Posted on 01/09/2008 5:26:37 PM PST by Lancey Howard
CAMP LEJEUNE, N.C. — Two Marines involved in a shooting that killed as many as 19 Afghan civilians testified Wednesday that their unit was responding to an ambush so intense that the crossfire took out tree branches as their convoy of Humvees fled from the scene.
"You could see branches falling across the road ... all along our route," said Sgt. Benjamin Baker. "We were taking semiautomatic small arms fire all along this road."
Baker's testimony followed that of Sgt. Brett Hayes, who told the administrative panel investigating the conduct of two officers involved in the shooting that the convoy was fired upon at least three times after it was attacked by a car bomb.
Hayes said the blast knocked a gunner in his vehicle out of the turret. The gunner returned to his position and began firing, shouting that he was taking small arms fire from both sides of the road near a bridge over a dry riverbed. Hayes said he heard fire from AK-47 rifles and cracks of the bullets passing overhead.
"I'm 100 percent sure we were taking fire," Hayes said. "And I'm sure we had to kill some guys who were shooting at us."
(Excerpt) Read more at chron.com ...
The media ghoul desperately seeking an Afghan version of “Haditha-Blackwater-trigger-happy-massacre”.
Please ping your list.
This is amazing - - these two Marines, Sgt. Benjamin Baker and Sgt. Brett Hayes, TOTALLY contradict Travers.
As far as I am concerned, any civilians around an enemy ambush are part of the enemy and get what they deserve. I don’t see how an innocent cannot be aware of those that are choosing to ambush US troops.
This is amazing - - these two Marines, Sgt. Benjamin Baker and Sgt. Brett Hayes, TOTALLY contradict Travers.
These two Marines, Sgt. Benjamin Baker and Sgt. Brett Hayes, TOTALLY contradict Travers.
It is a known tactic of terrorists to shield themselves with civilians, especially women and children, while they shoot at Americans in populated areas. It is nearly impossible to return fire in an ambush without bystanders getting hit. That’s why terrorists do it.
The instinct in an ambush is to return fire as quickly as possible and kill the SOBs without getting killed first. Returning fire is already a disadvantage as targets are not well identified.
If I were a soldier in this conflict I’d already be in jail for a very long time.
I have asserted I suspect the Marines are lying because their story doesn't make sense, and because the Army guys doing the initial investigation ARE good guys.
It's starting to look like I had a better picture than you had. Sorry to give you the bad news, but yes, it does look like the Marine convoy was in a battle all the way down the road. Maybe this will shut your stinking Army "good guys" up.
It’s too bad we have freedom of the press, yet no freedom of speech for the rest of us and especially our troops. These presstitutes can lie, twist the truth, do whatever they can to help the enemy, and the taliban and alquaida are the enemy, along with the american presstitutes.
You are absolutely right. Arabs use women, children and the elderly as shields to protect their sorry butts. I’ve read, fighting these people are like hitting the pillsbury dough boy, they are all air and little fight, unless they use these innocents and helpless to protect themselves, then they run to the leftists media and cry that these poor innocents were MURDERED by the awful American military. These terrorists and the leftist give me a pain in the arse. The media for the most part are no more brave than the terrorists who use innocents. They’re a bunch of wimps, girly boys.
I never doubt the good guys.
Thanks for the ping.
After reading this and reading earlier that Travers said he came to question why were in this war I don’t believe I have to tell you who I believe. I’m also looking forward to seeing the findings of the IG that is investigating LtGen Kearney.
Oh, I see McCain’s getting his way on this one
By the way, Mr Rogers, do you think these two Marines, Sgt. Benjamin Baker and Sgt. Brett Hayes, are lying under oath, or do you think maybe your "walks-on-water", Army commander Dad-of-the-year has a selfish agenda of his own?
But the gunner in the Humvee carrying Travers insisted the Marines who fired, killing as many as 19 Afghan civilians, should be commended for defending the unit.
"We do not shoot for the hell of it," said Staff Sgt. Jose Queiro. "It was controlled fire."
Travers and Queiro were called during the first day of testimony at a rarely used fact-finding proceeding that is investigating the conduct of two officers involved.
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/ap/nation/5438469.html
I know SOME of the Marines on the convoy testified that they were in an ambush extending the entire distance. I also know that SOME of the Marines on the convoy testified that they were not.
The investigation found plenty of evidence of Marines shooting. Evidence of others shooting back was...less overwhelming.
My skepticism remains. No unit before or since has encountered anything like that along that road. The Taliban have shown no ability or desire to engage in a fight like that along that road, immediately next to the largest FOB in that part of Afghanistan.
Could the Marines be innocent? Of course, and I hope they are. Is their story unusual? Damn straight it is. Does it pass the smell test? Nope. Have special forces ever screwed up before because their training didn’t match the fight they found themselves in? Yep.
THAT is why there is an inquiry - not because a bunch of mean PC paper-pushing Army guys are ganging up on the poor Marines. And if I have to choose who to trust, I’ll trust Col Nicholson. Sorry, but I’ve met plenty of Marines who will lie - an assessment my daughter and son-in-law (both Marines) would agree with.
Hell, there’s enough Marine whining on these threads to embarrass anybody. Why can’t y’all let the facts fall where they may - or is that what you fear will happen?
I am not backing this story because they are Marines. If it was a team of Rangers I would be saying the same thing......I believe in the judgment of those who are in the way of danger.
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