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To: Mr. Jeeves

Good points. The strong traditional families of medieval times had a lot more in common with today’s Muslim families than with today’s Western families. Family members with power often exploited other family members, especially the females, quite ruthlessly.


51 posted on 02/25/2008 2:00:30 PM PST by Sherman Logan
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To: Sherman Logan

Henry the 8th marrying his sister to every monarch in sight, and daughter’s potential marriages to all sorts ...


96 posted on 02/25/2008 3:18:55 PM PST by tbw2 (Science fiction with real science - "Humanity's Edge" - on amazon.com)
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To: Sherman Logan

“The strong traditional families of medieval times had a lot more in common with today’s Muslim families than with today’s Western families. Family members with power often exploited other family members, especially the females, quite ruthlessly.”

Perhaps the real “decline” could be attributed to the “rise of women’s freedom”?

By that, I mean the ability to choose paths in life _other than_ motherhood?

I contend that for eons, women lived the childbearing life primarily because they had no other choice but to live it. The babies came whether they were desired or not, because until recent times, there were few reliable technical methods to STOP them from being conceived. Nature’s way.

But not any more. As Loretta Lynn wrote back in the sixties:

You wined me and dined me
When I was your girl
Promised if I’d be your wife
You’d show me the world
But all I’ve seen of this old world
Is a bed and a doctor bill
I’m tearin’ down your brooder house
‘Cause now I’ve got the pill

All these years I’ve stayed at home
While you had all your fun
And every year thats gone by
Another babys come
There’s a gonna be some changes made
Right here on nursery hill
You’ve set this chicken your last time
‘Cause now I’ve got the pill

This old maternity dress I’ve got
Is goin’ in the garbage
The clothes I’m wearin’ from now on
Won’t take up so much yardage
Miniskirts, hot pants and a few little fancy frills
Yeah I’m makin’ up for all those years
Since I’ve got the pill

I’m tired of all your crowin’
How you and your hens play
While holdin’ a couple in my arms
Another’s on the way
This chicken’s done tore up her nest
And I’m ready to make a deal
And ya can’t afford to turn it down
‘Cause you know I’ve got the pill

This incubator is overused
Because you’ve kept it filled
The feelin’ good comes easy now
Since I’ve got the pill

From time to time, I see thoughtful comments about how the West is becoming “feminized”, and thus, weaker. All it takes is to look at an ascendant culture - that being, Islam - to see the truths in such comments.

There’s no use saying it’s wrong or right, because I doubt that there’s any way to change things back to where they used to be, other than somehow “taking womens’ freedom away” again. Doesn’t seem possible, nor desirable.

What is, is. What will be, will be.

- John


289 posted on 02/27/2008 7:18:10 AM PST by Fishrrman
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