Toyota Prius proves a gas guzzler in a race with the BMW 520d

TimesOnline ^ | 3/16/08

[Charles Martel]

I’ll take a BMW any day. Just wish the parts weren’t so expensive in the U. S.

I recently test-drove the new 135i with the 6-speed manual transmission. What a fine piece of hardware for making the trees get all blurry. :-)

[HamiltonJay]

Are you crazy? If you think deisels cost a lot for spare parts, you have never owned a gasoline engine. A plug in car is fine for commuter driving, low range, no issues with long recharges. However the hybrid stuff is just a joke.

A second engine, combined with the batteries etc, is more costly and environmentally unfriendly to produce. Diesel is a far better option for MPG and environmental friendliness than any of the hybrids.

I have no issue with a true plug in car, if they can get one out that can go 300-400 miles on a single charge at 75 mph and recharge fully in 5-10 minutes.. and not be the size of a shoebox. When they do that they’ll be more than a niche vehicle.

The hybrid nonsense is just that. Even if you wanted to go hybrid, diesel electric hybrid engines are far more efficient than any gasoline hybrid can be. More BTU per gallon in the fuel, and higher compression ratios of deisel mean better fuel economy, period. There is a reason Diesel does the heavy lifting.

[dfwgator]

Hybrids - Further proof that PT Barnum was right!

[Cronos]

Nope, not crazy -- you did READ what I said? I said Diesels are only really worth it if you drive more than 60 to 75 miles per day — as they cost a lot in spare parts. Any lesser than that, they’re not as cost-effective. -- Diesel parts are comparatively more expensive than gasoline engine parts.

If you drive only about 20 miles a day then it's not worth it having a diesel. If you drive more than 60~75, yeah, it is worth it -- any more than that and a diesel is much, much more wallet-friendly.

I didn't say anything about hybrids at all -- I'm just comparing a plain gasoline engine with a plain diesel engine

Finally, the plug-in cars, as I said, are GREAT for city driving. If your commute consists of just bumper to bumper traffic of 30 miles each way, then yes, an electric car is worth it. If you want a vehicle that goes on the interstate and takes you from Boston to NY, then no, an electric car does not make sense.

Maintenance on a diesel is generally less complex, but more frequent. A diesel should have an oil change every 5,000kms and an oil filter every 10,000kms. A typical petrol will require an oil change at 10,000kms with the filter at 20,000kms, and sparkplugs are usually required along with the filter change. Major service items like diesel injectors, fuel pump etc typically require servicing every 100,000kms. Other maintenance items like transmission oil, air filters etc... are independent of engine type and have the same service interval.

If you do your own lube and oil changes, a diesel will generally work out cheaper but more frequent. If you pay for your minor services, the higher frequency of the diesel services will generally cost more than the less frequent but more costly petrol services. This is a generalisation and will differ for different makes and models.

The design parameters of a diesel engine result in it having a longer life between rebuilds. Generally, a diesel will run up some 350,000 kms before requiring a rebuild (provided it has been well maintained) whereas a petrol may require a rebuild at 250,000 kms. While a diesel may take longer between rebuilds, a petrol is cheaper to overhaul so in the long run it works out about even if you plan on using it a lot.


Finally -- all of what I said is about diesel engines NOW -- I do agree that diesel technology is improving significantly and soon, maybe in the next couple of years, diesels will make far more economical sense than petrols for any user except formula 1 drivers.