the HBO documentary is by far the best out there
Posted on 04/19/2008 4:02:19 PM PDT by FReepaholic
NEAR WACO - 15-years-ago Saturday, a huge fire ended a 51-day stand-off near Waco.
It all took place at the Branch Davidian Compound.
The standoff started with a government investigation into illegal possession of firearms and explosives.
The Feds tried to enter the compound and were met with gunfire. By the end of the day, the compound was burned to the ground.
80 people were killed, including 22 children and four ATF agents.
All the lazy reporter has to do is look up the relevant facts on Wikipedia, but no.
Can you elaborate on what is inaccurate about it?
That, too, was about males (or at least one male, Koresh) using religious pretexts in order to acquire sexual access to multiple females.
No it wasn't! It was a ATF raid not a CPS raid. They were modifying guns and reselling them. After the botched raid went bad, Reno stated that they had a meth lab (false) then they found someone who was underage and had sex with Koresh. It appears that Texans like to repeat history every 15 years. Wonder if CPS will adopt the ATF stance of killing the children for the sake of the children?
Or maybe just as accurately that too was about the government overstepping it authority.
This statement is inaccurate:
...The Feds tried to enter the compound and were met with gunfire. By the end of the day, the compound was burned to the ground...
The author is confusing the initial BATF assault on the church with the final FBI assault that resulted in the fire.
Crappy reporting.
I should’ve been clearer: I wasn’t speaking of the reason for the raid itself. I meant that the existence of that cult stemmed from Koresh’s libido and his desire for controlling others, especially women, just as the existence of the FLDS cult stems from the libidinous desires of the males who first began it and who today perpetuate it.
Okay. "The standoff started with a government investigation into illegal possession of firearms and explosives."
In actuality the standoff was a carefully timed creation of the BATF. The BATF decided to make headlines with multiple arrests just as a Congressional committee held hearings to determine the BATF budget.
Koresh regularly drove into Waco. He could have been arrested easily, but that would not make headlines. Over 80 people were killed to pump up the resumes of BATF agents.
the HBO documentary is by far the best out there
"Child abuse" factored into the case against the BDs - a go-to favorite excuse for the nanny state and is always a hit with the public. Still used to this day.
Yep. And don't forget this was in the aftermath of the Ruby Ridge "incident". The feds had a black eye and needed to repair their image. They knew they could count on the media to portray a strange isolated religious cult as some kind of monsters and the government agents as heros.
“Koresh regularly drove into Waco.”
As did Randy Weaver the year before, up in Idaho. Like you say, no headlines in a quiet arrest.
And the two huge metal front doors to the place just happened to mysteriously disappear that proved that all gunfire was ingoing not outgoing!!!
The warrant for the raid covers all sorts of neat stuff like aluminum powder and so on that had to do with the grenade business.
I'd say the Davidians, as a group, were nuts. The ATF, as a group, was too political for its own good ~ and clearly too PC. They gave multiround firing weapons to women who could barely deal with the weight to say nothing of the recoil.
Everything went downhill from that point on although the chief planner of the debacle got promoted.
That's not quite how you are supposed to handle such situations if you care about the kiddies.
Waco was like yesterday to me. I spent quite a bit of my time researching everthing that I could on this incident. There is a lot of history on this on the internet if anyone wants to really find out what ACTUALLY happened.
And 4 of the agents that went into the upstairs all were shot in the exact same location in the back of the head turned out to be (all of them) prior Clinton bodyguards/security guards during his Governorship as I remember.
I had that material in hand before the FBI, et al, got involved in end point activities.
The FBI knew the building was full of highly combustible materials that would burn at very high temperatures and cause lots of damage.
Or, maybe BATF never shared their affidavit with the FBI ~ that point's never been made clear by later investigators, and certainly not by BATF.
“Everything went downhill from that point on although the chief planner of the debacle got promoted. “
Lol, are you referring to Wesley Clark that became the Supreme Commander under Clinton?
Not quite. I think one of the guys wounded had duty with/near Clinton earlier. Lots of LEOs in the DC offices get supplemental assignments with Secret Service all the time. Friend of mine was attached to the Secret Service when they came to town with hundreds of tractors to demonstrate against farm prices. Otherwise, he was just a DC cop.
