 6:53:03 AM PST by jagusafr ("Bugs, Mr. Rico! Zillions of 'em!" - Robert Heinlein)
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To: Slapshot68; livius; brwnsuga
"Just think where they might be had Islam experienced a reformation similar to that of Christianity."

I've got to disagree with you there, Slapshot. "Reformation" is what Islam is going through right now, in the form of --- get ready for it --- radical Wahhabism.

Wahhabism is Islamic Puritanism. That's fascinatingly explained in this article from H.W. Crocker in Crisis magazine.

Wahhabism (radical Reformation) calls for scriptural literalism pristinely sheltered from reason or logic; strict moralism and the extirpation of all "impure" elements, conflation of Church and State on the basis of Cuius regio, eius religio (Church of England, Church of Sweden, Church of whatever-German-prince); et-freakin-cetera.

Islam --- religious falsehood--- doesn't need a Reformation. It needs to be replaced by religious truth.


http://www.crisismagazine.com/julaug2006/feature1.htm
73 posted on 01/04/2008 9:28:49 AM PST by Mrs. Don-o (Mammalia Primatia Hominidae Homo sapiens. Still working on the "sapiens" part.)
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To: Slapshot68
It’s kind of a shame. Given the advances in mathematics, etc that occurred in the Middle East, it’s a shame that Islam has pretty much squashed the advance of that society.

It really is. Islam holds them captive and blocks the way for advancement and progress, leaving them stuck in the 7th century. If only the Arabs had been Christian....imagine how much nicer the world would be today.
98 posted on 01/05/2008 10:17:36 AM PST by G8 Diplomat (Creatures are divided into 6 kingdoms: Animalia, Plantae, Fungi, Monera, Protista, & Saudi Arabia)
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