No, a guy named Potter. Clark was just an NG guy with spare rolling stock.
A squad of Marines was tried for supposed war crimes at Haditha. The media wanted it.
Kill the enemy - bad. Kill weirdo Christians - good.
HMMMMMMM, for some reason I thought they listed the names of the four somewhere in the Clinton bodycount, but I may be mistaken.
From Ethernet.com:
Steve Willis, Robert Williams, Todd McKeahan & Conway LeBleu: Died Feburary 28, 1993 by gunfire at Waco. All four were examined by a pathologist and died from identical wounds to the left temple. All four had been body guards for Bill Clinton, three while campaigning for President and when he was Governor of Arkansas.They also were the ONLY 4 BATF agents killed at Waco.
Correction: Etherzone.com (Clinton Bodycount)
One of the problems we have at the moment is that 100% of the archived stories at the MSM are not readily available after all these years. You have to pay money to get them.
The Feds tried to enterassaulted the compound and were met with gunfire.
That is what I describe as what happen.
lol didn’t see that too
No, you were perfectly clear in your own muddle-headed way.
"I meant that the existence of that cult stemmed from Koresh's libido..."
Ahh, so you think Koresh started the Davidians for his own harem, huh?
'Splain for me how he did that, cuz my math skills just aren't too sharp. Davidians established 1935...Koresh born 1959.....damn.
I'm really stumped here, Snarky One, help me out...and I ain't gonna buy that reincarnation thing.
You must select the other spelling to get to any news articles.
If I didn't have other stuff to worry about I'd suggest that someone has artifully tricked out Google.com to provide misleading information.
If you figure out how they did it, let me know. We can try it on some other stuff ~ maybe how Richard Nixon lost his job.
His branch...he was drawn to it because it gave him the freedom of action that he craved. That’s my reading of his psychology, anyway...
Nothing to do with Ruby Ridge
At the end of 1992 the fecal matter was beginning to hit the rotary impeller about the 1992 Good O' Boy Roundup
The BAFT needed a distraction ASAP - definitely before the budget came up
But you’re correct to point out that I’m not conversant with the details of that cult. What I know of Koresh I picked up from news reports and bits here and there years ago. When a man who has a strong personality starts to dominate the people close to him, and then that domination takes the form of demanding sex from women, even the wives of other men, it’s pretty clear what’s going on, in my view.
He got promoted elsewhere and kept his mouth shut about it.
Must mean someone higher up was there too.
The original Body Count file had the names if I recall correctly.
Or so it was allegged. The BATF would not let anyone else, not even the defense experts examine the weapons in question. They never produced any that had been sold, the ones they did produced were damaged in the fire, and were only allowed to be examined while in heavy, but more or less clear, plastic sleeves. Yah you can really tell if a gun has been illegally modified that way. Only BATF experts testified that guns had been modified. And we *know* they lie and are coached to lie by their superiors, especialy when it comes to machine guns, so that 's not exactly credible with many folks.
Lots of good info from a very credible source, Dave Kopel
THE UNWARRANTED WARRANT: THE WACO SEARCH WARRANT AND THE DECLINE OF THE FOURTH AMENDMENT
Kopel sat at the counsel table for Respondent "Heller" during the recent oral arguments in the case before the US Supreme Court.
Koresh also went jogging three times a week and could easily have been picked up while out on a trot.
Actually, only one door disappeared - the one with all the incoming bullet holes fired by the trigger-happy ATF agents on February 28.
The first shots fired were ATF killing the Branch Davidian dogs. It is still unclear who fired first on human targets, ATF or Davidians.
There were also sexual harassment charges filed by female ATF agents.
Thank you for the reminder.
I didn’t read your links, but I have family who were in the vacinity.
They didn’t like what the ‘Toons, and Miz Reno did at all.
I say “they”, because I listened to the radio at the time.
Those folks were ticked off to the max!
We, as a nation, murdered innocents.
Most, myself included, cheered on Apr 19 1993, as the compound burned. We thought what we had been told by Dan Rather and his ilk, as they were fed the story by the .gov, was true.
We were wrong.
We helped kill children.
That is not forgivable.
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